In the U.K Injectable hormones are banned by the NHS and many private practitioners but I actually think they are more prone to working better that the pills which is the only HRT I've ever been on? so far pills haven't worked on me in 7 years..

I would like to try injectable oestrogen but as I live in the U.K I will have to get it from the internet. What are the benefits as well as the side effects apart from the dangers of thrombosis?

Self medicating isn't the smartest thing in the world.  If the pills your doctor is giving you now are not working, it would be wise to talk with them and make sure they are giving you the proper doseage.

Sarah L.

My doctor prefers patches first, injections second, pills last.  According to her, injectable is much safer than pills.  I'm not sure what the risks of injection are, but I would have a real hard time giving myself an intramuscular shot.

KK, Being on injectables myself here are some of the effects/risks/benifits and all that


Injectables seem to work fairly well for me, but they do have some risks and sideefects...

First off... Im sticking myself once a week with a very long and large needle...  you run the risk of infection at the injection site...

Also some people are adversly effected by the initial shock of the shot...  If you hit the wrong area... <IE bloodvessle> you can get alittle too much E into your system at once...  even if you dont hit the wrong area it can have some strange effects...
I personaly feel "wierd" after a shot... and am in that state for about 8 hours or so...I deffinatly cant drive durring this time cuz well... my judgment is alittle impaired...  Ive heard of others that go totaly nuts after an injection... it all seems to depend on the person really...

Also injectables depending on how administered can have a much larger peak/valley than there oral counterparts... They may stay in your system alot longer, but at the same time you take them far less frequently...

They do cost less than patches and do bypass the liver <reason why I prefer them>

Also it seems it seems to be a good idea to have eaten recently and to drink something sweet after the shot...  <It gives me the shakes otherwise>...

I actualy dont recomend injectables unless you have liver problems/other helath risks, and cant afford the patch...   literaly, there just a pain in the butt.

Injectibles without any question should not be done without doctor supervision.
If it has been 7 years on HRT you are basically stuck with what you have.  Injectibles make things go FASTER for SOME people, but that does not mean its the most effective route.

Here in the DC area pills always come first, and then injectibles if pills are ineffective.  For me the pills have been VERY effective. 

But injectibles absolutely require doctor supervision as the dosages tend to be very specific to the person.  Basically do not mess with them without a doctor.

But 7 years is well...you are basically getting the most out of your hormones you will get.  If it was 7 months, it would be a very different story.  Injectibles are not going to help you with regards to the effects of HRT. 

Berliegh,
I have my first appt at the endo in two days and I'm expecting to get Estradiol Valerate injectable, I'll let you know how it goes. I'm not really expecting much for a few weeks, but we'll see what happens. Meghan

Quote from: Amy T. on September 18, 2007, 01:56:41 AM
Injectibles without any question should not be done without doctor supervision.
If it has been 7 years on HRT you are basically stuck with what you have.  Injectibles make things go FASTER for SOME people, but that does not mean its the most effective route.

Here in the DC area pills always come first, and then injectibles if pills are ineffective.  For me the pills have been VERY effective. 

But injectibles absolutely require doctor supervision as the dosages tend to be very specific to the person.  Basically do not mess with them without a doctor.

But 7 years is well...you are basically getting the most out of your hormones you will get.  If it was 7 months, it would be a very different story.  Injectibles are not going to help you with regards to the effects of HRT. 

Yep yep... specialy about the dosages...  There is no actual standard in amounts and how frequently its distributed...  and too much of a good thing could be very VERY bad for your system...  I missed the 7years of HRT thing...  Sadly I think Amy might be right and that youd recieve very little added effect from switching to the injectable version...  From what I understand, the NHS perscribes Estradiol Valtrate... which is what most injectables are... youd just be switching the method of reciept... not what your getting....  Id say stick with the freebies...

Quote from: Sarah Louise on September 17, 2007, 06:58:00 PM
Self medicating isn't the smartest thing in the world.  If the pills your doctor is giving you now are not working, it would be wise to talk with them and make sure they are giving you the proper doseage.

Sarah L.

I didn't mention self medicaion and I have the full backing of my GP. She knows the HRT pills are not working. It has nothing to do with dosage and I've tried all different pills (ethenyoestrodial, Progynova, premarin etc) and all different dosages. Some people are more receptive to HRT than others and some other forms of HRT such as injections and patches may be more beneficial to me than pills....

Quote from: LynnER on September 18, 2007, 03:09:00 AM
From what I understand, the NHS perscribes Estradiol Valtrate... which is what most injectables are... youd just be switching the method of reciept... not what your getting....

Aside from Premarin, pills here in the US at least tend to be Estriadol 17B... similar to valerate, but I don't think it's exactly the same thing.

FWIW, my doctor won't allow shots. He says it's too risky for infections, muscle/tissue damage from hitting something bad with the needle, and the fluctuations in hormone levels between shots.

~Kate~

Quote from: Kate on September 18, 2007, 10:03:00 AM

Quote from: LynnER on September 18, 2007, 03:09:00 AM
From what I understand, the NHS perscribes Estradiol Valtrate... which is what most injectables are... youd just be switching the method of reciept... not what your getting....

Aside from Premarin, pills here in the US at least tend to be Estriadol 17B... similar to valerate, but I don't think it's exactly the same thing.

FWIW, my doctor won't allow shots. He says it's too risky for infections, muscle/tissue damage from hitting something bad with the needle, and the fluctuations in hormone levels between shots.

