Quote from: gothique11 on September 26, 2007, 01:36:43 AM
I was very ill and -- excuse my french -- very ->-bleeped-<-ed up.

It's Dutch, not French.  The word was brought to America by the pilgrims.  They stopped off in Amsterdam for two years before sailing for Plymouth Rock.  They are also the ones who gave it it's unusual spelling as an acronym for "For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge."

My how this topic has drifted from the original question.


Sarah L.

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 26, 2007, 10:50:08 AM
Having children and being there for them was a primary focus for me. I think I said in one of my posts that I'm so proud of how they turned out and they are very close.

i suspected as much amanda, i'd love to know how much of your decision was really based on that, although i guess you don't really know? The reason i did not transition until 26 was because likewise, i wanted children, and they were a primary focus for me too. There was only one way i could get them.

i traded transitioning in my teens so i could have children.. perhaps alot of older transitioners do this without even realising.

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 26, 2007, 10:50:08 AM
Having children and being there for them was a primary focus for me. I think I said in one of my posts that I'm so proud of how they turned out and they are very close. However it was never a conscious decision for me to choose children over TS because I did not even know what to think about my issues then.

I know this may set off a firestorm but I do think a women's highest calling is having AND raising children. In our case my wife gave up
her career and never worked outside of the home after our first child was born. We did not plan it that way it just seemed like the right
thing to do. Both of us were all for it, for me not in some sexist type of way, but because it was the right thing to do in my eyes. I know it's not for everyone and I know that  feminists will see it as wrong but for us it felt right. I do think this is out of step with many husbands who REQUIRE they're wives to work. It was very rare for our kids to have friends with stay-at-home moms.

I guess this may sound wierd but if that is what worked in your partnership with your wife then that is great. my wife works and I stay at home with the kids mostly by my wifes choice. my wife is a shy person and not very outgoing and she rarly is able to socalize out side of a work setting because she has a hard time meeting people so working gives her the opertunity to socalize in a comfortable setting. as for me i am very outgoing so I have plenty of chance to be around others this is what works for us as while we were planning a family we decieded that it was important to us for a parent to be at home with the clildren at all times and we did not want to work seprate shifts because we enjoy spending time together which we would probably not have the chance to do if we worked oppisite shifts so this is what works for us! the feminists movement is about having the options to do what a woman chooses not being forced to work but having the freedom to do so if that is the choice made. I think all equal right is about this simple concept people wanting the freedom to be able to live thier lives inwhatever way makes them happy without being punished for it! (just my understanding of how things are if I am wrong please feel free to correct me!)

Quote from: Nichole W. on September 25, 2007, 02:32:59 PM
The most predominant area of transsexuality in my opinion and with my experience is the remarkable way in which TSes of all ages make comparisons with one another. There seems almost an "I'm better than you because..." mentality to the entire spectrum of TSes...

I always believed until 2001 that "I was maybe the only one." Althoughy I had heard of Christine Jorgenson, she was about it...


Others may have other reasons, but I would suggest that availability of services, knowledge distribution and negative life-experiences are big reasons why fewer woman and men of older years transitioned early than seems to be the case now...

Nichole

Nichole, this is well-said.  I suppose I have angered some here because of my comments against this kind of stratification of the TG community.  But we all have different lives and situations.  If there is anyone who should not be judgmental, it is us.

Like many, I just can't fathom how different my life would have been had I known back in my early years what was going on with me.  And like many others here I just thought I was crazy and perverted and disgusting because of the thoughts and feelings that would not leave.  One thing I knew for sure:  No one would ever discover my secret self!  I was certain I could never pass.  And like others, I was so very good at repressing things I just didn't want to deal with.  But that only works temporarily, and truthfully, not very well at that.  So now many of us find ourselves with mortgages and families we dearly love, who depend upon us and our paychecks, and very public careers where others depend on us as well.  And we do still have to fight the ignorance and prejudice of people in our generation.  How different things might have been had we only known what was going on all those years. 

Water under the bridge I know, but it is nice to dream of a better world.  Right now I'll have to settle for improving the one I have.  I know that if I have anything to do with it, my children will live in a world that is more enlightened and less phobic, at least for me.

Kristi

Quote from: fruity on September 26, 2007, 11:04:02 AM

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 26, 2007, 10:50:08 AM
Having children and being there for them was a primary focus for me. I think I said in one of my posts that I'm so proud of how they turned out and they are very close.

i suspected as much amanda, i'd love to know how much of your decision was really based on that, although i guess you don't really know? The reason i did not transition until 26 was because likewise, i wanted children, and they were a primary focus for me too. There was only one way i could get them.

i traded transitioning in my teens so i could have children.. perhaps alot of older transitioners do this without even realising.

