So I was just curious as to how many mg tablets you are taking now or what your first prescribed dosages were? My Spiro is at twice a day and estradiol is just  twice a day. I think a lot of people do injections too, is that correct?
My doctor is aware of me having been diagnosed with an unrelated mental illness, so I'm not sure if the good doctor is trying to ease me in with smaller doses of estradiol? I think she maybe afraid of making me more uncomfortable mentally than she has to.  a day doesn't sound like a lot but I don't really know. I guess I could ask her too, she is a really nice doctor who has a ton of experience with trans people.


Mod Edit- No dosages please. Dicussion of dosages is also against TOS 5.

Congratulations 

Well someone probably will edit out dosage because of possible misuse by others...

it seems they start you out on a lower dose which is quite normal.

Yes, some people are on injections or implants.
After a period where they can see how you react they might switch you to those.
With injections weekly is preferable imo because with biweekly there might be a low the last few days, which also might affect mood.
There is one form of hrt with injections or implants where estro is driven well into the female range and testo is driven down into the female range as well, without further anti androgens.
You might discuss that with your endo.

With estrogen tablets, sublingual use might be preferrable because of causing less clotting factors by bypassing the liver with intake.
Its also a bit more effective.
Spreading the dose throughout the day might be a good idea, for example four small doses instead of two big ones, so a spike and a low later which might affect mood might be avoided.
You might talk this also through with your endo.

hugs

Hi Astrid Against, welcome to Susan's. Sorry, but no dosages please. Congrats on Starting HRT. I look forward to seeing you around the forums. Good luck and Hugs
Mariah

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Warm welcome to Susan's Astrid

Yeah pretty normal to start on low doses, oh congrats on starting by the way, it's a wonderful thing 

Yes talk more with your Dr...

Look forward to seeing you about the forum's

L Katy 

Congrats on starting your HRT journey and welcome to the forum!! 

Congratulations and Welcome to Susan's.

Congrats on starting HRT! It is a very huge step. Well my case was kinda special due to I have control over my own prescriptions and lab work since the start, But I may be able to help somewhat. Knowing the dosages and educating each other on HRT is a huge step away from ignorance but sadly here that is not allowed so. My medications are  Spironolacton, β17 Estradiol Sublingual, β17 Estradiol trans-dermal gel and Finasteride all taken BID (2 times day) like you. At the beginning my doctor and I started Finasteride and the Spironolactone in an increasing dose tell we reached the max safe dosages. After we started the Estradiol Trans-dermal gel tell we reached a desired lab results. after that we started on the Estradiol Sublingual to aid in keeping blood estradiol higher during low periods of the gels absorption.

I would like to mention now that what mg you take isn't what matters. what matters is your blood work you need to educate yourself and learn what your labs are telling you. doctors will always take the safe rout and you may end up losing out with none effective dosages it is all to common, but you will never know tell you research. people are all to trusting in doctors they spend years getting there license and have plenty of fear of losing it, that fear may be your downfall. But you cant assume your dosage is too low Ive also seen many cases where someone is prescribed way too much then they need. Your best case is to get a second opinion by an endocrinologist that is not prescribing you anything, They wont have any fear of telling you the truth about your dosage as they are not the one writing your prescription and you are not there regular patient.

Also look into and talk to your doctor about trans-dermal medication they are wonderful to your liver and spend less time being metabolized into less beneficial estrogen metabolites. Though they can be inconveniencing depending on your life style.

again, Don't focus on the quantity of your medication! focus on your labs! focus on your health!

I am sorry to interfere , i just have a little question : does the blood levels show something clear for the people like us with the hormones coming from exogen sources ?
I mean the only point of the hormones is to bind with the receptors , then that molecule won't be counted in the blood tests . So saying one gets a big dose through transdermal application (so the absorbtion rate would be better) , yet the blood tests show moderate levels . Could that mean that her / his body used the hormones and be a good thing ?
For the people with endogen hormonal sources the negative feedback would make it possible that the levels stay constant or in a daily cycle , but for us is it the same ?

