For me it is about not getting clocked at all. Like, basically ever.

Do I go days where I blend in and no one seems to notice? Sure. Do I often get gendered correctly? Yes. Do I barely get a second look often enough? Indeed.

I'm still clocked often enough though. So the way that I see it, I don't pass.

Thoughts?

That's a very good question that is bothering me right now!

How can I know if I am passing or not?

I am full time for just twelve days and I was not misgendered yet. I was at several places and no one seems to stare at me or say anything...but are they reading me as a woman or a transwoman?

It's hard to tell. There is one thing that can be done to test passability, but it can have a disastrous outcome: Going to the woman's WC! If you are not really passing people will ask you to leave and call security =P

But again...how can we know if we are stealth or not? How can we know if we are being secretly clocked?

Quote from: Natalia on October 03, 2014, 07:41:29 AM
That's a very good question that is bothering me right now!

How can I know if I am passing or not?

I am full time for just twelve days and I was not misgendered yet. I was at several places and no one seems to stare at me or say anything...but are they reading me as a woman or a transwoman?

It's hard to tell. There is one thing that can be done to test passability, but it can have a disastrous outcome: Going to the woman's WC! If you are not really passing people will ask you to leave and call security =P

But again...how can we know if we are stealth or not? How can we know if we are being secretly clocked?

you definitely need to stop beating  your self up there is no male in your avatar , also given the fact that the far greater span of your life has presented male its going to take time not to question it

I know I'll never be stealth. Too many people around here knew me pre-transition. And I'm 5'11" tall, so there are bound to be people who look at me and wonder, especially in LGBT spaces.

For me, passability means that rarely does a stranger clock me unless they have a reason to look at me carefully.

For me, it's basically blending in so that a given person doesn't pick me out as trans. However, it can vary by situation and group, so in your case, for example, I'd still say you pass - most of the time, in most places.

Yes, for me being passable is never being read--a fairly high standard.  But it's virtually impossible to know how well you're doing.  If people are reading you, they might say nothing to you.  So you're left studying their reactions to see if you can read them.  You're always guessing.  Many times I've wished that I could read people's minds, but I can't.

It's a state of mind where I am 100% confident in myself.

I do not care about it 

barbie~~

I think I pass 100% of the time with people I don't know, but the town I live in isn't that huge, and it's where I transitioned three years ago. I know that quite a few people watched my transition, some intensely at first, others, almost all men, with a muted disdain, and now, I think that even most of those who did know, kind of see me as a woman who once dressed in male clothes. When it comes right down to it, I THINK I always pass, but part of it could be because I show confidence instead of misgivings or fear. If I showed either of those, people might look closer and it would probably be easier to see my faults, some of which I consider male traits, but nobody seems to notice. Having said that, I think I pass all the time. Does that make sense?

For me, passing is when you are, for the most part, getting gendered correctly; where the majority of your interactions people treat you as your preferred gender.

What is it to me? Absolutely nothing of importance.

Quote from: Natalie on October 03, 2014, 02:54:53 PM
What is it to me? Absolutely nothing of importance.

This... Sorry if this seems tough. But what does it matter? You can't read minds,  so if people don't say or do anything, what is there to worry about?

I don't know if things are more civilized out here (probably), but here there are a lot of reports of trans women being kicked off women public restrooms here because people read them as "men dressing up as women". They call security and it is a huge and shameful thing to happen to you if your documents are still to be changed (and here it takes over one year to have them changed!)

Usually people don't want to be read as trans so they can blend better and be treated as real women...we aren't treated as real women by most people and everyone knows that. That besides the risks of being beaten and killed at the streets!

But perhaps it is something more important for starters like me too, because I see that I require a lot of confirmation in order to have enough self-steem to go out as myself.

But coming back to the topic subject...passability is one thing almost impossible to tell. Even when people are gendering you correctly and treating you correctly, there is the possibility that they are aware of you being trans. They just won't tell you!

I am not sure what exactly you mean in response to my statement. It's an axiom that humans cannot read minds and people "do" tend to say things to people that others do not like. It's happens all the time. My statement is quite clear, someone elses subjective opinion about whether or not I "pass" in society is a joke and essentially meaningless because of the fact that I don't "care" about their opinions of me thus, the concept of "passing" means absolutely nothing to me. The poster posed a question and I answered that question, nothing more.

For me passability is the ability to walk past 95-99% of the population without them even wondering about your gender, there is no such thing as 100% passability even for cis people and granted girls that start hormones in their teens might get well beyond the 99% mark.

Quote from: Natalia on October 03, 2014, 03:36:30 PM
But coming back to the topic subject...passability is one thing almost impossible to tell. Even when people are gendering you correctly and treating you correctly, there is the possibility that they are aware of you being trans. They just won't tell you!

If they are gendering and treating you correctly what does it matter if they know if you are trans? I'm treated as a woman by many cis people who know I am trans and that is because they are decent people for whom it makes no difference that I am trans. A shame that might not be said about many others but so what, seriously, screw them!

To me it's looking in the mirror and liking what I see.

Quote from: Ms Grace on October 03, 2014, 05:21:52 PM
If they are gendering and treating you correctly what does it matter if they know if you are trans? I'm treated as a woman by many cis people who know I am trans and that is because they are decent people for whom it makes no difference that I am trans. A shame that might not be said about many others but so what, seriously, screw them!

You know what? You are right! I need to turn on that little button that says "screw it" and move on.

Being able to see myself in a reflective surface and no longer feeling sick to my stomach. That is the yard stick for me, after all I am doing this for me not for anyone else!

Well to me it's being confident in myself (I'm give myself the worst critics so if I pass to myself then I guess I would pass to everyones eyes XD), and pretty much is reach my goals in transition and be done, or half way happy at least. I don't think you need 100 surgeries to pass, I mean you can still pass and be ugly. The two things are not the same. As others said, if i'll be able to not be noticed from strangers then I'll pass, but it's more important that I'm happy with myself, etc...