So you have children Danielle? I wasn't ever able......I often think about it and do get envious sometimes...

Well put Kristi.

The questions and thoughts that went through my mind when I was young (also what the school shrinks said) were very disturbing.  I am so happy there is more information out there now and somewhat easier to get at.

Sarah L.

Something just struck me and I wanted to point it out.

To me looking back, age 25 is not that long ago from 40, but looking the other direction it seemed so very far into the future.

When I was mid 20's, people that were in their forties were so ancient. Putting my self back at 25 and having someone like that say they wanted to transition(had I known about this) at that age probably would have repulsed me.  They are much too old I would have thought.
I just realized that I can relate to  Fruity's point of view about older transitioner's now that I've put it into that perspective.

Now in my forties I can say that I don't feel or think much differently than I did at 25. Other than the normal physical aspects of aging I'm
not very different. And life has flown by for me as I suspect it has for everyone that is older here.

So for the younger girls out there, remember for you it's only a few short years away even though it seems like a long time. I think you will be very surprised at how fast you're forties get here.

Posted on: September 26, 2007, 01:16:46 PM

---

Jesse: my wife and I talked about me staying home and I would have been happy to do so. For us it was a financial decision more than anything. I say that's perfect if it worked for you, I'm very envious when I hear about stay-at-home dads.


Posted on: September 26, 2007, 01:19:02 PM

---

Fruity, do you prefer to be called Danielle?

Posted on: September 26, 2007, 01:20:11 PM

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QuoteAnd like many others here I just thought I was crazy and perverted and disgusting because of the thoughts and feelings that would not leave.  One thing I knew for sure:  No one would ever discover my secret self!

That about sums up my early years. I managed to keep my secret self a secret pretty well.

QuoteI was certain I could never pass.

If that is your picture, you were so obviously wrong. I can only hope that if I'm able to get to your point I could look a tenth as
passable.

Quote from: Katia on September 26, 2007, 12:29:08 AM

Quote from: Tink on September 25, 2007, 07:14:24 PM
*Sighs*  here we go again.  I have actually promised myself not to give my POV regarding issues such as these anymore. 

clever! there comes a time when questions like these don't matter anymore.  one turns into the spectator & observes the typhon from a distance.

Yes, that, and I also avoid the melodrama and prevent my liver from burning further. 

tink

Quote from: shanetastic on September 25, 2007, 06:03:12 PM

Quote from: Robin_p on September 25, 2007, 05:42:30 PM
I just turn 39 It's my birthday today... All i know is im 4 years old in this life. (just a baby)

I have issues with being a parent, my retirement, and the x-wife. I have hope of being in a relationship again one day as a t-girl.

i think all our issues are the same except for the raising kids part. Most young trans people dont have that responsibility.

Yeah, that's one of the only differences I think is the kids.  Not to mention my parents pay for my therapy as well, but I pay for pretty much everything else.  That's the other problem, being in college, and having no money because of cars, insurance, college, books.  The older you are the more well off you are I think as well for income wise. 

I wish shanetastic..I is divorced and pay child support for the next 12 years.  money will always be a sore spot.

Quote from: Robin_p on September 26, 2007, 09:17:23 PM

Quote from: shanetastic on September 25, 2007, 06:03:12 PM

Quote from: Robin_p on September 25, 2007, 05:42:30 PM
I just turn 39 It's my birthday today... All i know is im 4 years old in this life. (just a baby)

I have issues with being a parent, my retirement, and the x-wife. I have hope of being in a relationship again one day as a t-girl.

i think all our issues are the same except for the raising kids part. Most young trans people dont have that responsibility.

Yeah, that's one of the only differences I think is the kids.  Not to mention my parents pay for my therapy as well, but I pay for pretty much everything else.  That's the other problem, being in college, and having no money because of cars, insurance, college, books.  The older you are the more well off you are I think as well for income wise. 

I wish shanetastic..I is divorced and pay child support for the next 12 years.  money will always be a sore spot.

Ouch, I'm sorry to hear about that   Hopefully your job is good though and you enjoy it.

Quote from: shanetastic on September 26, 2007, 09:22:11 PM

Quote from: Robin_p on September 26, 2007, 09:17:23 PM

Quote from: shanetastic on September 25, 2007, 06:03:12 PM

Quote from: Robin_p on September 25, 2007, 05:42:30 PM
I just turn 39 It's my birthday today... All i know is im 4 years old in this life. (just a baby)

I have issues with being a parent, my retirement, and the x-wife. I have hope of being in a relationship again one day as a t-girl.

i think all our issues are the same except for the raising kids part. Most young trans people dont have that responsibility.

Yeah, that's one of the only differences I think is the kids.  Not to mention my parents pay for my therapy as well, but I pay for pretty much everything else.  That's the other problem, being in college, and having no money because of cars, insurance, college, books.  The older you are the more well off you are I think as well for income wise. 

