There may be triggers, there will be the reality of what transition really does here.



For me, it was a long road.  Acceptance has come,  but with a cost.  As we all know I have modified presentations that are determined specifically by what whoever I am around can handle without freaking out.  I have a child with near zero tolerance who has a mental disorder, another with total tolerance who has an anxiety disorder and is breaking my poor little heart while we try to salvage what we can, she is a beautiful young adult, it just rips me apart.  And we have another that is full accepting.  Those two can handle startling genderqueer as well as full presentation, albeit I still have a short goatee for my wife's sake, and for mine.... I lose the wife I may lose much more than that.

And home alone is full transition, and work its a maybe or maybe not subtle genderqueer with the boots and nails on.

But family dynamics related to trans?

Used to be a huge issue, used to be hidden and deceptive and compulsive, now after nearly 2 years out, its just normal.  They get nervous outside, one of my best moments was at a mcdonalds with my wife, hearing a gasp from the drive through girl, and the comment in front of my wife, OMG what beautiful nails I wish mine were so shiny like that!  You could not have dreamed of a better moment, my wife hates my nails.  Totally validated, in the most unexpected way imaginable.  And not the first time, it happens a lot.  And they start saying sweetie a lot.  The girls, I mean, guys never say anything and usually cant look at them.

Clear polish, which I love, does wonders for me, along with my 3-4 mm extended nails.

So, the family, and my dad, have absorbed it.  My therapist had a very heavy hand in this, so did my faith, so did divine intercession directly acting on my wife, a vision where she was told flat out not to fear staying with me.  Those were times of horror for us, but we have gone through to the other side.

So my dears, shall we share our experience, strength and hope once again here?  Or cry together as colateral damage to families of trans people is usually just devastating?  I paid a big cost, don't get jealous please, it cost thousands of dollars, total honesty, full acceptance of non binary, and ignoring that thing in between the legs.  Not a joy ride, but a ride with a price worth paying, to find peace and now the joy is here, its just normal family stuff.

And speaking of price, a quarter of my income goes to HRT and shrinks, but my dad is subsidizing this.  He is very old though, I am scared now for him.  And that is all meds and shrink and bloods, I have no surgeries planned or desired.

Outside the house, they have not been affected, I am not out to the community.  Just in AA.   I will rip their balls off if they break my anonymity.

Hope all is well, could be a toxic topic, could be one filled with hope, should be filled with truth, an eye opener.

Blessngs my dears

Satinjoy

My transition pretty much shattered my family. Didn't have to do with being non-binary. If I'd been binary MtF, would have had the same result, though might have happened much sooner.

My wife asked me for a divorce. We had a bitter fight over money my mother left me in her will fueled by her lawyer who used her anger as a strategy.

My daughter wouldn't look at me in female mode until only a couple weeks before full time. She was angry and wouldn't be seen with me in public for another few months. She told the divorce coach that she didn't want to be seen being taken to school by me. It took time, but we are close again.

My son doesn't ever talk about his feelings. He acts OK with my change, but is he? He's having psychiatric problems, using drugs, and falling behind at college. Don't know if that has anything to do with transition.

Even my extended family is still reeling. There is a cousin who railed against my transition and accused me of "promoting" this lifestyle, and another who wouldn't invite me to her baby shower because there might be people there who would object. I'm distancing myself from that arm of the family.

Am I allowed to say that I don't see any of these as results of my transition? Am I allowed to say that instead they are a REACTION to my transition by people who are choosing how they deal with it? Am I allowed to say that my transition was merely a change in the way I interact with the world - my name, voice, and appearance, something that is my right as a human being, with our without a family?

