I love her and support her. She's nearly 20 and has been virtually shut in for 5 years. She came out to me as transgender last year. I took it hard and haven't been the most fantastic about it all. We don't refer to her with proper name or pronouns at home because Dad cannot grasp the issue. She does not insist, nor will she share her chosen name with us.
Regardless, I have bought her clothes and driven her to appointments and been a true advocate for her.
Last week we finally got to the doctor that will give her HRT. My girl forgot to bring her therapists letter to the appointment.  Today we had planned to get her blood work done.  She did not get up until after noon and has not contributed to household upkeep without being hounded, threatened and cajoled.
Dad will NOT pay for HRT. It will be more than $50 per month for hormones and nearly $300 per office visit (with insurance). I can barely pay for that. All I have ever asked is to help me keep the house.
She does not drive and I doubt with it all we could afford the car insurance anyway. She has no employment skills and her transition will make it extremely difficult to get a job.
I wish there was some way to get her off her ass to help herself.
I love her and will do what I can.  But at what point do I wash my hands of it? Am I part of her problem?

If she isn't paying anything towards her own transition, the best thing you can do is show her that you can't take care of her forever.  To be honest, I was very much dependent on my family before I started my transition.  Once I started, I realized how much everything costs an the stakes involved if I wanted to make everything come true.  It was either pay for  my transition or don't transition which made me realize what I had to do.  Having a supportive family is a great thing, and I still hae one which helps big time, but you can't do everything for your daughter if she isn't even trying for her self.  Has she tried finding entry work in retail at least?  It's a hard economy out there, but those jobs aren't too competitive and are more suited for entry workers in her age bracket.  It is tough out there, so I wouldn't judge anyone unemployed that is legitmately looking.  In any case, maybe having a truthful heart to heart with her may help her see the reaity of everything.

Yeah it sounds like you are supportive, which is good. But I agree with LTL, sounds like she needs to get out in the world more and you may be inadvertently enabling her to continue on this life of doing nothing with herself.

Maybe she needs a little fire under her butt, and a supportive hand to help her do so (but not too supportive = more enabling). Just be aware that if she does get to a point, you may think "I've created a monster!" when she does become self empowered. I know that is sometimes a hard thing for parents to accept.. letting go can be tough.

I'm no psychologist, so perhaps this is horrible advice. But, it seems to me like you are going to have to strip some of the comforts you provide her away before she will get moving with her life. Right now it is probably quite easy for her to stay home and do nothing. Also hopefully dad can get on board too. Maybe there could be a compromise- as in you could help her with hormones or getting started as long as there is a clear deadline for how long that will last (that way she has incentive).

Definitely a tough one. I hope you find some advice here that is useful

Learningtolive, you make good points. She's been troubled for years. She's made it clear in the past that she cares about nothing.  She's been treated for depression that has stabilized since coming out. She made tremendous progress when she came out, but has since stagnated.
Her state of transition could put off an average employer.  The closest place to catch a bus that could take her to a job is more than 3 miles away. Not being able to drive around here is crippling.  Her anxiety has prevented her from wanting to learn.
I fear that if we don't move quickly to get HRT that male hormones will make her life worse each day. So I consider HRT to be as vital as antidepressants.  I believe GID is often fatal and my responsibility as a loving Mom is to help her get the treatment she needs. But she needs to contribute to the family if only within the home.
Problem is she's an adult and I cannot punish her for misbehaving. I want to cut off the internet as penalty for not contributing,  but Dad is coddling her there. And he gets pissed at me because Im a lousy housekeeper and this makes me a hypocrite.
It pisses me off that I'm in the middle.  All I want to do is give her a foundation to build her life on.
I guess all I can do is vent.

I am not sure if your daughter suffers from the same mentality I had for the longest time, but I used to use money as my ultimate excuse.

What I mean is, I have been poor since a child in varying amounts (from homelessness to almost middle class), but once I became 14 I managed to escape my horrid parents. The thing is, I still didn't push to do anything meaningful to move forward with my life. I mooched off friends and was somewhere between content and horribly depressed for years. The real reason that others didn't know but, I knew, was that I was scared.

All I did was whine about how hard life was and such, because being the victim so to speak was alot easier than actually making that money and confronting the enormous reality of what I had to do to be happy in life. So long as I had no car, I had an excuse to have no job therefore an excuse to have no money, and an excuse to do nothing. On one hand I was trying to protect myself, but I was really killing myself.