Quote from: Claudia_FF on August 06, 2015, 01:23:20 AM
I am sorry to interfere , i just have a little question : does the blood levels show something clear for the people like us with the hormones coming from exogen sources ?
I mean the only point of the hormones is to bind with the receptors , then that molecule won't be counted in the blood tests . So saying one gets a big dose through transdermal application (so the absorbtion rate would be better) , yet the blood tests show moderate levels . Could that mean that her / his body used the hormones and be a good thing ?
For the people with endogen hormonal sources the negative feedback would make it possible that the levels stay constant or in a daily cycle , but for us is it the same ?

Yes, this is why some endos do not value lab results too high.
There are some clinics who give not much recognition to blood levels but ask how the patient feels, and watch health and  progress of feminization.

I got started on e (sublingual) first and then was given finastride and spiro about a month later.  my t levels were not that high to begin with.

Quote from: Laura_7 on August 06, 2015, 04:22:11 AM
Yes, this is why some endos do not value lab results too high.
There are some clinics who give not much recognition to blood levels but ask how the patient feels, and watch health and  progress of feminization.

Thank you ,

this worries me further on . Maybe this is true for androgens too , they might be undetectable or very low on blood tests but maybe some already were used by the body , despite the receptors blockers .

Congratulations!! I just started 2 days ago.

Quote from: Claudia_FF on August 07, 2015, 01:43:01 AM

Thank you ,

this worries me further on . Maybe this is true for androgens too , they might be undetectable or very low on blood tests but maybe some already were used by the body , despite the receptors blockers .

Ok then concerning your questions...

Quote
A question would be if it is possible to have enough testosterone to affect the estrogen's effects  , despite the tests showing levels so low .

There are different forms of testosterone. One is DHT. Bioidentical progesterone is said to help some here.

Quote
At the moment i use Androcur as an anti-androgenic and in the blood tests it appears that my testosterone levels are ' undetectable ' .

One possible side effect of it is depression. You might think about switching to Spironolactone. Or you might think about splitting the dose in smaller portions throughout the day. There are special pill cutters to seperate pills in four parts etc. You also might ask a pharmacy to do that for you, they should have such pill cutters.

Testosterone tests are showing no exact results below a certain point. So if they are undetectable it means they are quite low.
If you feel you lack overall drive they might be a bit low.
There are other forms of testo like DHT which as said above might be countered some by bioidentical progesterone.

Quote
I use a progesterone cream , it is bioidentical , and i feel great with it . It is not about that , It is about the ' anti -estrogenic ' effect i keep hearing , i don't know how i would've transform without it . I learn a lot on other sites , non trans-related , about the progesterone and how important it is for health , mood , weight control and so on , so i wouldn't want to give it up .
Also i heard progesterone is preventing (big)estrogen fat deposits , so this is why i asked also .

Bioidentical progesterone is supposed to help with breast development, even out some effects of estro, might help with mood and has some anti androgen effects. Imo it complements estrogen. Its like a pair working together.
If you have doubts you might cycle it, like taking it for ten or twenty days a month. Others do not cycle because they say it might affect mood.


Just talk it through with your doc.


hugs

Quote from: Laura_7 on August 07, 2015, 05:44:55 AM
Ok then concerning your questions...There are different forms of testosterone. One is DHT. Bioidentical progesterone is said to help some here.
One possible side effect of it is depression. You might think about switching to Spironolactone. Or you might think about splitting the dose in smaller portions throughout the day. There are special pill cutters to seperate pills in four parts etc. You also might ask a pharmacy to do that for you, they should have such pill cutters.

Testosterone tests are showing no exact results below a certain point. So if they are undetectable it means they are quite low.
If you feel you lack overall drive they might be a bit low.
There are other forms of testo like DHT which as said above might be countered some by bioidentical progesterone.