Or must I take responsibility for the whole caboodle?

almost all of the people you mention are responsible for their own reactions.
except, partly, your wife. heterosexual woman prefers to be married to a man, when you suddenly stop being a man, you really are responsible for either having entered the relationship with a big lie, or having robbed your wife of her husband. but that doesn't justify her anger, it only is an explanation of why a divorce may not have been possible to prevent. divorces can be peaceful though, with the whole family's well-being as a goal rather than a way to hurt the other.

i'm not married, so it doesn't affect that part of family life.
my daughter is only a little worried that she might lose her mother.
i've never tried too hard to fill in that role, i'm more of a parent to her, so it will be interesting to see how that eventually develops.

Suzi I agree with you.  It's so different for all of us, the happy endings with family appear rare, and living truth is relentless.

Wish it was not so.

Are you allowed?

Are you kidding?  Yes, totally..
The thread is intended to reveal the hard truth of trans.  We might as well know the cost of the rose up front, and our fingers may get torn.

Imo yours is the usual run.  And I lost and got back on the revelation, but the wife was accommodating and I know the shoe can still drop.

Taka I will get back later...

And I am not out to extended, they are ignorant in this and would  destroy everything I have done to stay married.  I hate that but it is fact.

Triggering thread, this may have been a bad idea.

Satinjoy

My spouse is fine with me as I am and has come to terms with it because being non-binary trans is nowhere as intimidating for her or my offspring as it would be if I was binary trans which would have been the straw that broke the camel's back. That being said, I'm now glad that I backed off from full MtF transition, as it occurred to me some time back that wasn't what it would take to make me happy anyway and would only serve to completely shatter what life I had at the time, and would that make me happy? Hell no I wold have only made myself all the more miserable and a pariah to all who knew me. Who would I then blame for that? It certainly wouldn't have been their fault for having their own views and preconceived notions. Unfair as it seems that we can't bend others to accept what we find acceptable for ourselves, then we are faced with taking responsibility for the fallout for our own decisions. Once I accepted that, then non-binary became my personal comfort zone and all is well with me and my family. Life is a series of compromises, and those who think they are an island unto themselves and are unable to make some accommodations create shunts and miss out on some of the potential happiness of a fuller life.

I'm only one-foot out of the closet -- to my mom and only then, because she asked. It's... hard, sometimes. I'm extremely lucky. My mom is so supportive. She loves me dearly and wants me to succeed. But she can't quite wrap her head around things, and it's started to wear on me. I know she things I'm just questioning, and I know she thinks that if she reminds me of what a good girl I was, I'll realize that I was a girl all along. She keeps sending me pictures. Texts about how much she misses her little girl when she was four. I feel trapped. I can't bear to break her heart like this. Some days I wake up and think, ok, this is fine, I'll take it all back.

And then, after a few drinks, I'll get emails where she calls me "son." Which is ... I don't know. Touching. Wonderful. Scary, because what have I done? And a tiny, tiny, tiny bit disappointing. I'd rather be "he" than "she," but what I really want is "they." That's not gonna happen, though.

I'm supposed to be the good daughter, apple of my parents' eyes, and a role-model for my little sis. I'll always be her sister, I'll always be their child, but it smarts  a bit: knowing they never wanted a son, and feeling like they want some freaky, in-between thing even less.

i don't think i'll ever feel sorry for a parent who "loses" their son or daughter to ->-bleeped-<-. it is not the parents' place to wish for this or that kind of child. i'm feeling truly sorry for any child who happens to be engineered to parents' wishes of intelligence or athletic abilities. so what if the most intelligent child in the world want to become a musician? can it ever be justified, sending them off to become a space engineer or whatever, for some greater good or parents' glory?

parents get what they get, and if they have talked their child into pretending they're something else%2

Quote from: Taka on October 31, 2014, 01:20:22 AM
i don't think i'll ever feel sorry for a parent who "loses" their son or daughter to ->-bleeped-<-.

I agree, Taka.