A friends parent bought me a car, and another friend got me a job (I had zero initiative to do any of this myself), and I got in a comfortable pattern of stagnation still using my dead end job as an excuse not to move forward at all. I got married, I thought that would make things better, but it didn't make me more motivated to deal with myself. I eventually got to a point where I spent my paycheck on a gun, as that was my plan B. Things really did crash down around me, and only thru the intervention of friends basically prying it out of me, was I able to come to grips with the fact I would rather be happy than dead, and stagnation would only lead to increasing depression.

I really hope your daughter hasn't fallen into the trap I did, of believing that since everything is so hard, it is better to do nothing and care about nothing. That sort of defeat before you even start mentality never leads to anything good. It took me getting to the point of nearly ending it, to actually take control of my life and empower myself to bring about the changes that I needed in order to start this process. It wasn't a straight line, even after that point I went back to stagnation for bits, but my friends always kicked me in the ass when I did, things always got better after a milestone like coming out and always worse after things settled down.

I make good progress now, but I still feel the effects of that stagnation after all I am a high school drop out who is 28 and didn't put forth any real effort till I was 24. I did get my GED, I do have some college classes completed and I make enough money to pay my rent, my car payment, my hormones, etc but if I had actually applied myself when I was 14 the moment I got out of my parents grasp I could be living a much happier life now. You daughter has one huge advantage though, and that is from the sounds of things you are a great mom, not one to hinder her, but one to help her and that is such a powerful thing to have in your life.

Sorry for the wall of text.

Maybe attempt to find a LGBT office or planned parent place that could be cheaper for his appts and I've heard walmart offering super cheap T scripts without insurance(as low as $15 for a 3 month supply) so ask there as well.

As far as things go, maybe use his transition as a way to kind of light that flame? If he's really wanting to move forward and you find the means to cover things cheaply at least with HRT and say some clothing maybe use that as an incentive? "I'll pay for your script IF you do x amount around the house. And if you look for employment, I'll take you to the store to buy some clothes to help pass" and so on. Just little things. Binder could be another incentive.

If he's wanting to become comfortable and move forward in transitioning it might be a good way to get things going ect. Just my two cents.

When I was caught in the grips of gender dysphoria, I simply could not function at all.  I slept all day and drank all night.  I hadn't held down a "real" job in years.  The anxiety and depression were making me reckless and suicidal. 

The thing was that HRT helped me more or less immediately.  I eventually got off of all my psych meds, alcohol and drugs.   I suddenly became a "whole" person instead of this dysfunctional fraction thereof.  I am no longer a "basket case" and my wife can hardly believe my miraculous turnaround.

My guess is that our daughter needs the HRT to make her be able to function at all.   When your estrogen receptors are starving, nothing else will suffice.

We have a great youth and adult LGBT center. Its how we found the dr. to treat her. This dr. Is prescribing a brand name estradiol patch, mostly because of her weight. Being homebound and depressed really is a path to pack on the pounds. We discussed the options for prescriptions and the office visits will be limited.. IF she maintains her health. Another thing I cannot do for her.
She has NOT made any attempt to work on her voice,  if she doesn't try harder to at least try to appear more female, I will have to stop trying, because that would be a signsl to me that she's not taking herself seriously.
I'm not looking for girly girl stuff, but a little more effort. She doesn't even brush her hair most days.
I will have to get tougher.
Geeeze, I have morbidly thought she could be hiding to spare Dad's feelings... waiting until he destroys his health to the grave. (He's denying much of his own health)  hate to tell her the my insurance won't cover transgender treatment if he dies.
Horrible to imagine that but not beyond possible given our family dysfunction.
(I get accused of  being mean or critical when I try to buy healthy foods and refuse to buy their soft drinks.

She sounds deeply depressed. All those details blur together and can be overwhelming for someone struggling with that. It will be very hard for her to develop a good sleep schedule, help clean the house, get (and keep) a job, work on her voice, eat healthier food, and win her dad's approval if she's having difficulty with basic hygiene. Depression is a serious problem. She might also be lazy and overly dependent, but you can't know the real content of her character until she gets adequate treatment (or finds some other way to come out of the funk). I know you can't force her to change, but you can help. You might need to do some scaffolding with tiny steps toward the behavior you would like to see. People who are depressed often need things to be simplified. Instead of working on all of the problems, you can choose one and deal with that, and tell her how much you appreciate her efforts, and how important this is to you. With each change, more change becomes easier and more rewarding.

