My wife asked me if my therapist was really a woman. She does have some features that are a bit masculine-ish but she said she is cis and has two children. I have no reason to believe she's not telling the truth.

But the "really a woman" part bothers me. I mean, my wife thinks trans women are not really women? I asked her what she'd think of me. She sidestepped around that and basically asked if she's not allowed to make observations. I told her it's OK to ask me if I think someone is trans but it's not OK to ask if they are a "real" anything because trans women (and trans men) are their real gender and would like to be respected as such. She was having none of it and said it's just natural for her.

So how do I overcome this?

Most people like that have to come to their own realizations. You can't force them, its in their mindset. And if you basically talk them into it, then likely, they'll just humor you to make you shut up.

Education, education, education is really the only thing I can think of. The better she understands how you feel and what you're going through more accepting and understanding she will show towards you. Just remember her views and feelings have been ingrained into her and will not change overnight. It will take time for her to understand so have some patients, and try not to overreact. Best of luck to you, sweetie.

Hugs,

Melissa Ann

I'd love to hear other people's responses to this. My family has by and large been very supportive, but it's like pulling teeth getting them to use the proper pronouns. "Well, you're not a real man yet, when you get start hormones and get surgery we'll remember to call you a he." I'm extremely lucky otherwise, so I typically let it slide but it's the thought process behind it that bothers me the most.

Yeah and she tells me all the time that she doesn't see us working out because she's not into women.

So in her mind are trans women real woman or not? Apparently not real enough so she gets a pass clocking strangers, but real enough so that when I transition she won't be attracted to me anymore.

I think a lot of cis people use the words "real women" when they mean someone who was born female-sexed.

I think "If she is trans, she WOULD BE a real woman" is all that is needed in response. You can't change her thinking but you can encourage her to ponder the implication of her words.

Hi Kate.

If she is not a real woman then is she a fake woman? Transphobia is a disease just like homophobia. You can love a transphobic just like an alcoholic but at some point it gets old and you get strong. By the way she loves a woman now, you.

Quote from: suzifrommd on October 31, 2014, 01:19:42 PM
I think a lot of cis people use the words "real women" when they mean someone who was born female-sexed.

I think "If she is trans, she WOULD BE a real woman" is all that is needed in response. You can't change her thinking but you can encourage her to ponder the implication of her words.

Great point. For many people, the concept of sex =/= gender is completely foreign. We know how "real [man/woman]" sounds to us, but for someone not versed in terminology useful for describing things like cisgender vs. transgender, things might come out sounding much worse than meant "for lack of better words" (in their vocabulary).

In such a situation I might also be inclined to ask the person (as non-rudely as possible) why they want to know, why does it matter to them? Would knowing one way or another if the therapist is trans or cis impact her interactions with the therapist? And if so, why? Just to give some food for thought.

For some reason, when I hear "real woman", I think of all the nonsense about whether somebody (male) is a "real man."  I know "real man" is mostly used against cis men, and I've heard "real woman" used against cis women.  (It's never "for" anyone, except maybe oppressors.)  And it's about gender policing.  I suspect the same is true when it's used against trans men/women -- it's about keeping you in your assigned box, your assigned presentation, your assigned behavior.

Because once you open the door to people crossing over to a different box, you open the door to all kinds of uncomfortable things.  It might make it obvious how poorly your "[all] men are X, [all] women are Y"-based rules actually fit the humans you deal with, and you'd have to base how you deal with each one on who and what they are as unique individuals.  What???  Deal with people as they actually are, and not according to what category you've assigned them to?  What a concept!

But you already knew that.

I did get the 'she is too pretty to be trans' comment about a friend. I replied with; 'are you too ugly to be cis?'

She had a think and then apologised profusely.

It's education.