Bioidentical progesterone is supposed to help with breast development, even out some effects of estro, might help with mood and has some anti androgen effects. Imo it complements estrogen. Its like a pair working together.
If you have doubts you might cycle it, like taking it for ten or twenty days a month. Others do not cycle because they say it might affect mood.


Just talk it through with your doc.


hugs

Thank you so much , Laura , for helping me with my struggles .
I only get worried by testosterone because i sometimes feel the hormonal libido and even have dreams with erotic content . I don't have other effects except maybe for the feminisation being so slow . The levels are undetectable but i keep hearing that people have better results after orchi / srs rather than antiandrogens . Beside the thing with the hormones doing their thing in a stealth way is another thing that gets me confused .

Nowadays i take huge doses of antiandrogens compared with the ' standard ' , and being Androcur i am worried for the liver and mental health . But i just hate feeling activity down there . I don't have relationships , never have sex , so i feel betrayed by my body when he keeps trying raise the t levels .

I stopped the progesterone for a week or so and i will see if i feel anything different in the physical changes .

the endo ... pfff ... all she could say was :  ' put .. patches and take one pill of that one , or how you felt better before ' . So it's a waste of time .

Quote from: Claudia_FF on August 07, 2015, 05:56:39 AM
Thank you so much , Laura , for helping me with my struggles .
I only get worried by testosterone because i sometimes feel the hormonal libido and even have dreams with erotic content . I don't have other effects except maybe for the feminisation being so slow . The levels are undetectable but i keep hearing that people have better results after orchi / srs rather than antiandrogens . Beside the thing with the hormones doing their thing in a stealth way is another thing that gets me confused .

Nowadays i take huge doses of antiandrogens compared with the ' standard ' , and being Androcur i am worried for the liver and mental health . But i just hate feeling activity down there . I don't have relationships , never have sex , so i feel betrayed by my body when he keeps trying raise the t levels .

I stopped the progesterone for a week or so and i will see if i feel anything different in the physical changes .

As said, I'm of the opinion progesterone might be helpful.

You might try to go with the flow...
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,181089.msg1651430.html#msg1651430

A certain testo level is also present in females. It makes for overall drive. And having some kind of libido can be kind of nice if you go with the flow...
as described in the link, you might try vibrators... and having fantasies... so it can be a really enjoyable experience.
Having orgasms can be a nice and almost spiritual experience, if not forced and not used too often.


hugs

welcome, just follow the yellow brick road.

Quote from: Laura_7 on August 07, 2015, 06:06:51 AM
As said, I'm of the opinion progesterone might be helpful.

You might try to go with the flow...
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,181089.msg1651430.html#msg1651430

A certain testo level is also present in females. It makes for overall drive. And having some kind of libido can be kind of nice if you go with the flow...
as described in the link, you might try vibrators... and having fantasies... so it can be a really enjoyable experience.
Having orgasms can be a nice and almost spiritual experience, if not forced and not used too often.


hugs

It is not that i am frigid , but i don't like using the organs i have now , neither the male one neither using dildos now . After SRS , for sure , but it is a milion years away . When i think at my crush i would get so aroused and it is really unpleasant , i guess it is a good thing i am unloveable .

Quote from: Claudia_FF on August 07, 2015, 06:18:01 AM
It is not that i am frigid , but i don't like using the organs i have now , neither the male one neither using dildos now . After SRS , for sure , but it is a milion years away . When i think at my crush i would get so aroused and it is really unpleasant , i guess it is a good thing i am unloveable .

Well I'd say try to use what you have and use your imagination.
There are vibrators. If you stimulate your parts you might imagine having a clit. After all, after srs it will be a clit. So you might just use what you have now...
some people avoid penetration stimulation, and use for example rubbing... lesbians for example rub on each other, its very pleasing... its called tribbing...

there are quite a few techniques to stimulate the head and forget about the rest... you might connect that mentally to a positive image...
and try to enjoy it...

Hearty congratulations! This becomes your new Birthday. xx

Congrats