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YESON: Seoul from 3/17 to 3/28

Started by Boca.Lisa, February 18, 2014, 01:38:05 PM

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Boca.Lisa

Hi Everyone,

This isnt a voice update as im 45 days post op and still staying pretty quiet.  I have spoken a couple times but my voice seems to remains about the same as it was pre op so im waiting to do the exercizes beginning at day 60 befoin I make another recording.

This message is about a potential complication. While im not 100% sure it's pretty coincidental. Pre op, I was a bit of a gym nut (hate it but hated being a fat blob even more) I used to do 1-2 hours of cardio and low weight supersets daily just to stay in shape. Since getting back, ive noticed my recovery from cardio is very labored. My heartbeat goes up faster and I tend to run out of breath and get dizzy. This happens when I work larger muscle groups or do anything with explosive movements but not when I work smaller muscle groups.

My doctor says it is a classical symptom of oxygen deprivation and I should watch it.

Im hopeful that this is just a temporary issue due to some lingering swelling and and not related to a permanent narrowing of the airway.

Im going to send a message off to Dr. Kim shortly to see what he thinks as well.

Lisa

2009 FFS #1 - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 FFS #2 -Dr. Darin (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 BA and GRS - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2012 Body Work - Dr. Hockstein (Miami, Florida)
2014 VFS - Dr. Kim (Seoul, South Korea)
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MeganChristine


Quote from: Boca.Lisa on May 05, 2014, 10:47:49 AM
Hi Everyone,

This isnt a voice update as im 45 days post op and still staying pretty quiet.  I have spoken a couple times but my voice seems to remains about the same as it was pre op so im waiting to do the exercizes beginning at day 60 befoin I make another recording.

This message is about a potential complication. While im not 100% sure it's pretty coincidental. Pre op, I was a bit of a gym nut (hate it but hated being a fat blob even more) I used to do 1-2 hours of cardio and low weight supersets daily just to stay in shape. Since getting back, ive noticed my recovery from cardio is very labored. My heartbeat goes up faster and I tend to run out of breath and get dizzy. This happens when I work larger muscle groups or do anything with explosive movements but not when I work smaller muscle groups.

My doctor says it is a classical symptom of oxygen deprivation and I should watch it.

Im hopeful that this is just a temporary issue due to some lingering swelling and and not related to a permanent narrowing of the airway.

Im going to send a message off to Dr. Kim shortly to see what he thinks as well.

Lisa

I really hope you get a good answer in this subject as it could affect me too.

I too am a cardio idiot, and if this problem occurred due to the narrowing of the vocal folds, I might be reconsidering the whole procedure o.O Been fighting the weight since the SRS, it's a reason why cats become fat and lazy after being neutered :P

- MegC
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anjaq

Lisa, I would encourage you to still do recordings now. You don't have to post them, keep them for yourself for now if you feel uncomfortable with them, but they may be helpful in documenting your progress for yourself and maybe later for others too. It may be that your voice actually did change and you just do not notice it tha tmuch without doing a recording and comparing it side by side to pre op. maybe others will notice more of a change than you do.

45 days seems a long time to stay quiet. I expected something like 30 days from the previous reports but I guess it may be up to 60 days where you are supposed not to say too much generally, right?

The lowered airflow is something I was actually warned about by those questioning my idea to go for a VFS. I was told the same by someone I talked to who was at Yesons in December, thats 5 months ago and she said it does not affect her sports abilities but it is noticeable - for her it seems to mostly be noticed when singing (breathing is fast). The airways are of course constricted and I guess for sports, the body will have to get used to the different situation. The airflow should not be less than in any other female, but your body if it is really well trained may be used to getting ait in faster. I can imagine some of that will go away during healing but some of it may require you to breathe differently when doing sports? Thats an interesting question - how do female athletes manage - after all they are running marathons and such and still are not running out of air despite smaller airways than men, so I cannot imagine that this would be an insoluble problem, more one of how to get used to it and some further healing

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@Diana

Boca, I hope you get better & better and everything's going very well with your voice ..

