In the wake of my latest dating goof-up, I'm troubled at the pattern that seems to be emerging:

It seems like we're having a good time. She seems interested in what I have to say and open and comfortable talking about herself. I'm surprised when I find out that she has no interest in me romantically.

When I was a male dating females, those were all indications that she wanted me to ask her out again. Some good dates in a row like that were usually an indication that she wanted our connection to be romantic.

Neither of those things seem to hold true for lesbian dating.

Among the ten or so lesbian woman I've gone on dates with, not one of them has actually ended up interested in me romantically (though several have said I'm a nice person and they might be interested in a friendship).

Therefore, I'm realizing I have no idea with a successful lesbian date actually "looks" like.

I mean if the tallest building you've ever seen or heard of is three stories high, you really won't have much of a conception of what it means when a building really is tall.

For those who are experienced in dating lesbians and have had at least one connection turn romantic, what did those early dates look like? How could you tell that she was interested and that it was the right time for things to go further?

The only lesbian experience I ever had is when I got picked up in a bar because  she really liked my hair. I had hair down my back and my hair is naturally quite feminine. We went back to my place and slept together naked , but she didn't want to have sex and I never saw her again.

I'm sorry that you are having trouble connecting with someone on a romantic level. It seems like you are primarily doing online dating, and since that doesn't seem to be working for you, it may be time to focus on other ways to meet someone. If I remember correctly, I think that you also tried outings through meetup.com, and it didn't work out, but I don't think you should give that up. Just go out, and do what you enjoy doing the most, and eventually you will click with someone.

First date ends at the U-haul, with one of you renting a moving van.



I've only dated a few lesbians, two of which ended up romantically involved.

The first was *very* platonic at first, but over a few months developed into an intense physical relationship but burned out quickly. The second was intensely physical at first, and has become much more emotionally intimate over time.

I have been groped by lesbians at bars, a combination of drinking and curiosity to know if my breasts were real...and me being somewhat slutty when drunk, I complied. But like all such, once their curiosity was sated, I was dismissed. (But damn it felt good LOL)

I'd suggest to let things go slow...don't expect or indicate you want something more. Just be friends, and go on girl dates until things happen, if they do.

Its not bad being in the friend zone of a lesbian...she may be a good source for training in "the lesbian way."

As a true virgin I am not the one to be posting on this thread but it sound like women are relating to you as another woman or in other words, as one of the girls. I guess that's success, just not the type you are after.

Quote
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,155662.msg1696144.html#msg1696144

Don't.
Know you are a decent human being and you will find someone in time. Try to relax.

Physical attributes are not everything.
Look around. There are people who would be considered not excessively attractive together with gorgeous people. Why ? Because they have a nice personality, are sensible, support other people, have a sense of humour... those are attributes which simply need to be shown to attract others.

I'd say be a bit more outgoing, show some interest in others, ask interested questions and listen... then the next question, maybe interceded by a short story of yourself... just being interested in people...

showing some humour helps... seeing things from the funny side...

and one or two cheeky questions or remarks after some time... not only keeping on the friendship level...

this are things most people can do, it just has to be shown... you might try to practise this by doing a bit of this in daily life... just being a bit more outgoing...

You could try to think about what person you would like for a few days... taking one or two hours off... what person to have around... a more outgoing person... a more silent one... just a bit of an impression, thinking about it for a day or two... and then relax, see what comes along and be a bit active yourself...

you could do a few things you like and could bring you in contact with other persons... lgbt events... a cooking course for women... a food tasting course for women... volunteering... etc...


hugs

Quote from: Beth Andrea on June 13, 2015, 02:32:37 PM
First date ends at the U-haul, with one of you renting a moving van.

OMG Beth you totally nailed it!

I've dated three men and three women in my life. Four of them in my 30 years+ as a postop woman.

I was going to say... you know that thing that happens with a super hot guy when you are trying to play it cool and not end up in bed on the first date, and yet somehow you do? (yes sorry perhaps a silly question - I am bi of course... but you get the image.)

Yeah so in my experience a successful lesbian date is the one where you end up back at hers and staying for Breakfast - and then you start planning to move it together, and yes it does happen. Many lesbians seem very highly sexed, not all, but more than is the case with straight women I've found.

Quote from: Rejennyrated on June 13, 2015, 04:22:48 PM
OMG Beth you totally nailed it!

I've dated three men and three women in my life. Four of them in my 30 years+ as a postop woman.

I was going to say... you know that thing that happens with a super hot guy when you are trying to play it cool and not end up in bed on the first date, and yet somehow you do? (yes sorry perhaps a silly question - I am bi of course... but you get the image.)

Yeah so in my experience a successful lesbian date is the one where you end up back at hers and staying for Breakfast - and then you start planning to move it together, and yes it does happen. Many lesbians seem very highly sexed, not all, but more than is the case with straight women I've found.

Yes.
But sometimes you have to hint at it to keep the juices flowing... if you know what I mean...
otherwise its possible you have simply a friendly conversation...

hugs

Having had only one lesbian date, which wasn't successful, I can't really give you solid signs or indications. But I should hasten to add I wasn't that interested in her anyway, especially not after she expressed her admiration for one of the most lunatic extreme right wing fringe wannabe politicians in Australia. She wasn't a good match for me so it didn't bother me it didn't work out. But we still talked for over three hours.