I know that sounds like coddling, and it is, but it can save a lot of time and grief later. Try to think about how you would treat a much younger child with the same behaviors. People who are depressed sometimes don't function like the adults they are.

That said, as long as she is living in your house rent-free, there is no reason to believe you aren't allowed to make the rules. Most people don't get that kind of free ride. You can be point-blank about your limits on things that matter to you, and the only relevant part of her being an adult is that she can leave if she finds her surroundings too unpleasant.

I think you should be careful with limiting internet time as a punishment. For many people, the internet is the only way they know they're not alone, and socializing online can help a person become confident enough to succeed further in the real world. It can help her figure out who she is and how to be okay with herself.

Felix, you make excellent poibts all around.  The depression has improved considerably.
I am wondering if insisting she attend some time at the local LGBTQ youth center would be appropriate. The few meetings we went to at the adult center were OK, but she needs folks closer to her age. especially to see the kids that have been alienated from their families so she knows how she's been sheltered.
I'm just having a difficult time being Mom vs. Being her friend.

I think spending time at an LGBTQ center would probably be really helpful to both of you. It can be triggering sometimes to be around so much of other peoples' successes and traumas, but I feel like it usually is worth it for the support and information, and for putting things in better context.

Also, when things get really bad, sometimes it helps to take planned, "official" steps toward a better life. If it is on the calendar and not up for debate you don't have to stress too much about it. Even going through the motions can lead quickly to higher tolerance for going out and having social interactions, and when you get to know a group or agency, the interactions can be really positive. Being okay takes practice, and a support group is an open space with low stakes. I think contact with other trans people is crucial, but if she feels strongly about not wanting to go to a group like that, you could find a mental health group or a meetup around an interest or hobby. Doing concrete things that feel like progress is a useful way to stay okay and pointed in the right direction while you try to make actual progress.

I don't want to sound like I'm being too dark (or too lighthearted), but it helps to lower the bar a lot, and then only raise your expectations gradually. You know how most video games start off super easy? They increase in both difficulty and reward as you meet various goals, and most people plateau somewhere short of the top. When a human is struggling with serious depression or other mental illness, they play on hard mode, and we don't see that. We take our successes as a given, or as a result of the kind of hard work and forethought that everyone should put into life. That's not wrong, but you might need to set aside your values and beliefs while your kid is dealing with stuff. You will fall apart if you keep looking at the big picture, especially the ethical aspects. None of this is your fault, or her fault, but guilt and blame will creep in if you aren't careful.

The parent vs friend thing probably dates back to ancient times, and I don't have a shred of advice about it. It's good you are aware of the difficulty with boundaries.

I think your daughter is lucky to have a supportive parent like you. What your daughter is going through sounds a lot like what I was experiencing in my late teens. Complete loss of motivation, depression, poor personal hygiene, just a general feeling of hopelessness. I had some ups and downs through my twenties, but I never moved out of the house, got a job, or really did anything to get my life moving in a significant way. It wasn't until last year, shortly before my 27th birthday, when I finally came out to my parents and started to deal with my issues openly. I wish I could say my parents had been supportive and understanding, but their initial reaction showed such a lack of empathy and understanding that it threw me into a depression that lasted through the first two months of this year, until I was able to start therapy sessions. Things are better now, but acceptance is a slow process, and I've been letting them take things at their own pace.

Quote from: bunnymom on June 23, 2014, 05:41:50 PM
I fear that if we don't move quickly to get HRT that male hormones will make her life worse each day. So I consider HRT to be as vital as antidepressants.  I believe GID is often fatal and my responsibility as a loving Mom is to help her get the treatment she needs.

I cannot stress this enough, male hormones are the most mentally destructive thing to an MTF transgender person that you can imagine. Had I not started low dose hormone therapy when I did (something I did on my own years ago before I really came out to anyone), I very likely would have killed myself by now (or at least tried). That's not to say that HRT is going to make everything better overnight, but I strongly believe that getting your daughter on hormone therapy is a necessary step to getting her better and on the path to recovery from her depression. Once her hormones are in proper balance she should eventually experience a return to normal levels of motivation, and hopefully start doing more things for herself. In the mean time, I think trying to get her more connected and involved in the transgender community is an excellent idea, and hopefully it will help her see that there is light and the end of the tunnel and that being transgender does not have to be something that destroys your life it you don't let it.

