I don't foresee an endo prescribing you or helping you get hormones because you feel your face is not masculine enough. 

I'm not that versed in hormone levels and causes for them to feel comfortable to say with any certainty.  There may be a large number of reasons for high levels that I am not aware of or have missed.  As such, I definitely suggest you ask and discuss the questions you have with the endo, who has a medical degree and specialized training specific to hormones and hormone levels.


From what I do know however, common reasons for high hormone levels are 1)the hormones are being produced at a very high rate, either naturally or due to some abnormal cause that is causing the glands to work excessively in producing the hormone. 2) normal range of production with a low receptivity of the hormone.  As the body isn't highly receptive to the hormone, it accumulates and sits leading to a high concentration floating around waiting to be received, discarded or converted to something else.

The same goes for the reverse with low levels.  1) Producing the hormones at a much lower rate, or 2) being very receptive to hormone that hormone levels in the blood tend to be on the lower end.

A person can be highly receptive to hormones naturally, or have a naturally low receptivity.  There are a literally a number of other reasons that can account for hormone levels though.  And beyond that, any relationship or connection between the two would be much better answered by the endo on this.

You should also be cautious and carefully consider, and discuss fully what steroids or androgens you should take.  As many androgens will eventually convert into estrogen if they don't bind, if you are naturally less receptive to them, taking steroids could have a feminizing effect rather than a masculinizing effect.  I offer this not to discourage you, but rather to point out a possible risk and allow you to better discuss with your endo and make an informed decision.

Quote from: wheat thins are delicious on April 23, 2014, 11:32:33 AM
I don't foresee an endo prescribing you or helping you get hormones because you feel your face is not masculine enough. 

Possibly not.  But that's not exactly why we've suggested he sees the endo.  He has concerns about himself and his hormone levels, which an endo can address and answer.  If there is a treatable reason, the endo will be able to help, and if there isn't, he'll at least have the answers as to what is going on.  Only an endo can say for sure and give as much help as is possible. 

Quote from: wheat thins are delicious on April 23, 2014, 11:32:33 AM
I don't foresee an endo prescribing you or helping you get hormones because you feel your face is not masculine enough.

Given that testosterone has risks, I'd guess you're right. It's unlikely if there is NOTHING else going on. I am guessing there may be, but I might be wrong. If there are other factors, a doctor might do it just because a condition exists. But getting in the door, you need to have something else going on.

It's unlikely an ethical plastic surgeon (they aren't all so ethical) will do plastic surgery on what is a normal male face either.

Changing haircuts and dress is cheap and easy.

Self acceptance is difficult but in the end it is the most powerful thing.

--Jay

Quote from: aleon515 on April 23, 2014, 02:25:58 PMIt's unlikely an ethical plastic surgeon (they aren't all so ethical) will do plastic surgery on what is a normal male face either.

I disagree.  Plastic surgeons aren't out there making money on "abnormal" people.  They're making money from people who see something wrong with their features and want to correct it.  If every "normal-looking" person who went to a plastic surgeon was turned away for looking too "normal", then there'd be no work the surgeons. 

Ethical.  An ethetical cosmetic surgeon won't.

The unethical ones will.

Well, If I were a cis guy I would consider going to a plastic surgeon to make my chin look more manly.  It doesn't look girly now, but it's weak and I think most men would rather have a defined chin because it looks nicer.

You don't have to be an unethical plastic surgeon to help someone correct a trait they don't see as attractive as long as it doesn't affect the health or overall well-being of the patient.

Quote from: ZombieDog on April 23, 2014, 08:52:04 PMYou don't have to be an unethical plastic surgeon to help someone correct a trait they don't see as attractive as long as it doesn't affect the health or overall well-being of the patient.

My point exactly.  What does ethics have to do with it?  People plump their lips because they think they're too "thin"; they pump up their boobs because they think they're too "small"; they inject botox into their wrinkled faces because they want to look young.  99% of these people are "normal-looking" to the outside world, but to themselves they have flaws and that's what plastic surgeons take into account - not their own feelings or "ethics" about how the person looks. 

Unless it was something quite severe that a person wanted done, I don't see things like masculinisation surgery to be out of the question or unethical at all.  Implanting demon horns into your head?  Implanting diamonds into the whites of your eyes?  Now that...sure. 