I'm curious. How about someone who "loses" their spouse or father/mother that way?

i'm a little curious about that too, particularly the children.
most children have an astonishing ability to adapt. i think it would be fairly easy for them to see a parent slowly change sex, as long as nobody tells them it's wrong.
unfortunately, most people seem to have opinions on what you can and can't do, and that can frighten a child.
my own daughter doesn't know that i've never really treated her in a motherly way. she thinks i'm like a mother should be, and this does make her worry.
but we should still be fine as long as i never exclude her from my own thinking, and always talk to her about things.
maybe she wants some compromise. i'm willing to go to great lengths for her, but she also needs to learn that some things happen the way they will and not the way she wants them to. experiencing that i'm still there, as the same person, should give her enough security to accept.

spouses are worse.
a spouse usually has sexual and reproductive interest in the person they're in a relationship with.
marriage is a contract of cooperation around certain things, and transition can in some cases be a breach of contract.
how serious the breach is, or whether there is any, depends on the two people's different values, views, stage in life, ability to accept or adapt and lots of other things.
it's still not on the same level as infidelity. it seems more like having kept secret that your father was a dangerous axe killer, or suddenly feeling a need to move to some jungle in order to ba able to live happily at all. not all can accept that.
but it's still not necessary to blame each other and throw lots of hate around.
if divorce is necessary, then it is. but if there are children, it would be much wiser of the spouse to be open minded about things despite the hurt, so that the kids can have a good relationship with both parents if they want to. getting angry and spiteful can make the kids hate the trans parent without even knowing the reason why. isn't that child abuse?

I was extremely unsympathetic as an ally, a friend, but as the person who's "dying," I'll admit, I'm defensive of my parents. I firmly believe that family neither begins nor ends with blood, but once you've decided who you'll throw yourself under the bus for, that's that. Support of them is support of me.

there's no way i'd give my parents unconditional love after all the conditions they've set for me and my siblings. it's great if you can love your parents, but to me, they aren't worthy of the "parent" title. i respect them no more than other people, probably less. other people never insulted me or my parents as much as they did. my mother behaves like an overgrown teenage boy, ever since my youngest brother was born, she has been defending her right to be treated with respect even when she never respected any other family members.

i will only defend my mother if she gets some form of dementia. while she's still being considered able to make her own choices, i'll hold her responsible for absolutely everything she does or says or doesn't do or say. for my daughter's sake, i'll quench my anger and speak well of those who hurt me. my mother never did that for me. my father was better, but unfortunately not his second wife.

one thing is defending one's parents when others insult them. if anyone were to insinuate that my mother has anything to do with who i am now, i'll have to tell them this truth, that i am a responsible adult able to make my own choices. my parent have nothing to do with anything of what i choose to do or not to do.  it is my own choice if i let them influence me, and my reasponsible to be aware of this.
that's not really a defense of my parents though...

Respect isn't and shouldn't ever be imparted carte blanche to anyone. It has to be earned and thus deserved. I don't respect generals, kings and presidents, I respect the rank or office, but the individual has to earn my respect. There were things about my own parents that I disrespected, they deserved and earned that from me, on the other hand they had many other fine attributes that I came to respect and I loved them simply because they were my parents and give them credit for doing the best they were intellectually and emotionally equipped to do as parents.

I walked away from my family after they claimed to love me unconditionally, yet still put conditions on that love. It was only when the bio mum left a message on my phone effectively letting me go that I got back in contact. We haven't seen each other for close to 4 years.

Quote from: Dread_Faery on November 01, 2014, 02:16:27 PM
I walked away from my family after they claimed to love me unconditionally, yet still put conditions on that love. It was only when the bio mum left a message on my phone effectively letting me go that I got back in contact. We haven't seen each other for close to 4 years.

My mom and sis were estranged to me for ten years, they finally reneged and we were reunited about a month before my mom dropped dead.

Quote from: Shantel on November 01, 2014, 12:18:23 PM
Respect isn't and shouldn't ever be imparted carte blanche to anyone. It has to be earned and thus deserved. I don't respect generals, kings and presidents, I respect the rank or office, but the individual has to earn my respect. There were things about my own parents that I disrespected, they deserved and earned that from me, on the other hand they had many other fine attributes that I came to respect and I loved them simply because they were my parents and give them credit for doing the best they were intellectually and emotionally equipped to do as parents.