Does she have an account here? If not, I would really encourage her to make one, because I think just having a place where I could talk openly about things was an enormous help to me when I was first starting out in this process. And if she ever wants to talk to someone who has been in a similar situation (depression, poor self esteem/hygiene, being a shut in for years, being extremely overweight, etc.) and is on the road to recovery, tell her she can always send me a PM. Because I have been there, I know how horrible it is, and I would be happy to offer any help/advice I can give on how I've been turning things around.

I think there's a lot going on here, and I hate to say it, but I think you or her dad are probably not getting the whole story and might be contributing to smothering her. I mean if she's running away into the internet she probably thinks she can't interact with you here in the real world. I'm not trying to be critical to you, just trying to ask you to really look at yourself and ask if what you're doing is for her or because you want to see yourself as a supportive parent. I know that I used to have a lot of problems and I simply did not tell my parents because I didn't think they'd respect how I felt. I didn't even feel like I deserved to have feelings. And that made everything that much harder, when really I always wanted us to be close and have a loving relationship. Either way, you need to communicate with her more. And her dad probably especially does. Can you guys get family counseling?

Bottom line... you are so focused on the outside problems. They are just coming from problems inside. You can't fix her by telling her to get a job or just to get her ass in gear. She needs to fix the problems inside and find her own motivation to do those things, and chances are that if you take a new approach, you can help her do that.

Your thoughts are all helpful. Today she blew it good. I had hounded her about getting the blood work done yesterday. She stayed in bed until after noon. She assumed I'd take her today along with her laser appointment. 
Well, I suffer from frequent migraine and I got a doozy this morning.  She got up in time, but I couldn't take her. I told her to take a cab, but she needed to bring doctor orders and insurance card.  She said she would wait until next week.  At least she called to reschedule her laser appointment.
She acts incapable of doing anything... or so she demonstrates regularly. She is stressed over money, but cannot and will not do anything to change it. I was able to express the need to contribute around the house so that I have less to worry about when I get off work. I work weekends, leaving the house at 5am and getting home around 5pm, with 2 days off during week. So appointments must be scheduled around my work.
The pattern of avoidance has been going on for over 5 years. We've been going to a counselor for over 12 years. There is no extended family for any outside support. It's just the three of us. We are isolated. Dad and I have different work schedules, the only time off together in 3 years was our trip to Europe last year.
Yet another delay because she's irresponsible.  Not my fault I get sick.

Heya, so errm. I wanna like start my reply with major disclaimers because this is an extremely sensitive topic obviously and I took a while to debate if I should post my advice or not. Because I can very, very, very much familiarise with some of the stuff you've told us about your daughter. From what you've said so far, I've been there too. Recently! And I am young as well (20) dunno how old ya daughter is but I suspect it's around the same age again from what you've said so far. So I feel like what I have to say would really help but.... I'm afraid in my head it's not as polite as those who've posted above. Of course I shall try to be as polite as I can, I also want to mention that you could write a small book and I would still not know the situation as well as you do, you've only told us a little I could very likely be completely wrong. And all that ^^ Sounds like I'm gearing up to blame you, I'm not I don't blame you at all.

Now I have a lot on my mind about the situation so sorry if it seems a bit jumbled or I miss anything out.

But the very first thing I thought after I read all your replies is stop ranting about your daughter and her all her flaws, stop making this about you.
Of course this is very hard for you, of course you are entitled to help as well to deal with all your emotions. But she's still going through a LOT more than you right now, this is her issue, this is about her way more than it is about you. And I hear you speak about how much you want to help her and how much effort you're putting in. But I'm hearing way more of "She sleeps in bed all day and does nothing! I'm going to give up"
Instead of the truth! What you should be thinking in my opinion ---> She sleeps in bed all day because she doesn't want to get up and face the world because thats how ->-bleeped-<- she feels, she feels so bad about what ever that she doesn't want to make an effort towards anything. This is NOT something to get angry about her about, this is NOT her fault. You think she chooses to feel so ->-bleeped-<- that she doesn't wanna get out of bed?

And she -needs- to contribute to the family? If you break both arms I'm not going to ask you to help me move boxes am I? Because you're injured. Your daughter has not chosen this, the transgender stuff, her depression. It's not something she wants. Focus on getting her better not worrying about who's doing the bloody dishes. Worry about that once your daughter is happy again and once she doesn't suffer from such horrid things like depression.

