Sorry for a downer and potentially toxic thread, especially for newbies.  Newbies may not be able to handle some of it.

What has the cost been for you of being Nonbinary trans

My wife says I aged twenty years this morning, in one year.  I can't see it.

I need this new body and like much of the emotions.

I love the friendships.
Emotionally, I struggle daily.
Usually with fear.

I don't want sympathy.

I doubt that I am alone on this.

Hormones cost a full weeks paycheck.

Does it get better?
What has been good and not good for you?  The costs, what it bought you, the rewards.

Satinjoy

My darling Satinjoy, I know how old you are, and you look wonderful.  I think your SO is a little jealous, but you might try eating a bit more or maybe I would just like to be thinner   Better?  It seems to change and for me becoming more normal.  I have made different choices than you and that makes it simpler.  I look pretty androgynous, but present as feminine, and in a binary world that is perceived as less confrontational.

You present as who you must with courage and honor, and the dysphoria never seems to fully abate.  I don't know if your path will ever be easy, but it is authentic and Satinjoy is beautiful and I love you.  Talk to you soon kiddo,

Julie

I would like to look thinner but my skeletal structure won't allow it.
The emotional aspect of that is that being chunky and feeling fat at times affects my self esteem adversely.

Dysphoria is all but nonexistent for me, I'm at a good place and my marital relationship is solid.
My spouse made an important pronouncement on two occasions recently that she noticed how naturally I am able to think and converse on the same female level as she and have such caring empathy for others. I've known this for some time, she has also been observing this for some time and finally just acknowledged it and concluded that she loves how much that has brought us so much closer. (In her mind something clicked: "So it's not just another phase after all!")
In short a lot of conversation, time and patience has paid big emotional dividends for both of us. Early on it was nip and tuck, we came close to parting ways.

Self destructive compulsion and behaviors are gone.  So is deception of my wife, I am who I am.

A mix of physical and emotional cost, I began overeating to compensate for my lack of control over my emotions and may have been partly my denial of my non-binary identity.

Have since made changes to my lifestyle. My body isn't ideal at all, thankfully, the weight is dropping off slowly but steadily. I looked in the mirror this morning and I liked what I saw - I even thought I was attractive! Usually, my eyes stare right at my facial hair and the rough appearance of my skin, and I go, "Eugh." but today, it was as if something had been switched on inside my brain. I looked straight into my eyes, seeing the whole of myself without focusing on the facial hair or masculine traits that trigger dysphoria and depression.

Just looking into my reflection's eyes, I felt like I was looking at my own soul. For the first time in a long time, I felt genuinely happy with myself.

There are costs of being trans non-binary but there are also perks.

Everyone here is beautiful inside and out. 

emotional costs have been worst when i tried living someone else's life.
talking about myself, the real me, to the school nurse i met on friday, was very emotional, made me feel like crying. but it was also a good feeling, wanting to cry the same way as when finally coming home after a long and perilous journey.
there may be emotional costs to being out in the open about it, but i think the emotional cost of limiting oneself is much higher. anyone who is willing to pay that cost for the sake of love is worthy of a whole lot of respect.

i know i'll have support when i manage to take the step out. i believe it will take some medication for most people to notice anything properly, but i have at least a few people around me who i know will support me no matter what.
i have no fear, fearing myself would be stupid (though i did it for many years before realizing), and fearing society is pointless. family or the loss of it, is something to fear though. i don't have that, the most important members are difficult to lose. my daughter belongs to me whether she wants it or not (a reason to be considerate of her though), anf her sister's mother is already supportive of me wanting to be me.

Thank you dear ones...you all are to me you know...

Shantel that's exactly what is needed, Julie and taka you always hit it, jayce....listen dear one....

The key to me living dual binary genderqueer presenting is the eyes and the core.

I got my hormone letter the day I said I always see a woman looking back out of my eyes.  Now I see more, but focus is key.

The only way I can do all this is keep my eyes on the god of my understanding, Christ, and keep his spirit connected in the core.

But failing that, it is essential that I validate, core, then eyes, then components.

Otherwise I fold up like I did this week.

Blessings

Satinjoy

OK, I hope this is not misunderstood, but here it goes.

The reason I worry so much about you SJ is all the topics you have created lately deal with loss, pain and how to if possible live duality like you are. There is so much anguish, indecision and torment in your words. That said you are not doing as well as you try to tell us. You are struggling to maintain everything like it was before (family, work, etc.), yet transition at the same time. You have been on the edge for way to long now with no relief in site. I fear you are going to totally lose it and every day I read the forum I expect bad news. I am NOT JUDGING you or how you want to live, just pointing out it is not working healthily for you. You basically have lives on the end of three ropes and yet only two hands. Something has to give. I do not say this with anything, but love and caring. You really need to sit down and decide what works best for you and this is not it. 