Quote from: MeganChristine on May 05, 2014, 05:20:18 PMBeen fighting the weight since the SRS, it's a reason why cats become fat and lazy after being neutered :P

this is quite opposite to me .. 2 of my friends who had done SRS in their 30s , all gained weight after post-op ..

for me,i'm quite lucky that i lose 10kg. since I had SRS  .. and i am trying to stay in shape & trying to shed few more kilos as well .. not easy ..  :icon_ballbounce:
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Boca.Lisa

Hi Everyone,

Ok so here is my most recent recording. I'm 52 days post op. I'm quite uncertain if its much better but I also understand I need to start vocal exercises in one week.

I can say my voice still gets a bit tired so still being very careful.

http://vocaroo.com/i/s07uQYiSL4Js

I had posted boy voice and pre op trained voice samples earlier in this thread if anyone's interested.

Thoughts and comments are welcome.
2009 FFS #1 - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 FFS #2 -Dr. Darin (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 BA and GRS - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2012 Body Work - Dr. Hockstein (Miami, Florida)
2014 VFS - Dr. Kim (Seoul, South Korea)
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AmyBerlin

Hi Lisa,

congratulations! Even though there appear to be points where your voice still sounds a little frail, it still sounds unmistakably female! All the ugly low frequencies are gone. I'd say, give it another few weeks and you'll be absolutely fine!

Me, I'm only 3 weeks postoperative and will have to wait another week before I can begin to start talking, which I'm much looking forward to after the long silence.

Best wishes for your continuing recovery,

Amy

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Charlotte

Lisa,
You sound absolutely female on the post-op recording. 100% success!  :D
Just one question: what would happen if you tried to talk in your "boy" voice? Is that gone forever?

Hugs

Charlotte
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Ducks

Lisa, you sound great!  I got goosebumps listening - you're voice is beautiful!  My only thought is that there must be something about that rainbow passage but everyone who reads it starts sounding a bit mechanical after a while.  When you're voice is stronger, I'm sure I'll hear the little inflections you are adding, which will keep it from sounding that way.  For 5 weeks post, I think it's great.  I'd pay for that in a heartbeat!
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MeganChristine

#28
What a fantastic voice, Lisa. It fits you SO well. :D

@Charlotte: You wouldn't happen to have 1110 in your nickname?
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Jmtl

Yah! Its very feminine and suits you well.. Im so happy for you lisa! I remember from reading on here, you really didnt talked for quiet some time. Now its paying off!! Congrats! ☺️
"Positive Vibes" :angel: :angel: :D :-*
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Jennygirl

Sounding great Lisa!! Great job!!!

Wooo makes me so happy!

I hope you are happy with it too :)
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Gigi_J

Hey Lisa,

I'm going for my surgery mid-June and I just knooow that with my personality I'm likely to be just as unsure and paranoid about my result..probably a lot more...but having listened to your latest recording..I know it might be hard to hear yourself because being impartial about ourselves is so hard.,..but I really hear a definite improvement with your result...though your pre-op feminine voice was really impressive, your post-op voice really does show a subtle lack of any of that slight masculine/more resonant quality that was present before...there's definitely a smoother quality to your post-op voice so I'd say that's a resounding success. From everything I've read, it seems your ability to use your new upper range may take a bit more time but it will come and I'd be so happy with your result so far..well done!

G
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Roni

As people have asked, is your post-op voice your chest voice, or are you still modifying your pitch a certain way to reach your feminine register? I feel like if this is how you sound without trying, then the surgery is a success. While looking at the yeson surgery, I was thinking to myself that it would be nice if I managed to obtain a higher, more feminine pitch. But as of right now my practiced voice already sounds more than feminine, and having my practiced voice as my chest voice post-op would be a good enough result for me.
On the wild journey to self-discovery. Free yourself.
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Boca.Lisa

Its not my chest voice. Still pulling it up to my head. What ive noticed is the voice is the same as my trained voice with the rough edges (lower tones) removed.
2009 FFS #1 - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 FFS #2 -Dr. Darin (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 BA and GRS - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2012 Body Work - Dr. Hockstein (Miami, Florida)
2014 VFS - Dr. Kim (Seoul, South Korea)
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AmyBerlin

Hi Lisa,

Quote from: Boca.Lisa on June 03, 2014, 05:43:57 PM
Its not my chest voice. Still pulling it up to my head. What ive noticed is the voice is the same as my trained voice with the rough edges (lower tones) removed.