If she cares about nothing how can you expect her to do chores around the house or what ever it is you want her to do? She won't even do her own interests.

And you said you wanna punish her by taking her internet away? The only thing she's currently feels like she can use to escape all her issues? You NEED to start thinking about all this from a different view. Like I said I am not blaming you, I know you want to help her and I know nothing about the situation, I've just read snippets of information you've chosen to give us above. But everything you've said so far is about how she's got no chance of getting a job, she doesn't do this, she doesn't do that. And honestly it sounds like you're blaming her for feeling like this, like the sleep thing, yell at her for getting up late and just use ya brain, what is she gonna do? Sleep more because she's not ACTUALLY sleeping for ungodly amounts of time cause she feels she needs the extra sleep. She's sleeping because she doesn't want to get up, like I said I have been in this situation recently, when something goes wrong I wanna go to bed, I wanna lay down and ignore it all. When my parents used to yell at me about getting up late I'd just go in my room and lay back down because they'd make me feel ->-bleeped-<- to be around them and sleep was the only thing that made that feeling go away.

So I think thats the worst of it over I'm so sorry again it all sounds very rude above, I know and I hope you don't take offence to it. But like I said I've been in this situation recently. And honestly I tried so hard for about three years to fight my bad routine, to fight my depression. I was like your daughter, I didn't wanna get up, I had no income, no interests, no care for anything. Of course even at my worst points I NEVER wanted to be like that but it's a circle, you hate your self for being like that so it gets worse because you're hating your self. It took a lot for me to break out of all of it but I have done so and I feel fantastic and have done for a while, I have my own business bla bla bla, I'm doing well now!
But the stuff I wrote above is what I used to plead about, beg my parents to listen to! I wanted to improve of course I did but I was pleaing for them to believe that it was NOT my fault. That I am not choosing to feel so ->-bleeped-<- that I don't want to do anything. I now out of that sorta situation still just wish some one yelled at my parents, even though of course they did not wish to do me harm, you do not wish to do your daughter harm. When some one, when I at least was in that state, I'd work and work and you really have to put a lot of effort in to do such small easy things like get out of bed! I'd do it, make progress, small but progress. I'd come down stairs and get moaned at because I still got up late or for not doing this or that, that I'd not get a job in my current state. There I was and for all you know there your daughter is trying to hard and making small but still progress and you think you're helping her by nagging by being"tough" on her. But you're just putting up more walls up for her to break through.

And for example I had and have a FANTASTIC relationship with my dad (Not so much with my mum 0-o) but absolutely fantastic with my dad. He's a great man. And I bring him up because he actually sounds like you. He wanted the best for me and does want the best for me. He supports me and my trans issues too! But the depression especially he did not help out with at all, because he didn't understand everything I've said up there ^^^^. I feel like from how you've spoke about your daughter, thats exactly how my dad spoke to me. He loved me obviously and wanted to push me to do things to get me better. But to me, looking back at it he was just putting up more walls for me to break through, he was just making me feel ->-bleeped-<-ter, making things harder for me because while I was making this small progress it wasn't big enough for him to notice so he'd nag, push me to do this or that. The only way I can explain it really is the phrase "It's not my fault please believe me" Thats how I felt, thats how your daughter feels I'm 99% sure.

For me? Honestly my parents where again for me I believe in the way so much I actually had to ignore them, everything they said I'd ignore, shrug it off push through it. Carry on. While they were most likely thinking they were helping or trying to help and I was being a little brat not taking it. I was trying to tell them no you're making it harder, you're making me feel worthless just stop putting these walls up for me.

So that really could be exactly how your daughter feels, and it's not nice at all.

There are most likely many ways and paths to help your daughter, but for me I only saw one, I found a goal a purpose in "life" (that sounds cheesy as hell) I found something to care about, a goal. And thats what saved me. My business is my goal, my purpose, of course there is WAY more to life than my goal and my business. My goal is just what allowed me to enjoy the rest of my life and all those other things. The spark. I found something I cared deeply about and could continually work on. I want to do well! Bla bla bla that is my goal and as I continued to work on that it allowed me to slowly breath life into my self because I actually begun to feel positive emotions again and care about something.

I would say the most utter importance would be to find something your daughter enjoys deeply that could be (again forgive the cheesey-ness) her "purpose". So she can begin to care again and work towards starting her life and that feels good! Helps breath life back into you when you begin to see your path and enjoy it.