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on November 16, 2014, 04:39:30 PM
OK, I hope this is not misunderstood, but here it goes.

The reason I worry so much about you SJ is all the topics you have created lately deal with loss, pain and how to if possible live duality like you are. There is so much anguish, indecision and torment in your words. That said you are not doing as well as you try to tell us. You are struggling to maintain everything like it was before (family, work, etc.), yet transition at the same time. You have been on the edge for way to long now with no relief in site. I fear you are going to totally lose it and every day I read the forum I expect bad news. I am NOT JUDGING you or how you want to live, just pointing out it is not working healthily for you. You basically have lives on the end of three ropes and yet only two hands. Something has to give. I do not say this with anything, but love and caring. You really need to sit down and decide what works best for you and this is not it. 

Yes this is being misunderstood. I'm not understanding why that is when we are a support forum that anyone would continually return and continue to intimidate someone they know is struggling by continuously insinuating by their unwanted comments that they are a failure? I don't understand that and neither does anyone else here. When we have a person and other persons here who have heroically made selfless compromises to keep hearth and home intact and maintain their familial relationships in the face of sometimes extreme dysphoric pressure while others feel free to trash their own wives and children to achieve their goals. Explain that to me, why is that?

SJ, I'm afraid I can't be of much help here. You are made of stronger stuff than I. I knew I wouldn't be able resist the pull of transition and that it would destroy me if I tried.

Best I can do is send you a hug, good thoughts, and a reminder to listen to your heart and whatever it's telling you. You have inside you the wisdom to know the right path and the courage to get there.

Quote from: Shantel on November 16, 2014, 05:14:13 PM
while others feel free to trash their own wives and children to achieve their goals.

I have never posted anything this inflammatory myself. I TRASHED them to achieve my goals? That was out of line in any decent conversation. Our relationship is over now. I will have other Moderators act on your postings from now on to maintain propriety and integrity. Good day to you.

Jessica did not trash anyone's beliefs. She merely told a truth that anyone in the trans world knows - that you cannot Bury your true identity, that suppressing who you truly are will bring misery, depression or worse.

That true identity may be non-binary or it may be binary but the truth we all know is that you must be authentic to yourself.  SJ is holding the true identity in check to satisfy the opinions of others. It is a heroic effort worthy of admiration but it still involves living a lie.

IMO Shantel, you owe Jessica an apology

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on November 16, 2014, 04:39:30 PM
.. That said you are not doing as well as you try to tell us. You are struggling to maintain everything like it was before (family, work, etc.), yet transition at the same time. You have been on the edge for way to long now with no relief in site. I fear you are going to totally lose it and every day I read the forum I expect bad news. I am NOT JUDGING you or how you want to live, just pointing out it is not working healthily for you. ...

All this may well be true (though none of us know SJ's situation as well as zie does),  but saying it, and saying it repeatedly, may do more harm than good.

I had a therapist, a very good one.  But one of her weaknesses was that when she saw something that she thought a patient should see about themselves, she wouldn't shut up about it, even when it was obvious that repeating her insights was actually getting in the way of her patients' seeing them..  (I was in a therapy group with her, so I got to see this play out with other people, not just me.)   I never could convince her that sometimes you have to let people discover these insights for themselves.  I eventually progressed to the point where this habit  was a major stumbling block in my therapy, and I quit.

There is an enormous temptation wen we see someone suffering, especially those of us who were raised male, to want to fix things, to give sage advice, to straighten people out.  Back when I was married, if my wife was complaining about something, I would often do this, and boy, did she not appreciate it!  Sometimes people just need to vent and to have people nod their heads or say sympathetic phrases (or maybe offer a hug) and not have people try to "help."

(Edited to add:)

I think that most of the time, we already at some level know the things that wiser heads are trying to tell us, but we aren't psychologically in shape to handle them.  "Seeing" something is often a matter of developing the trust in ourselves and enough sense of having value to the point where we can handle it.  You don't throw a child who's afraid of water over their head into the deep end of the pool, you let them take the deeper water at their own pace.  In the same way, you don't throw someone into an insight, but rather let them absorb it at a pace they're comfortable with.

Everyone stop, immediately

Thanks.