Ethics: Well, perhaps I don't see what you can do with a perfectly normal face to make it more "masculine". If it were a matter of a nose job or something simple, that's one thing. Most plastic surgery is somewhat of a boob job, nose job, and here and there some more serious procedure.

Perhaps I lack the "imagination" of a more imaginative surgeon that could see something there that i don't. I see a normal male, though not super hunkish, face. If someone had to stick silicone "bones" or take off bits of other body parts to construct a new face, I consider that outside the usual type of plastic surgery practice, when perhaps the guy needs therapy. But I could be wrong here. And perhaps "ethics" is the wrong term.

--Jay

If eventually I will take the plastic surgery path this is what I have in mind:

Brow-ridge augmentation + Revision rhinoplasty:




Brow-ridge augmentation + Revision rhinoplasty + Jaw angle implants:

I think your forehead and jaw looks best as it is now.

Quote from: Alexthecat on April 24, 2014, 08:58:47 AM
I think your forehead and jaw looks best as it is now.

I agree. I lot of people look better left alone. But they probably would do what he wants, might cost a small arm and leg, though I don't think literally.

--Jay

Dani,

I think you look good/masculine the way you are right now.  I don't know how young you are, but a person's face continues to masculinize over their lifespan. 

An ethical facial plastic surgeon certainly will do cosmetic work. But they will also consider the mental status of the patient and make sure the patient has realistic expectations. I used to work with some excellent facial plastic surgeons. In addition to their non-cosmetic patients, they had many patients seeking cosmetic work, including men.

Quote from: MacG on April 25, 2014, 12:51:16 PM
An ethical facial plastic surgeon certainly will do cosmetic work. But they will also consider the mental status of the patient and make sure the patient has realistic expectations. I used to work with some excellent facial plastic surgeons. In addition to their non-cosmetic patients, they had many patients seeking cosmetic work, including men.

Yeah I had no idea that he wanted, what I would gather is not a major procedure (would be very painful though). It seems in a typical range of cosmetic work. Even though, well I think he looks "normal" the way he is, but i gather that wouldn't matter.

--Jay

Whether it was intentional or not (yeah right), I feel lied to with this post from a cis male.

IMHO this isn't relevant here at all. What you want is typical cosmetic surgery; you want some off the shelf ideal. If you want this, see a plastic surgeon. It's not FTM related. I wouldn't have bothered responding to this if I'd known the real story.

Quote from: Dani20 on April 24, 2014, 07:48:48 AM
Brow-ridge augmentation + Revision rhinoplasty + Jaw angle implants:

Honestly, your "after" brow looks very exaggerated to me, almost unnaturally so. I think your problem may lie not in your appearance, but in your negative perception of yourself. I'd be worried that, much like someone with anorexia or body dysmorphic disorder, you may never be perfectly satisfied with your face no matter how many surgeries you have. It would probably be worthwhile to discuss this with a therapist before you go under the knife again.

Dani, other than your nose, you can get the results you want by building muscle and losing some fat. The only reason your features look "soft" is because you seem to be on the husky side. I'm husky myself, but I like the way I look.

Quote from: BrotherBen on April 26, 2014, 10:14:02 AM
Honestly, your "after" brow looks very exaggerated to me, almost unnaturally so. I think your problem may lie not in your appearance, but in your negative perception of yourself. I'd be worried that, much like someone with anorexia or body dysmorphic disorder, you may never be perfectly satisfied with your face no matter how many surgeries you have. It would probably be worthwhile to discuss this with a therapist before you go under the knife again.

He hasn't had surgery. I think he just used photoshop or sumthin to show what he wanted to get done.

Quote from: Dani20 on April 24, 2014, 07:48:48 AM
If eventually I will take the plastic surgery path this is what I have in mind:

Quote from: Ruthven on April 26, 2014, 09:24:00 PM
He hasn't had surgery. I think he just used photoshop or sumthin to show what he wanted to get done.

Actually he has had a rhinoplasty already if you read early posts from the OP. He is unhappy with the results (his current nose I believe) from the first surgery.

Quote from: Sebryn on April 26, 2014, 09:42:09 PM
Actually he has had a rhinoplasty already if you read early posts from the OP. He is unhappy with the results (his current nose I believe) from the first surgery.

Oh yeah! I forgot about that cuz i read it a few days ago. Thanks for correctin me! Sorry BrotherBen.