My advice is to split the passing threads into two distinct threads: "Be harsh and tell it like it is!" and "Compliments, please!".

Separate threads would clarify posters' intentions and ease responders' internal conflict between being cheerleading and being "honest".

Quote from: Mia Jennell (Gwynne) on April 18, 2014, 01:40:41 PM
My advice is to split the passing threads into two distinct threads: "Be harsh and tell it like it is!" and "Compliments, please!".

Separate threads would clarify posters' intentions and ease responders' internal conflict between being cheerleading and being "honest".

I think the You Look Fabulous thread is for compliments only.

Quote from: Tori on April 18, 2014, 02:13:36 PM
I think the You Look Fabulous thread is for compliments only.

Good point, but it tends to be where more experienced transitioners post.

I certainly shy from the do I pass thread. I do not post in it. Have occasionally got a few good tips in there tough from the bravery of others.

I do enjoy being told I look fab from time to time, and the before and after thread is inspirational gold.

Dunno how many photo threads we really need.

is there really a need to tell someone hypothetically whether they're going to look female or not. I don't know to base your transition on someone else's guess is kind of questionable. If your all ready on HRT I guess it would be nice to get some objective opinion to whether your progressing or not.

Quote from: stephaniec on April 18, 2014, 04:43:30 PM
is there really a need to tell someone hypothetically whether they're going to look female or not. I don't know to base your transition on someone else's guess is kind of questionable. If your all ready on HRT I guess it would be nice to get some objective opinion to whether your progressing or not.

I agree. I find the "passing" aspect of the passing threads very frustrating.

Asking for advice is one thing. Asking people to foretell the future is another.

I've never posted in the "Do I Pass?" thread, and only once in the 'You Look Fabulous", but the "Before and After" several times, simply because my change has been gigantic and I've wanted new girls to see what's possible. I know I pass without a doubt, but don't know how I did in the beginning, even though I've been told I did. Passing is a package deal, though. You have to pass in the way you think, behave, speak, walk and pretty much everything else. Men and women are like two different species, with little in common. The proof is in real life and that's it. i worry about girls thinking they pass when they don't. God bless, Mira

Quote from: Miranda Catherine on April 19, 2014, 02:54:22 AM
I've never posted in the "Do I Pass?" thread, and only once in the 'You Look Fabulous", but the "Before and After" several times, simply because my change has been gigantic and I've wanted new girls to see what's possible. I know I pass without a doubt, but don't know how I did in the beginning, even though I've been told I did. Passing is a package deal, though. You have to pass in the way you think, behave, speak, walk and pretty much everything else. Men and women are like two different species, with little in common. The proof is in real life and that's it. i worry about girls thinking they pass when they don't. God bless, Mira

True dat!!! All of it!

I don't see an issue with the thread, to be honest. As long as everyone keeps the criticism constructive then it should be fine. Telling someone they are hideous and should never go out due to fear of being beat up is not my way of doing things.

If you for whatever reason are THAT concerned then just send the person a private message and explain your "thoughts" to them. I don't believe in humiliation but I do believe in positivity and the saying that everyone is beautiful in their own way. Let's face it, MOST people who post in the "can I pass" thread are already insecure enough as it is and are looking for some words of encouragement to boost their morale or whatever. Again, you can be honest with someone without being completely cruel about it. The world is mean enough we should be able to come together on here and uplift one another in a positive way, not scare each other even more. What is "passable" to some may not be for others and this ridiculous idea that some of us should look a "certain" way is pure foolishness.

So yes.....you can give honest criticism that isn't cruel, it's all in how you say it. I tell most people on here that they look great because I mean it and not because I'm trying to fill their head with delusions of grandeur.

Quote from: Mia Jennell (Gwynne) on April 18, 2014, 05:12:09 PM
I agree. I find the "passing" aspect of the passing threads very frustrating.

Asking for advice is one thing. Asking people to foretell the future is another.

Kia Ora MJ(G)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZbKHDPPrrc&feature=kp

Metta Anatta

I had a whole other repsonses but I deleted it, and I'll just say get rid of the Do I Pass thread its very harmful, and keep the others. Why is it harmful? Well, if someone gets 100 comments about how well they passed in ONE pic, and maybe they did, now they might go out on top of the world and get called ->-bleeped-<-, be stared at, or just be treated like crap. Now, they vanish, stop posting and waste their whole life. I would call that bad and I would bet it has happened. Oh you look so great. They go out. Get hit with the reality stick and whammo, no more hormones. But hey, if they stuck with it for 18 months, they woulda pass and reached the dream. So, I consider it harmful, but that's just me and I'm on top of the fraking world right now...

