Hi girls,

I am very torn. I just don't know what to do with my life. I already which hospitals to go, and here most health care is covered by the state unless it's like cosmetic surgery. So I am going to go as soon as I can for psychology assessments and consultations. The thing is, I don't have my mom's support. Anyone's for that matter. And I'm thinking I may need to start HRT because I just... need it. But I may not be able to. But I desperately want it.

But if I do start it, will changes be very noticeable? I know about boobs but my mom is a 34B and I think my sister is even a little smaller so I'm one hundred percent sure I'm not going to be busty. And that's fine to me, cause it would mean I would have more time to hide changes. I honestly want to present more feminine but IDK if I am able to. I already pluck my eyebrows, don't have much facial hair, am skinny, not too tall (close to 5'6 but not quite), and my speaking range is naturally around 250-260 Hz, though I'm trying to lower it just a tiny bitz so I sound more adult. But I don't want to pass yet. It'd be a problem if I suddenly didn't pass as man even dressed in male clothes, my mom would definitely suspect and 'm afraid of what she could do. I have been m'amed two times actually by two taxi drivers and I'm 18, but I think one was just teasing me because of my voice... the other seemed to genuinely think I was a girl... he talked to me the whole drive and I was dressed male and with a male haircut... so it's definitely weird. But yeah I obviously pass as male all the time but as a younger boy. But when I was 15... I was asked by two people if I was a boy or a girl. and one lady talked to me with female pronouns and all despite my presentation.

Okay... This is obviously rare but it has happened. And I'm worried. Is it too risky for me to start HRT and continue to present male... will changes be very noticeable? I honestly want to look like a girl but I don't want my mom to suspect of anything...so yeah. A paradox.

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=15wfqqv&s=8#.VHNXh8kVBEO
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=nx3mex&s=8#.VHNXk8kVBEO
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=296i1zs&s=8#.VHNXnskVBEO
...this is me..um...

http://vocaroo.com/i/s1PWGAz5kejA
That is my voice... yeah, AWK. lol it may look fun and maybe I'm lucky but it has given me problems presenting male.

The people you see daily most likely wont notice changes.  However, the people you see just on occasion, will notice there is something different about you.

Any changes that HRT will give you won't happen over night. Obviously no two people are the same in terms of their development, and so it would be hard to say how HRT would affect you. You do have age on your side, so changes may be more pronounced over a shorter period of time, but as Alexis has noted, the people you see the most frequent will be the ones least likely to see the gradual changes.

You sound like you would have a pretty good transition.

The best time to transition is as early as possible to around 23 to 25.
the first 6 months will have the most change after that development is gradual.
Breast size usually is a cup below the mother's breast size.

Judging from your photos you already look pretty feminine and imagining you with different clothes for me would do the trick, and maybe a different hairstyle or something..? I don't know this isn't do I pass or not . But since I am not on HRT yet I judge from what I have seen. Some MtF have beards, mustaches, short hair and are very broad. I believe they will see the changes the quickest because it is a lot more drastic. While if you have a feminine face already.. I just don't think it will change so much, so fast, that anyone will be pass-able without changing anything other than starting with HRT.

But those are just my two cents D:

I do think it is important to find someone in your life who knows and supports you though. But! That is up to you. I do not think HRT will out you in male clothes. Not because you won't be pass-able but because being read as feminine is being read as feminine. It won't change into feminine v2.0.

Like Leila pointed out changes are slow... No-one that sees you daily is likely to notice except when comparing older photos.

I'm on HRT for 3 months now, out to no-one but myself. Mom says my skin looks better than ever, better than most females. I'm 100% sure she noticed about my hips and breasts though... So I guess it's all a matter of time...

How about running a T blocker without E? That would prevent you from gaining further male features and no-one would notice.

Quote from: Indoctrinated on November 24, 2014, 10:39:11 AM
Like Leila pointed out changes are slow... No-one that sees you daily is likely to notice except when comparing older photos.

I'm on HRT for 3 months now, out to no-one but myself. Mom says my skin looks better than ever, better than most females. I'm 100% sure she noticed about my hips and breasts though... So I guess it's all a matter of time...

How about running a T blocker without E? That would prevent you from gaining further male features and no-one would notice.

I definitely could do that... But sooner or later, I will have to take oestrogen or health risks are greatly increased... Or not? Really. I'm afraid.

Kirey, thank you. I think you are right that maybe I won't notice much difference too soon as I'm not uber-masculine and I hope nobody notices as well. But it may be a bit unrealistic to expect people not to notice anything at all. IDK... Btw, Kirey, how can you not be on HRT?? You look so feminine. And so pretty.

I might suggest just being really honest about your concerns when you go in for your consult, and your endo if you do go in to talk about starting HRT. They might be able to help you find the balance you are looking for.

I'm not sure about taking blockers long term without E, but as another potential option, I can tell you in my case, my doctor started me off with both blockers and E at really low doses for the first few months just to get a bit of a baseline for how much I'd react to them and check for side effects. During that time, I didn't really have many changes that anyone would notice, but I did have some little ones: my skin was a bit softer, really increased sense of smell (which I thought was totally weird!), and such, but definitely only things I would really notice.

I totally understand the need to start HRT "because I just... need it", and I found for me even thought there were only these little changes, and very small doses, just being on them almost instantly made me feel so much more at peace.

Maybe you, and your doctors, could consider doing something like that, and just staying at that level until you're comfortable enough to take the next step afterwards?

Like I said, maybe just another option to consider.