There is a load you can do I'd urge you to change your attitude, don't push, be there. Don't force the fact that you're there for her down her throat. Just one talk be like look, lets get stuff sorted. What ever it is, what ever you want I'm here for you but we're gonna make a rough plan and then I'm gonna back off a bit if thats what you want and you just ask me for help if you want or need it from me.

I again love my dad and even talk to him about how I finally nailed this big boobed woman at the pub that everyone wants to hump finally. But my trans issues, I used to feel ashamed, hate my self. You don't want to talk about things like that with your parents, of course they should eventually know the full story. But you're not going to be her problem solver. You need to find some one else NOT in the family who she can talk to, who can try to motivate her. You say you're struggling between best friend and mother? Well you can't be the best friend just ain't possible. Ya the mother that ain't gonna change, it's an important job and title and a good one, be happy with it and realise that, that is your title. She needs a friend to help her out, to be like YEA! Lets do this! And awww that sucks. Even to bitch to about you! Cause you're her parent and you could be a god, she'd still bitch about you it's part of being a family. Jesus probs bitched about his dad God in the ancient times. About how he keeps bragging he created world in seven days.

Sorry I feel like things have gone a bit all over the place. Be there for her don't smother her. Create the rules with her, HER rules and stick by them, even if that means you stand back a bit. And above all remember she has not chosen any of this, know that it is not her fault, no one wants to feel the way she does. It's not the end of the world it's the start of her world. Just listen to her and she'll get through it and then bug you about other things like money to go get drunk at the pub or something.

Some one also said you should get her on this site, that ain't gonna happen xD You're on the site like, Do you ever get undressed with the window open? No you don't, no one wants to get stalked. But maybe you should poke her and show her the thread and if she wants she can pick some one to chat to, a lot of the people here have been through similar stuff to her and it might really help her to talk to some one who's going through a similar thing. Don't push it though as always give her the option.

idk if i can offer good advice or help with the solution but i can say that me and your daughter are basically the same age and actually in the same boat, with the massive amount of depression, lack of energy and the same amount of apathy, the only difference is i'm soon to be on SSI as means of temporary income until i finish college, so i'm working on myself though my body is breaking down and i can barely keep up with my grades or find work no matter where i look. although my mother is highly support and is there when i need her, she has me go everywhere on my own or loving kicks me behind to do something even if i dont want to or have the energy to do so. the worst thing she could do to me is have me cut my neighbors yard in order for me to be able to pay for my therapy. my point is, is always best to hold back a little while giving that loving push in order to make her realize that although she has support, it is her decision to want to transition or not. from what i read, it sounds like your doing all the work while she is taking a back seat. its just me and my mom and my mother struggles every day so me being a weight on her shoulders, i can seriously understand your frustration. again sry if i could provide etiquette advice or was able to help so please forgive me

Quote from: bunnymom on June 24, 2014, 06:57:36 PM
Your thoughts are all helpful. Today she blew it good. I had hounded her about getting the blood work done yesterday. She stayed in bed until after noon. She assumed I'd take her today along with her laser appointment. 
Well, I suffer from frequent migraine and I got a doozy this morning.  She got up in time, but I couldn't take her. I told her to take a cab, but she needed to bring doctor orders and insurance card.  She said she would wait until next week.  At least she called to reschedule her laser appointment.
She acts incapable of doing anything... or so she demonstrates regularly. She is stressed over money, but cannot and will not do anything to change it. I was able to express the need to contribute around the house so that I have less to worry about when I get off work. I work weekends, leaving the house at 5am and getting home around 5pm, with 2 days off during week. So appointments must be scheduled around my work.
The pattern of avoidance has been going on for over 5 years. We've been going to a counselor for over 12 years. There is no extended family for any outside support. It's just the three of us. We are isolated. Dad and I have different work schedules, the only time off together in 3 years was our trip to Europe last year.
Yet another delay because she's irresponsible.  Not my fault I get sick.