I was just telling my BF today about how my life sucks in many ways but no matter what, I achieved my dreams this last year, and that wasn't easy nor does it not count for anything. He's been there through my whole transtion bascially and prolly wouldn't (no def wouldn't have had sex with me then) but yesterday he sure made me moan with all nine and half inches of himself all up in me. He tossed me around like a rag doll. Dream achieved. Bang. Sorry UI had to say that. Yum. MOOOOANNNN. HMM./

I haven't had time to read all 6 pages of responses so may be repeating what someone else said.

I think that people are often too worried about hurting feelings to give an honest response & that can be a negative if someone is told they pass & then get clocked as soon as they step outdoors.

Maybe the solution is to have 2 "Do I pass" threads, 1 for honest answers & 1 for ego stroking nice answers 

Quote from: Tori on April 17, 2014, 02:48:36 PM
You post at your own risk, even on a support site.

Imagine being a woman over 25 and hearing some of the things said around here about us from time to time.

The internets can take some thick skin to handle, just like real life.

If you only wish to confirm your own beliefs, do not ask anyone else questions.

This. If you wish to post and know you can handle it then cool. I cant handle it. I would crack. I posted in a thread like that once and wouldnt dare look at the response. Go at ur own risk. Know yourself.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on April 19, 2014, 07:43:20 PM
Well, if someone gets 100 comments about how well they passed in ONE pic, and maybe they did, now they might go out on top of the world and get called ->-bleeped-<-, be stared at, or just be treated like crap. Now, they vanish, stop posting and waste their whole life. I would call that bad and I would bet it has happened. Oh you look so great. They go out. Get hit with the reality stick and whammo, no more hormones. But hey, if they stuck with it for 18 months, they woulda pass and reached the dream.

I think this is a great point.  There is a certain relief that comes with self acceptance, followed by nervous excitement as you start to venture out into the world.  But with a couple of bad experiences, it would be very easy to revert to hiding our true selves -- something most of us did for a very long time.

This is one reason I generally don't agree with the "passing doesn't matter" crowd.  Most of us want desperately to blend in and be perceived as our desired gender.  For some people it works to ignore societal conventions and just be yourself.  But for most of us, we have a lot of work to do to find ourselves -- or more appropriately, to lose our old selves.

Quote from: Jayne on April 19, 2014, 08:03:41 PM
I haven't had time to read all 6 pages of responses so may be repeating what someone else said.

I think that people are often too worried about hurting feelings to give an honest response & that can be a negative if someone is told they pass & then get clocked as soon as they step outdoors.

Maybe the solution is to have 2 "Do I pass" threads, 1 for honest answers & 1 for ego stroking nice answers 

We have those.



They are already pinned, and u look fab.

I hate explaining your jokes.

As for me, though I enjoy reading them and seeing the photos I tend not to post too much on the "Do I Pass" threads. I just have a bad habit of being bluntly honest and am afraid of hurting any feelings. In addition I agree with another poster who pointed out that in most photo's we only see faces. To truly give an honest opinion we need to see a full body shot. And here's why I say this:
      I've passed for the last 5 years everywhere I go even before hrt, however I know the reason I pass so well is because of my feminine body shape & tiny build (though my bewbs are helping now too I know, lol). I certainly don't pass because of my face. Though I have long straight black hair, a small oval face and a narrow chin my nose is way too big, my eyebrows are too close to my eyesockets, there's my scars from my accident on my left jawline which, like the rest of my face is too angular. So, if I were to post a head/shoulder shot in one of the "Do I Pass" threads and receive comments like:  "oh you go girl," "I think you pass very well," "Oh your all girl honey," etc., etc. (you get the idea), I'd know those of you who  posted those kind words were just being polite and didn't want to hurt my feelings.

I've only been on a full transition dose of hrt for 3 months, and almost 3 weeks. And, while it's quite possible my hrt may yet fill my face in a little and make it more feminine looking (I certainly hope and pray it does) at this point in my transition there's no point in my posting headshots asking if I pass, even though I do pass every day but again, I know I pass because of my body, and how I carry myself rather than how my face looks.

I'm going to post photo's in the "Before and After" thread and change my Avatar to a photo after my 6 month mark on hrt just so those of you who've read my posts know who your talking to. But to post photo's in the "Do I Pass" threads for me would be in a sense, useless because I already know I do pass. And on a rare whim if I did post photo's in those threads they'd be full body shots, not just headshots, and hopefully you girls would give me honest opinions so I'd know how to improve my look.

As for do I  think the "Do I Pass" threads are harmful? -Certainly not. I think it would do a disservice to this site to remove them. I say this because some of us girls do post honest opinions with suggestions on how/where improvements can be made which may help a lot of girls. We're all different in how we see and perceive things.