Likewise I've been on plenty of dates with women in dude mode where we talked for hours but which ultimately went nowhere. Even if it was multiple dates. All were romantic fizzers for them and me. But then I was never into being romantic, it always felt so confected. There was only one woman I ever went out with that I actually felt a strong connection to and she for me...and I have to say I didn't find her very physically attractive at all but there was something about her that really turned me on. I feel it boils down to chemistry - and I don't mean to be trite or cliche by saying that. Either there's a two way connection or not.

The only "successful lesbian dates" I've seen have been in TV shows like Orphan Black but those involve young and feminine women and are no doubt fanciful fictions. Sense8 depicted a lesbian relationship with one of the partners being trans, but the dating process wasn't really touched on and the characters were young (30s?) and attractive. Realistic? Dunno. I have some lesbian friends in relationships, I guess I should get some advice from them.

But yeah, chemistry - what is that elusive thing? And is it different for women who like women?

I guess my advice, for what it is worth coming from an unsuccessful one timer, is to relax, enjoy your time together. That way you can see if she is contributing enthusiastically to the conversation and check her interaction/body language towards you. It took me a long time to realise that just because a woman is talking to me (even for hours) it doesn't mean she's interested in having a relationship with me. Women are usually complex and each totally different from the other, trying to work out what they mean by what they say and do is a slippery slope to going insane... so just go with the flow. Even if someone seems interested they might not be. I knew a woman who was in a hetro relationship, she was attractive and vibrant and a total flirt, it drove most men nuts but I just knew it was her way of interacting with people so I kept myself aloof from all that.

Anyway, I'm rambling, sorry.

I'd say try and mix it up - if you get a second date maybe make it less of a sit down and chatting date and more of a going somewhere and walking around doing something date, try to allow it to be a bit random, relaxed and fun. If you have the tendency to talk about the troubles of the world (one of my pitfalls), don't. If you have a tendency to be a bit negative/cynical (again, one of my tendencies) then keep it fun and positive.

Yeah, I dunno - sounds like I'm writing advice for myself, not for you. Lol!

Good luck, Suzi, you will meet someone who you click with and who clicks with you. It may take one date or it may take several but when the chemistry happens you'll feel it.

There are YouTube videos which show lesbian relationships...just fyi.

Some are funny, but if you are familiar with hetero relationships its interesting to see how they differ.

Successful lesbian date for me = clever conversation, kisses and cuddles :~)

  Sigh....  I look back at how everyone reacted towards me under any sort of circumstances - the moment anyone gets to know me it's always been guaranteed friend-zone time.  It makes me almost not even want to try dating post-transition because I'm certain the same thing is going to happen again.  Now instead of the "nice-guy" excuse they'll have the fun new card of non-op trans to play against me, you know in the same 'not trying to be mean' sorta way.

  The only girl who ever seemed fully intent on pursuing romantic/sexual relations with me (when I was a guy) I had to break off with before it went anywhere because I knew I was going to transition and I figured out our dominance dynamic was not what she needed (and she couldn't see it for herself).

  Personally, I don't feel like I 'fit' the whole dating scene mindset.  There's absolutely no way I'd ever try online dating or blind dates especially.  I have a strong instinctive need to become good friends with someone before I can consider romance/intimacy.  This doesn't work for most people because their minds work the other way round.

  All I can suggest, Suzi, is to try other avenues for meeting people because otherwise you may just keep finding dates that have only one kind of dating mindset.  (I refer to this phenomenon as "pre-programmed", where prospective dates are completely set in a rigid structure of how things are supposed to be and progress and how you're expected to respond at every step.)

Hi Suzi,

I am walking down that road recently. Though I am particularly having crush on another MtF.

As an approach, I won't do anything different than what I did before. I make the first move, invite to have a chat at a relaxing place. Bar, restaurant, walking through the beautiful Amsterdam... there I'd try to spark her interest, but also to feel how ready she is for a relationship. Some persons just don't have any relationship in sight.

First big step i actually getting her interested in having a relationship and also having it with you. From there, imagination is your best friend. I'd like holding hand of each other and moving slowly towards ending up together in bed.

So, if you have a particular person you are interested in, you are on a good way. If you can, just don't invest too many emotions in someone who might be uninterested or taken. Find it out early...

Good luck!

Quote from: Beth Andrea on June 13, 2015, 05:25:19 PM
but if you are familiar with hetero relationships its interesting to see how they differ.

I'd hope it is more girly stuff all over the place! <3 Isn't that right?

Quote from: Ms Grace on June 13, 2015, 05:16:45 PM
It took me a long time to realise that just because a woman is talking to me (even for hours) it doesn't mean she's interested in having a relationship with me. Women are usually complex and each totally different from the other, trying to work out what they mean by what they say and do is a slippery slope to going insane... so just go with the flow. Even if someone seems interested they might not be. I knew a woman who was in a hetro relationship, she was attractive and vibrant and a total flirt, it drove most men nuts but I just knew it was her way of interacting with people so I kept myself aloof from all that.