I wish shanetastic..I is divorced and pay child support for the next 12 years.  money will always be a sore spot.

Ouch, I'm sorry to hear about that   Hopefully your job is good though and you enjoy it.

That's funny. The only reason that i have been paying child support for my three kids on time is because I LOVE MY JOB!!!! I is a boat mechanic.  I don't make a lot of money and some of my co-worker s##ck. But when i get near water my heart sings and i am at peace with myself. Nothing like standing on a pier and watching the sun come up over the harbor!!!!!!

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 26, 2007, 01:25:54 PM

QuoteI was certain I could never pass.

If that is your picture, you were so obviously wrong. I can only hope that if I'm able to get to your point I could look a tenth as
passable.

Amanda, that is so very sweet.  Thank you.  And yes, all my avatar pics are me, albeit with a nice makeover done.

Kristi

Wow! I just read in another topic you were not doing HRT yet, I'm stunned, I did not have a clue. 

We are all equal, older Ts envy younger ones, I envy those who transitioned at 15-16 and 15-16 probably envy girls born girls. So we all are in the same boat we where all born the wrong gender and I am so amazed at the courage of those in there 40's who start transitioning. "You are the bravest and strongest amongst us"

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 25, 2007, 01:30:54 PM
In another topic recently there was some discussion about early vs late TS's. I'm really interested in learning
more about this and I hope that everyone can use this thread to discuss the topic not snipe at each other.

I believe that some members of this forum that are early TS's believe the older TS is not really TS, if they were they would
have done everything possible to transition.

A lot of young people think that George Washington was the president during World War II but that doesn't make it a fact. The fact is transition was not a possibility for most older transitioners when they were young.

Quote from: Ember L on October 03, 2007, 09:26:43 PM
We are all equal, older Ts envy younger ones

And younger TSs envy older TSs who can afford SRS. Envy is a useless attachment, you can spend your whole life wanting this or wanting that and all it does is encourage wanting something else.

QuoteA lot of young people think that George Washington was the president during World War II but that doesn't make it a fact. The fact is transition was not a possibility for most older transitioners when they were young.
I think your definition of "a lot" is being used to refer to "one or two"

Hi, Redfish,

If you ever watch Jay Leno on the Tonight Show when he does his "Jaywalking" feature you'll see that "a lot" is really more than "one or two."

I knew that I was a girl in a boy's body in 1956 and I was sure in 1960.  That was when what's-his-name was president and America had no one in space yet.

Question:  how would you handle transition at that age in 1960?  How did you handle it on your 9th birthday?

I graduated high school in 1969.  That was around the time of the Stonewall riots.  Were you alive then?  Do you know what those riots were about?

I was separated from the military in 1974.  I was 23.  You're about 23, right?  Please do the research and see what was available in psychiatry to help transsexuals in 1974.  I lived in a rural area where it was no crime to beat-up on gay men or to ostracize lesbians.  In America back then, what help did anyone have for transsexuality?  It wasn't even documented in the literature of psychiatry.

I could go on for several more years, until the Internet became available to me.  That gave me a window on the latest developments in help for those like me:  transsexual and hoping.

Redfish, please take the time to dig back and see how medicine, psychiatry, and society at-large dealt with such unknown and unpopular problems as transsexuality.

I believe that we all transition at the right time.  There is no early or late, only the right time.

'nuff said.

Wing Walker

Quote from: redfish on October 09, 2007, 05:58:00 AM

QuoteIf you ever watch Jay Leno on the Tonight Show when he does his "Jaywalking" feature you'll see that "a lot" is really more than "one or two."

Alright..I guess I just have an issue with people implying that my generation is inferior. And I like Conan O'Brien better!

Oh, it's not just your generation.  There are plenty of ignorant people in mine, too.  I liked the segment where he was asking people what we should do about North Korea while showing them a map of Austalia and none of them knew they were saying to bomb a country on the wrong continent.

Quote from: maybe_amanda on September 25, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
Another question, what is the typical age for early transition?  I'm guessing somewhere around 25?



Posted on: September 25, 2007, 02:17:30 PM

---

Sarah: what you say is so true.

Is it possible that most if not all late TS's would have done so a long time
ago had the proper information been available to them?

If we see a drastic reduction in late TS's starting around the year 2030 (age 15 in 2000, plus 30 years) we will have a concrete answer.

Let me say this again. Late transitioners did not have a realistic  option to transition when they were young. MtF became generally available in the 70s and FtM was unheard of. If transition had been available lie it is now, I and many other late transitioners would have transitioned in their teens.

One other note, one of these days, an early transitoner will pay homage to those who blazed the transition path for others to follow and I am going to fall over in shock.