That's what it should be. Plus the likelihood of falling into the lower register is greatly reduced, as the amount of range that lies in that frequency band where that register "speaks" is much smaller postop.

Amy
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anjaq

So as I understand it, the picture is, that post op you loose the ability to do lower notes, involuntarily - as a main speaking pitch as well as "undertones" of your trained voice. This probably means you can relax more and have to do less resonance control as well, but it is not something that just works without any voice training. In some of the cases it seems that the natural "without thinking" pitch is raised, but not in all cases? Possibly it depends on how much you already got used to speak at an elevated pitch as part of your normal speaking pattern. E.g. if I was an A2 before anything and now I have a trained D3 and such a dsurgery would give me a change from A2 to D3 or E3, I would not notice much as I already got used to speak at D3. This is only my speculation now, I dont know what the other's experiences first hand are like.

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Boca.Lisa

I think that assessment is correct.
2009 FFS #1 - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 FFS #2 -Dr. Darin (Bangkok, Thailand)
2010 BA and GRS - Dr. Thiti (Bangkok, Thailand)
2012 Body Work - Dr. Hockstein (Miami, Florida)
2014 VFS - Dr. Kim (Seoul, South Korea)
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Jennygirl

Yeah it seems to me about half of the people (or more) seem to take the full 2 months to muscularly strengthen & relax into the new vocal fold dynamics. There is also a large amount of mind adaptation you must do in order to learn how to "relax" into it on top of the muscular aspect. I mean think about it: you are changing the fundamental physics of your vocal cords- this is something that rarely ever changes abruptly in a person's life. Everything has to change in order to become "good" at using them in their new different state. Just like switching from a tenor saxophone to an alto saxophone (which is one half register higher and has a slightly different embouchure/mouth position). Firstly it will take some time to learn the new embouchure in order to simply make a noise (relaxing), and secondly learning how to get the most musically out of a higher sounding register (adapting style).

As far as my own experience, there was a huge amount of adaptation involved during the part where muscles are changing to the new shape. I was up to the challenge though, whatever it took- I refused to get discouraged by a voice that wasn't acceptable to me. At first I experienced similar feelings with loss of range and worries about how my voice compared to other women. I channeled the stress/anxiety into an ongoing study into how I could make my voice better, and it still goes on today (I am still learning). I think I finally began to really relax about it around the 7-9 month mark, and now I am nearly almost completely relaxed about it (13 months post op). Things haven't changed much, except that I definitely have relaxed and I'm not pushing my voice to be somewhere specific- I just kind of flows in and out of higher and lower pitches. It varies wildly depending on the situation. Sometimes I use a very low voice at 170hz- especially if I have been talking a lot. I am still dealing with how to not tense up after long conversations. On the phone, my voice is much higher pitched ~230hz at times (but still depends on who I am talking to). When I talk to my mom on the phone my voice tenses again and I go down to 170-180hz (I do tend to talk a very long time with her though). It could also be due to the vocal tremor Dr. Kim was able to find with his super slow-mo laryngoscope camera (one side flaps slightly faster than the other making uneven closure). He said botox would help this, but the only injection I have had is a week after the procedure.

Just wanted people to know that I am still working through certain things, and is a constantly evolving process for me. If you don't like the sound of your voice after 2-3 months, you need to focus more on really getting your money's worth and learning to use your new instrument. You can't expect that it is some magical procedure that does all of the work for you, because it doesn't. Yeson just gives you the instrument, you still have to learn how to master it ;) I suspect this could take 2 years or more.
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FalseHybridPrincess

still your voice sounded awesome even at the two months mark if I recall correctly Jenny :p :)
http://falsehybridprincess.tumblr.com/
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Jennygirl

Quote from: FalseHybridPrincess on June 09, 2014, 09:54:16 PM
still your voice sounded awesome even at the two months mark if I recall correctly Jenny :p :)

Thank you :D I was probably about 70-80% there for where I am now, I am very meticulous and relentless when I want to learn something. I probably have severe OCD- luckily it just tends to go towards productive things? Lol..
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