As an aside - this is a very important lesson that I had to learn too Grace. I was looking at the attention I was getting from women from a guys perspective (being a recently minted MTF) when they were looking at it from a female perspective. I was getting an entirely wrong message and fortunately I never tried to act on it, saving myself quite a bit of embarrassment.

It took me awhile to realize that it was not interest/flirting but just how women relate to each other.

As far as grabbing the interest of a lesbian - I have no idea how that works. Like someone else said - i'm demi-romantic - I need to have a friendship with someone before romance can spring up. I'm shy so the idea of dating in any form scares me - my hat is off to those of you that screw up the courage to get out there in the dating world.

Quote
It took me a long time to realise that just because a woman is talking to me (even for hours) it doesn't mean she's interested in having a relationship with me. Women are usually complex and each totally different from the other, trying to work out what they mean by what they say and do is a slippery slope to going insane... so just go with the flow. Even if someone seems interested they might not be. I knew a woman who was in a hetro relationship, she was attractive and vibrant and a total flirt, it drove most men nuts but I just knew it was her way of interacting with people so I kept myself aloof from all that.

Women are emotional beings.
To go in a certain direction it sometimes simply has to be brought up.
For example talking about romantic things... this makes appetite for more... brings the thought up... and makes it much more likely for a person to want to go that way.
Of course its important to see what people have in common. But staying on that level will probably not move things along .

hugs

When you wake up next to her the next morning..

I have not had exactly "lesbian" dates, but was rather trying to expand my social circle and somehow bisexual women started to come up in that setting. Most of stuff was spending a couple of hours for a coffee or tea, or learning some recipes in domestic setting (and nothing sexual came up), but one lady was quite blunt in her statements, namely, we had a curious email exchange afterwards, where she wanted to know what I thought of her and stating that she would not mind to meet up again, because she felt comfortable in our company. Later, again, she sent another message asking what I am up to, if I have any SO and if spring has brought some romantic mood into my head. I pretty much replied that I would love to have a coffee or whatever drink whenever she has time for it, but no romance pls. And that was it - I was kind of surprised that she took quite an active role, and I have to admit that she was everything that a person would have wanted to - smart, witty, good-looking and with great sense of style. It's just there was no chemistry from my part and I did not want to mess with her head. I dunno if that was called a lesbian date, but that sums up my experience so far .

I am bi-sexual.. I have dated a few lesbians.. only one ever ended up in a romantic relationship and even that was a fling. I met her in a lesbian bar, we kinda just hit it off. She was 20 years older than me.. We dated for about 4 months.

She actually had a daughter that was a year younger than me. I never met the daughter as she was not officially out ..I was actually her first lesbian partner.. she was exploring lesbianism. It was a very physical relationship.. the sex was fantastic.

I've had 1 date in the past 14 years (a little over a year ago). That was before I came out to myself as trans. I've never even been in a lesbian relationship. I have a lot of confidence as a transgender girl in general, but practically none when it comes to dating. It seems like it would be asking a lot out of someone. I would be asking them to date me as a pre-op with the potential of me being post-op eventually. Its a major surgery. Its one thing to ask that of someone who already has strong feelings for you, but another for someone you haven't even met yet. I know of one person that I think could handle me on those grounds (I think she's pan and she's extremely loyal to her friends), but I don't think she's interested in me in that way. We're fairly different people from completely different social circles. I like her and I consider her a friend, but I can't comprehend how I would fit into her life. So I just continue to be happy that she's my friend and I leave well enough alone.

Quote from: michellemartine on June 14, 2015, 11:23:59 PM
First big step i actually getting her interested in having a relationship and also having it with you. From there, imagination is your best friend. I'd like holding hand of each other and moving slowly towards ending up together in bed.

Quote from: Rejennyrated on June 13, 2015, 04:22:48 PM
Yeah so in my experience a successful lesbian date is the one where you end up back at hers and staying for Breakfast - and then you start planning to move it together, and yes it does happen. Many lesbians seem very highly sexed, not all, but more than is the case with straight women I've found.

Quote from: SarahBoo on June 14, 2015, 05:44:37 AM
Successful lesbian date for me = clever conversation, kisses and cuddles :~)

Quote from: noleen111 on June 15, 2015, 08:43:30 AM
I met her in a lesbian bar, we kinda just hit it off. She was 20 years older than me.. We dated for about 4 months.

Quote from: kelly_aus on June 15, 2015, 03:48:34 AM
When you wake up next to her the next morning..

Thanks.

So I'm getting a sense that what I should look for is some sort of immediate connection, yes? Someone who seems willing to get physical right away, even if it's only cuddling or holding hands.

How does that happen? How do you telegraph to a woman when you're in a non-private setting that you're willing to get physical on the first date?

Quote from: Laura_7 on June 13, 2015, 03:11:39 PMand one or two cheeky questions or remarks after some time... not only keeping on the friendship level...

I hate to sound clueless and naive, but what sort of questions? What might stay in the realm of respectful, but still get my message across? This doesn't come naturally to me. Am I doomed to stay single?