Ally

Quote from: Allyda on April 20, 2014, 03:18:43 PM
As for me, though I enjoy reading them and seeing the photos I tend not to post too much on the "Do I Pass" threads. I just have a bad habit of being bluntly honest and am afraid of hurting any feelings. In addition I agree with another poster who pointed out that in most photo's we only see faces. To truly give an honest opinion we need to see a full body shot. And here's why I say this:
      I've passed for the last 5 years everywhere I go even before hrt, however I know the reason I pass so well is because of my feminine body shape & tiny build (though my bewbs are helping now too I know, lol). I certainly don't pass because of my face. Though I have long straight black hair, a small oval face and a narrow chin my nose is way too big, my eyebrows are too close to my eyesockets, there's my scars from my accident on my left jawline which, like the rest of my face is too angular. So, if I were to post a head/shoulder shot in one of the "Do I Pass" threads and receive comments like:  "oh you go girl," "I think you pass very well," "Oh your all girl honey," etc., etc. (you get the idea), I'd know those of you who  posted those kind words were just being polite and didn't want to hurt my feelings.

I've only been on a full transition dose of hrt for 3 months, and almost 3 weeks. And, while it's quite possible my hrt may yet fill my face in a little and make it more feminine looking (I certainly hope and pray it does) at this point in my transition there's no point in my posting headshots asking if I pass, even though I do pass every day but again, I know I pass because of my body, and how I carry myself rather than how my face looks.

I'm going to post photo's in the "Before and After" thread and change my Avatar to a photo after my 6 month mark on hrt just so those of you who've read my posts know who your talking to. But to post photo's in the "Do I Pass" threads for me would be in a sense, useless because I already know I do pass. And on a rare whim if I did post photo's in those threads they'd be full body shots, not just headshots, and hopefully you girls would give me honest opinions so I'd know how to improve my look.

As for do I  think the "Do I Pass" threads are harmful? -Certainly not. I think it would do a disservice to this site to remove them. I say this because some of us girls do post honest opinions with suggestions on how/where improvements can be made which may help a lot of girls. We're all different in how we see and perceive things.

Ally

We have the opposite predicament. I have a feminine face that will be great for HRT and yet I have a not-so-feminine build. Yet you have the feminine build and the, in your opinion, not as passable face

That is true. The pass thread just focuses on your face but body also makes a big difference. And you can't see the proportions right in pics. I think it is a lot more of a challenge to pass if you have a large body probably. But if you have a small body and especially a small head as well then people won't notice some coarse facial features too much.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on April 19, 2014, 07:43:20 PM
I had a whole other repsonses but I deleted it, and I'll just say get rid of the Do I Pass thread its very harmful, and keep the others. Why is it harmful? Well, if someone gets 100 comments about how well they passed in ONE pic, and maybe they did, now they might go out on top of the world and get called ->-bleeped-<-, be stared at, or just be treated like crap. Now, they vanish, stop posting and waste their whole life. I would call that bad and I would bet it has happened. Oh you look so great. They go out. Get hit with the reality stick and whammo, no more hormones. But hey, if they stuck with it for 18 months, they woulda pass and reached the dream. So, I consider it harmful, but that's just me and I'm on top of the fraking world right now...

while what you say at the top can be true, it doesn't have to be either.  As you know, I kind of had that sort of situation and it hurt really badly for someone as fragile as me to go through that, but I survived.  Ultimately, I'm not going to let some jerks control my life, even those I have done just that for so long and still do to a degree.  I guess if you can't survive that one moment, then you may not survive transitioning either.  It was lesson for me that day and it made me do a lot of soul searching after I absorbed the pain and got through my own self abuse.  It's something that taught me that I will get to where I want to be, but maybe I'm not there yet despite hearing from people in life and on here that I "can" pass.  Doesn't mean I won't get there in time even if I do feel hopeless a lot of the time.  Plus, you never know how someone else is going to take or view things.  we see things differenlty and through our own lens.  I don't feel I come close to passing, yet I believe all the positive comments I was getting on all my pics were truthful even if they sided on the positive aspect of things. Perspective differs from person to person and there is only so much to judge from a photo. 

I guess that while there is potential harm that can happen and people should be honest with a compassionate angle, that doesn't mean that these threads are at fault.  People should know there is more to this than being viewed on a forum.  And honestly, that confidence boast was a good thing for someone like me who figuratively sees a monster when looking at myself.  While I may cry about my body issues and appearance, to know that there are a lot of people out there that see it differently makes me feel a little more hopeful.  That hope and the inspiration from others can be a very big positive thing.   For some, these sort of before and after like threads help them decide that transition is actually possible and not a fantasy.  Why erase the good because of the potential that some may read too much into things?  there are pros and cons, but I think removing the thread would be a poor choice. 

If you want the honest to god truth about if you pass or not, get out of the house and live your life. We're all supportive here, sure, but strangers that you interact with just doing your day to day things are one of the best indicators you could have. be confidant in who you are and be true to yourself. That's all anyone could ever really ask for.