I was fortunate with my parents and while they are imperfect they try their best to understand and to support even when they have found it challenging, costly and inexplicable. 

Having now come out to my father, wife, son, daughter and niece I now need to make the decision as to whether I share this with other members of the family.  At this stage I don't see the need for a broader communication as it will necessarily, or at least be likely to, cause a number of negative and damaging reactions.  The consequence is that some members of my family now know me as who I am, authentic, vulnerable and exposed - while others know someone else. 

Yes, I do feel that I am being less than honest and that my relationships are therefore not what they could be - but I still feel that the slow exposure and expression  of myself in one on one conversations, conducted at a time that seems appropriate, protects and best honours the family, our particular relationship and myself.

The fear is that this is an illusion and that there will be resentment or at least disappointment, if some find out from others ahead of my personal disclosure.

Thoughts?

Safe travels

Aisla

Quote from: Aisla on November 01, 2014, 03:24:07 PM
Having now come out to my father, wife, son, daughter and niece I now need to make the decision as to whether I share this with other members of the family.  At this stage I don't see the need for a broader communication as it will necessarily, or at least be likely to, cause a number of negative and damaging reactions.  The consequence is that some members of my family now know me as who I am, authentic, vulnerable and exposed - while others know someone else. 

Yes, I do feel that I am being less than honest and that my relationships are therefore not what they could be - but I still feel that the slow exposure and expression  of myself in one on one conversations, conducted at a time that seems appropriate, protects and best honours the family, our particular relationship and myself.

The fear is that this is an illusion and that there will be resentment or at least disappointment, if some find out from others ahead of my personal disclosure.

Thoughts?

Safe travels

Aisla

I don't think so, this has been my own approach. I think it's thoughtful and considerate and have approached each on the basis of their need to know. Obviously some members on the other side of the country that I may probably never see again or at least have limited contact with don't really need to have their serenity disrupted, but if they are curious and have gotten wind of my changes, then I will be more than happy to discuss it with them on a one-on-one basis. It's worked well for me thus far. I wouldn't appreciate an explosive in-your-face confrontational coming out to me by any family member if things were reversed, so I think it's the right way to go.

Quote from: Aisla on November 01, 2014, 02:56:21 PM
I was fortunate with my parents and while they are imperfect they try their best to understand and to support even when they have found it challenging, costly and inexplicable.

This is what I was trying to communicate about my own, personal situation. Which I clearly failed to do. (Forgive me, I was well on my way to blind drunk.  ) Taka and others, I'm sorry if it seemed like I was saying that one necessarily owes respect to family, regardless of their behavior and treatment of you. That's not how I feel at all.

What I was trying to say is that I struggle with the expectations of my parents simply because they have earned my respect. I don't pedestalize my mother and father. My childhood wasn't perfect -- my mom once sat me down and said, straight up, "We regret the way we raised you." -- but it was overflowing with love. They are good people who would fight the world for me, and I genuinely feel that I owe them a debt of gratitude for that.

But that, in and of itself, can make for sticky, uncomfortable feelings. My parents want nothing but the best for me, but that doesn't mean they've never been harsh, misguided, or ignorant. Sometimes painfully so. In my ugliest moments, I've wished that they were flagrantly abusive and intolerant, so that I could walk away, vindicated and absolved of guilt. But they're not, and it snatches the wind from my sails when I'm feeling all full of righteous anger. At the end of the day, this is a relationship that I do want to maintain.

Will try to comment better later....my mom does not know, my sister's don't, extended wife's side don't.  All for different reasons.  My daughter who I came out to eighteen months ago revealed in a letter yesterday that it messed with her head.  I am reevaluating presentations now.  Thought she was fine, she instead is trying to be fine and hiding some level of discomfort.

Meanwhile I am out more and more with the wife but not outside the home.

It's complicated.

More later.

Satinjoy