As SJ said time to step back some on how the posts are coming across.

They are non productive.

Close eye in the topic.

Izzy

I do not understand being gender binary, neither do I understand being gender fluid.  What I do understand is love, courage, strength and hope.  That is what I see in Satinjoy.  That is what I see in everyone here who is courageous enough to put the emotions and even lives on the line in a public and honest way.

I get concern and fear, but I also get choice and support.  To choose transition over family takes courage.  It is what I had to do at least initially.  To choose family over transition is heroic, but it may also be ultimately destructive, I honestly do not know.  I am here to catch the fallen, bind their wounds, kiss them and hold them until they can either make different choices or find another way to an authentic life.

I do not, and have no business judging or commenting on anyone's  else's pilgrimage, except as it intersects my own or to share my experience strength and hope with them if that lightens their burden.  And to only listen and offer support if it does not.  I do not have the wisdom to instruct or to dictate a path, any path, because mine can never be yours nor yours mine.  We each must find our own way and it is my privilege to offer insight as I see it, and to not be threatened if it is refused.

I wish us all authenticity, I wish us all peace.

Shalom,

Julie

"Nails out, hair flowing, heart wide open, flying free as trans non-binary"

One of SJ's many inspirational signatures

I do somewhat understand SJ's situation, I won't say I claim to know it entirely because that would be false. I am out as non-binary to my mother but for sake of appearances in family, I remain their son. I dabble in make-up, wigs and feminine clothing behind closed doors where I feel most comfortable. Do I dare dream of strutting out of the house or family in full-female clothes? Most absolutely not. Would I present myself as such in front of accepting friends? In all chances, probably yes.

In all situations, I am still myself... the son, the girl, the femboy... they are all me. Just like a mother can be a woman, daughter, wife and Candy-Crush fanatic!

SJ, you are and will always continue to be an inspiration to me. The more I read your posts, the more I see parallels of my life in it.

Let's hold hands and fly, big sis!

With our hearts wide open, nails out, hair flowing, lots of lace and frills and oh my, a cheeky surprise for those who catch a glimpse of these fairies' cute panties~

Jacey 

I am getting rather tired of some attitudes being expressed. Firstly I shall post two relevant Terms of Service. I suggest they are read and understood.


7. Leave moderation to the moderators! Susan and her staff are the only people who are authorized to deny anyone access to this web site including telling someone to leave, or to stop discussing a topic.  If someone wishes to discuss a subject that you are not interested in,  suggest a new subject; go to another of the many areas on this site; or ignore that person, topic, or discussion. Members should immediately report any messages both public and private that they feel may possibly be abusive, inappropriate, unwelcome, or unsolicited contact attempts, to staff using the Report links in posts and personal messages.

10. Bashing or flaming of any individuals or groups is not acceptable behavior on this web site and will not be tolerated in the slightest for any reason.  This includes but is not limited to:
Advocating the separation or exclusion of one or more group from under the Transgender umbrella term
Suggesting or claiming that one segment or sub-segment of our community is more or less legitimate, deserving, or real than any others


The first ToS is clear. There is no restriction on who posts in what topic. If there is a problem with inappropriate post they are to be reported to staff. If there are reports that concern a staff member they are reported to either myself or Susan. If there is concern about my actions report them to Susan.

I will not tolerate the moderation of boards by members.

The second ToS I have posted is also very clear.

There is no exclusion of any group by another. Every segment of our community is as equal as all.
Just in case that isn't clear: People who identify as binary, non-binary, crossdresser, transgender, transexual, drag king, drag queen, gender fluid, or any other identification are as welcome and as equal as each other. I shall not tolerate people who express opinion to the contrary.

If any members think that this is not to their liking, they can leave.

That said, there will be questions and posts from one group to another that may be seen as inappropriate, unfeeling or unwarranted. If this occurs report them.
But before getting upset about a post that maybe questioning have a think about what it means. Is it just someone trying to understand others in the fantastic spectrum of gender that we have here? Or is it deliberately provocative?

We are human beings with the frailty that comes with that. We have the extra burden of having gender identification issues. We make mistakes, some are intentional, some are not.

I will forgive the unintentional, particularly if an apology is made.

I shall act on the intentional.

These rules also apply to personal messages. Anyone receiving inappropriate personal messages are to report them. They will also be acted upon.

These comments apply to all members, be they newbies, long standing or staff, including GM's and Admin.

There is one difference. Staff and ex-staff are aware that I expect a far higher standard than from the general members.

I'm locking this topic and I want people to have a long look at themselves.