~Kate~

Estradiol Valotrate (or progynova) isn't quite the same in injectable form. The reason injectables are banned in the U.K is if you have adverse effects from the injections (like blood clots, elevated Prolactin) you can't do anything about it. We can get all types of pills and patches here but the shots are not so easy. Although we can have shots in the form of some anti -androgens (Gosalaren - Zoladex) which can be just as dangerous. Zoladex had reversal effects on me and I was stuck with it for three months....

I'm still convinced Estrogen HRT shots might be better for me despite the risks.....
it's hard for me as I have no reasonable breast development or fat distribution from 7 years of pills which is very depressing. My measurements are the same as they were in 2000.........so I'm willing to try anything I haven't tried before.

If its been 7 years things are not going to change with injectibles.  Especially if your testosterone is below 100 and your estrogen levels are high.  I don't think things are going to change for you if you do injectibles.  All that injectibles do for SOME people is speed things up and drop T faster.  If you are not receptive to estrogen and estradiol it does not change everything.

Quote from: Amy T. on September 18, 2007, 03:17:17 PM
If its been 7 years things are not going to change with injectibles.  Especially if your testosterone is below 100 and your estrogen levels are high.  I don't think things are going to change for you if you do injectibles.  All that injectibles do for SOME people is speed things up and drop T faster.  If you are not receptive to estrogen and estradiol it does not change everything.

So what's the solution?

Generaly speaking HRT is only effective so far as physical changes for the first 3-5 years...  the lenght of standard puberty...  there are ofcorse exceptions to the rule...

If your past the point of the physical changes where nothing is happening, surgery and augmentation may be the best option available... *sigh*  sorry to say it...

Question though, did you ever have progestrone in the mix?

Quote from: LynnER on September 26, 2007, 07:09:53 PM
Generaly speaking HRT is only effective so far as physical changes for the first 3-5 years...  the lenght of standard puberty...  there are ofcorse exceptions to the rule...

If your past the point of the physical changes where nothing is happening, surgery and augmentation may be the best option available... *sigh*  sorry to say it...

Question though, did you ever have progestrone in the mix?

exactely my point.....I've been on HRT and anti - androgens for more than 7 years and nothings happening, and yes of course I've put progesterone in the mix...

Over the years I've tried almost everything that's available....the same with my friend who is the same age....she's been on hrt for 13 years!  maybe we're just not delusional?

HRT is definitely not an exact science.  In my case, my breasts are doing fine, but no matter how much estrogen my doctor thows at me, she can't get my blood level above 75.  According to her, she has some menopausal patients with the same problem.

My prescribing doc has me on patches and sublingual 17beta estradiol.  It's the identical regimen I had myself on the 2 years before I first went to see her.  She likes the combination, and blood levels.  I haven't asked about shots, as 17beta is for all practical purposes, bioidentical.  I don't like the idea of synthetic estrogens, or conjugated estrogens.  I might, however, just ask her her opinion on adding progesterone.

Bev

I have been using injectable estradiol valerate in sesame seed oil since 2004.  My doctor taught me how to properly give myself the injections and I have my prescriptions filled by a reliable compounding pharmacy.

My HRT started with oral estrogen tablets.  Conjugated estrogens like Premarin were ruled out by the good doctor.  We discussed injectables and after sufficient research he agreed that they would be best for me to get the maximum effect at my age with the minimum risk of clots, liver problems, and other surprises.

I pay for the injectables myself but it's worth it for me.

Wing Walker

Posted on: October 06, 2007, 03:18:18 AM

---

QuoteKK, Being on injectables myself here are some of the effects/risks/benifits and all that


Injectables seem to work fairly well for me, but they do have some risks and sideefects...

First off... Im sticking myself once a week with a very long and large needle...  you run the risk of infection at the injection site...

Also some people are adversly effected by the initial shock of the shot...  If you hit the wrong area... <IE bloodvessle> you can get alittle too much E into your system at once...  even if you dont hit the wrong area it can have some strange effects...
I personaly feel "wierd" after a shot... and am in that state for about 8 hours or so...I deffinatly cant drive durring this time cuz well... my judgment is alittle impaired...  Ive heard of others that go totaly nuts after an injection... it all seems to depend on the person really...

Also injectables depending on how administered can have a much larger peak/valley than there oral counterparts... They may stay in your system alot longer, but at the same time you take them far less frequently...

They do cost less than patches and do bypass the liver <reason why I prefer them>

Also it seems it seems to be a good idea to have eaten recently and to drink something sweet after the shot...  <It gives me the shakes otherwise>...

I actualy dont recomend injectables unless you have liver problems/other helath risks, and cant afford the patch...   literaly, there just a pain in the butt.

Hi, Lynn,

I guess that the results and side effects of HRT are extremely individualized.

I inject myself once a week with a needle that is 1.5 inches long and a 5 cc syringe.  I will not mention doses here.

What constitutes a long needle may differ among those being stuck by it.

I do everything as I was taught, to wipe the vial cap with an alcohol swab, draw the estrogen into the syringe, and inject it in the outside area of the upper quadrant of the gluteus maximus muscle, closer to my waist and hip joint.  Injecting too close to the center of the muscle or too low can cause a bleeder but where I inject I seldom draw any blood.

I don't recall such side effects as yours but, again, this is all very individual.

BTW, you look wonderful, Dahling!

Wing Walker