Giselle Marie

Quote from: Giselle.Marie on November 24, 2014, 11:55:10 AM
I might suggest just being really honest about your concerns when you go in for your consult, and your endo if you do go in to talk about starting HRT. They might be able to help you find the balance you are looking for.

I'm not sure about taking blockers long term without E, but as another potential option, I can tell you in my case, my doctor started me off with both blockers and E at really low doses for the first few months just to get a bit of a baseline for how much I'd react to them and check for side effects. During that time, I didn't really have many changes that anyone would notice, but I did have some little ones: my skin was a bit softer, really increased sense of smell (which I thought was totally weird!), and such, but definitely only things I would really notice.

I totally understand the need to start HRT "because I just... need it", and I found for me even thought there were only these little changes, and very small doses, just being on them almost instantly made me feel so much more at peace.

Maybe you, and your doctors, could consider doing something like that, and just staying at that level until you're comfortable enough to take the next step afterwards?

Like I said, maybe just another option to consider.

Giselle Marie

I am not sure if it's possible. I think you have to go all way here in my countryreally fast... or they'll think you're not genuinely transsexual. True story. Even though, it's covered, the system is kinda oppressive... But I think it may be better today. I am just not sure. To me it would be a tragedy, well I'd love it, but it'd be horrible cause of my parents, if I suddenly didn't pass as male in male clothes and with short hair... I would be soooo doomed.

I see people who do not know I am on HRT every day. I have been on E almost a year and spiro for 6 months. Since the spiro the changes have been a lot more but still...
They don't know nothin.

I do look quite different too 

I've been on a year and they're pretty noticeable

Quote from: Alexis2107 on November 24, 2014, 10:07:57 AM
The people you see daily most likely wont notice changes.  However, the people you see just on occasion, will notice there is something different about you.

Isn't it the other way around?

Quote from: Jessika on November 24, 2014, 05:12:56 PM
Isn't it the other way around?

No its usually that way o.o

I'll be three months on HRT at the end of this month and there are definite changes. I have noticeable breast growth which I try not to draw attention to by layering and keeping my shoulders pushed forward. My complexion has changed, my skin is softer, my facial features have begun to change. I've always been androgynous and my long hair and pierced ears only added to it but these days I called ma'am or she pretty much constantly. My chest, despite my efforts, gets a second look all the time. I always have a flannel on whenever I'm just wearing a tshirt.

Now, having said that, I will point out that I'm intersexed so my results may be atypical. As always, YMMV

I don't think so but my old friend literally didn't even want to look at me when I saw him last week because apparently I looked that much like a girl & it was making him feel weird :p It's been 15 months on HRT though & the last time I saw him was maybe 2 months on HRT

Quote from: Auroramarianna on November 24, 2014, 11:05:32 AM
Kirey, thank you. I think you are right that maybe I won't notice much difference too soon as I'm not uber-masculine and I hope nobody notices as well. But it may be a bit unrealistic to expect people not to notice anything at all. IDK... Btw, Kirey, how can you not be on HRT?? You look so feminine. And so pretty.

Thank you ^^!

Going full-time is a must there, but when do you or they think it can be called full-time? Women also wear jeans and simple t-shirts. You don't have to dress that much differently to wear the same clothes as a woman. I literally had that discussion for a year at the hospital. They expected fake breasts, heels, red lipstick (slut in the making =/?) and to come in dresses and I kept arguing that it is more than just that.

I wish I could show my sisters. One of them is very feminine, girly. The other wears jogging pants, a simple top and doesn't wears make-up. They both never doubted their gender. But if I would dress the same as the sister wearing jogging pants then they want to say they think I do not want to be seen as a woman? Pretty silly, if you ask me.

Quote from: Alexis2107 on November 24, 2014, 10:07:57 AM
The people you see daily most likely wont notice changes.  However, the people you see just on occasion, will notice there is something different about you.

This is very true. Including myself, those that see me daily really don't notice too much of a change, unless I do something a little more drastic and pierce my ears. But then there's those that don't see me to often, like some people at work. We're a large company spread across many locations so some people won't see me for months. But when they do, they mention that there's something different about me. So I would say your mum would be in the former group, seeing you every day I don't think she'll notice.

Well, they probably notice it but can't place it. Like the first time you pluck your eyebrows or if you only wear a little foundation. Even if you got a slight haircut. When you think of someone (imagine you have to picture/draw someone), you can't. So when you see someone real time you often notice something is off.. but you can't place it.

Perfect for HRT !

Changes are slow, although some have quite dramatic results in a year (check on forums, especially the younger you are)... for me, late in life took about 5~6 years, last 5~6 have been less obvious changes... But those that are close tend not to notice (too much), those that are less frequently seen may detect changes, but they tend to be subliminal... Breasts however can be noticeable, as my grandkids keep pointing out 
Awkward as I have not come out yet!!!!

Love Katy

Quote from: BreezyB on November 25, 2014, 05:06:58 AM
This is very true. Including myself, those that see me daily really don't notice too much of a change, unless I do something a little more drastic and pierce my ears.

-snip-

I wrote about this a while ago on Susan's and I managed to shock myself one day when after I hadn't applied make up for a quite a while (on account of it being too hot to do so), my mind was unable to resolve the face it saw of myself as actually being me. I mean obviously it was me, but in my mind's eye it didn't seem so. The changes were so gradual that I grew accustomed to them and believed this was still part of my pre-HRT face. By applying the make up, it accentuated the developing feminine softening of my face beyond what my mind had expected me to look like, so it's not just other people that just get used to seeing what they think they see. It took me a while to adjust to the changes. After a year I see less of my older self even without the make up now, but it took me a lot of time to get used to this.