See, these are the type of things she is going to have to learn to do for herself.  Believe me, I've always been my mother's child and have had my families financial backing for much of my life, but something about transitioning made me realize I'd have to be on my own with this.  I wanted it enough that it made me fight for it even when I really couldn't.  No one other than myself could make it happen and it required me taking the steps alone.  If you daughter can't even go for blood work or simple meetings, then there is really nothing you can do to motivate her to do this.  She needs to want it enough to go for it.  Again, I know all too well abou debilitating depression/anxiety and horrible finances as it's been a huge part of my life, but you can't make her do simple things like going for blood work if she doesn't even have the desire to do that.  That really has to be something she wants and trys to create for herself.  You can't hand that to her.  I should note, much of this is tainted with my own experiences and perception, so I wanted to throw that out there as I'm sure it's not a definitive statement on what's going on.  And of course, being trans is a really tough thing to deal with that makes everyday things all the more hard to deal with and cope with.  Little things that most people take for granted can be soul crushing for some of us. 

You really have to find some way to let go of your expectations for your kid. You will suffer so much - and you will cause so much suffering - if you keep such rigid demands. You will feel so much better if you figure out a way to let go of who you want your child to be.

My kid is not trans, but is drastically different enough from what I expected that I've had to learn the hard way over and over that my assumptions and desires have almost zero connection with what is good for my child. I have had to carefully and methodically choose my path with her, and I often have to choose between my own ethics and her well-being. Sometimes I have to force myself to pretend to be less judgmental, even when I'm disappointed and angry. It's always worth it.

Quote from: learningtolive on June 24, 2014, 08:10:19 PM
I should note, much of this is tainted with my own experiences and perception, so I wanted to throw that out there as I'm sure it's not a definitive statement on what's going on.

Yea, you know, after reading back some of the responses in this thread (including my own) I did start to notice a pattern of people projecting their own issues onto this situation a little more than is maybe constructive. I live in a family that has had more than it's share of depression. I've known at least one person in my extended family who killed herself and a lot of other people who have come close. Even putting aside my own depression, I have seen the effects of depression and how damaging it is to people's lives, regardless of the cause. I know on some level it may be tempting to just throw your hands up in the air and say that you can't help someone who isn't willing to help themselves, and on a certain level that is true. But what I've found from experience, is that you can't ever go wrong by being there for someone. The last thing anyone with depression really wants is to feel like they're alone (although they may say otherwise). You just need to be there for them, spend time with them, and help them keep perspective on their problems. You can't force them to do anything they don't want to do (and trying to usually just makes things worse), but you can keep putting opportunities in front of them until they finally decide to take them. Just be patient with them, but at the same time don't be stubborn. Be willing to do whatever it takes to help them get over their issues, and if you try something and it doesn't work, try something else. In dealing with my brother and helping him to get over the depression he was having, at times he became a complete jerk that no one in their right mind would want to spend any time with. But I cared about him enough to do it anyway, and I was able to eventually get him on a track that I believe has gotten his condition under control. And I think that what helped me be successful more than anything else is that I listened to him and helped in the way he wanted to be helped, while also keeping a focus on what I felt was most constructive for him.

...Sorry I think that ended up being more projecting than I had intended it to be, but I guess a certain amount of that is inevitable since we all draw from our experiences to find solutions to problems. The one universal truth I know about depression, is that the thing that works for someone is the thing that works for someone. All you need to do is help them find what that thing is, be it HRT, antidepressants, or just getting outside a little more often. Just don't let your own feelings about what should help a person get in the way of finding out what actually does.

The unique thing about transition is that it's not something anyone can do for her.  Without taking personal responsibility for everything transition-related, it'll end up being a mess.  Whether that's the most basic getting-up-to-go-to-therapy, or getting-up-to-go-to-the-doctor-for-hormones, let alone anything else more involved than that, without the full commitment of the transitioner, you're in a tough spot.

It might be time for an open and honest chat, just you and her, nothing that'll go beyond your ears.  Ask her what's stopping her taking full advantage of everything you're offering her.  You need to figure out what's making her function - or not function - because until you get to the bottom of that, you'll both be going round in circles.  Let her know what's going on inside your head.  Schedule some time alone with her over a cup of coffee and just chat.  Tell her what's bugging you.  Perhaps if you open up first, she'll reciprocate?

I'm not sure that pulling the rug from under her is the best way to shock her into waking up and smelling the roses.  Continue to be as supportive as you've been - make sure that she knows you're still on her side, especially with a somewhat reluctant father.  I think that you two have to form some kind of team on this, some kind of special and open relationship where she knows she's absolutely safe to confide in you.  That'll take work, but I think that once you can communicate with her on that level, you'll be able to figure out what the root cause for all these other issues is.