I didn't really know where to put this!

I have a couple of friends which are medical DR's and one or two have advised me to ask my GP for the hpv vaccine as trans women are just as susceptible to cervical cancer as bio women. So I mention this to my GP and she just says no. Just wondering if anyone else has had the hpv vaccine on the NHS and at what point did you get it if you've had it with my knowledge in science and medicine I would of thought the sooner the better especially if you are a virgin.

You can't get cervical cancer if you don't have a cervix.......

Maybe your Dr Friend thought you were referring to Trans-men instead....

Trans women can't get cervical cancer, we don't have a cervix.  Even after getting SRS, our neo-vagina doesn't have a womb. 
We can carry HPV, and there are reasons you might not want to get it (like giving it to female partners who could then get cancer) so you might choose to get vaccinated.

Yeah, count me as a vote for "you can't get cervical cancer without a cervix." The cervix isn't merely an anatomical structure that happens to be in the right location, either; it's part of the uterus, which is absent in most trans women. So even a surgically created cervix will be similar to either the tissue it's made from or vaginal epithelium (if you're lucky enough to be one whose skin converted to that), neither of which is uterine/cervical cells.

What is meant by cervix is the end or narrowing of in this case vagina. If when you have grs you didn't have a cervix that would mean the top of your vagina is open ended. Although not the same type of epithelial cells the neo cervix can still develop cancer in the same way a natural cervix can develop cancer. Also the hpv vaccine doesn't only protect you from the hpv causing cervical cancer but also cancer of the anus, labia and vagina and laryngeal cancer. It doesn't matter if you have a biological vagina/cervix or a neo vagina/cervix it is still called vaginal or cervical cancer and the hpv vaccine can reduce the risk of this.

And well if you can't get vaginal or cervical cancer as a trans woman then why do you have smear/Pap tests every 2 years or are you telling me the nhs just do this for fun and a waste of money?

Oh and by the way I'm medical student!

This is from a well known cancer organisation website!

Cervical cancer (MTF and FTM)
The cervix is the cone-shaped neck of the uterus that sticks out into the vagina. Cervical cancer is the 9th most common cancer among BC residents born female. Cervical cancer is strongly associated with human papilloma virus (HPV), which is transmitted through sex.
Recommendations for MTFs
MTFs who have not had a vaginoplasty (surgical creation of a vagina) do not have a cervix so are not at risk for cervical cancer. Some types of vaginoplasty use the head of the penis to form a cervix; in these cases there is a risk of cervical cancer. There is also a risk of vaginal cancer after vaginoplasty, but vaginal cancer is a rare type of cancer (in both MTFs and non-trans women). There may be higher risks of vaginal cancer in MTFs who have HPV and have a compromised immune system (e.g., due to HIV).

Elanore : But do you see that the second post you made contradicts the first? "The cervix is the neck of the uterus..." exactly as I said; it's NOT merely the end of the vagina. Trans women, like cis women who've had a complete hysterectomy - who have had the uterus wholly removed - do not have a cervix, and instead the vagina ends as a blind pouch.

And I don't get a Pap smear, any more than my friend who had a hysterectomy with her cervix removed does. I have no idea why the NHS does what it does, but evidence-based medicine would argue against testing for a cancer someone cannot possibly contract, so I assume there's some other reason for it. I'm in the US, and health insurance here does not typically pay for a Pap smear on someone without a cervix. (A vaginal exam, yes, including cancer tests, but a Pap smear is a specific type test.)

Which is also exactly what your quote says : "MTFs who have not had a vaginoplasty (surgical creation of a vagina) do not have a cervix so are not at risk for cervical cancer."

I admit I do disagree that someone with a surgically created cervix can get the same type of cervical cancer, because for all intents and purposes cervical cancer in a cis woman is a type of *uterine* cancer (since the cervix is part of the uterus). "Cancer of the neocervix" is not going to be the same as cancer of the uterine cervix , but perhaps this discussion is conflating those two.

Quote from: Elanore joey on August 14, 2015, 11:08:24 AM
What is meant by cervix is the end or narrowing of in this case vagina. If when you have grs you didn't have a cervix that would mean the top of your vagina is open ended.

Ahm, no?  A neovagina is not "open ended".  Ewwww....

It does say mtf who have not had a vaginoplasty cannot get cervical cancer but the way it states this means that if you have had a vaginoplasty you can get cervical cancer. Let me explain without saying that trans women have a cervix. Right here we go a mtf trans person post surgery can get cancer in the piece flesh as what would be called the cervix in a bio female, this cancer can be caused by HPV. Because of where this piece of flesh is doctors call this cervical cancer.

The actual definition of the word cervix is the neck.

Eleanor : You're right, I missed that the second one is talking about trans women who haven't had GRS.

It sounds as if ultimately you agree, that there's a distinction between the surgically created cervix and the uterine cervix - a distinction that means that someone without a uterine cervix cannot get the specific type of cancer colloquially referred to as "cervical cancer."

I doubt you'd consider cancer of the throat to be cervical cancer. That's the Latin translation, yes (which is because it's the "neck" of the uterus), but the medical definition in English is "a :  the narrow lower or outer end of the uterus." (http://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/cervix) No uterus = no cervix as traditionally defined.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/07/its-tough-to-get-cervical-cancer-without-a-cervix/

"To this end, three major professional organizations - the United States Preventive Services Task Force, the American Congress of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, and American Cancer Society - all recommend against cervical cancer screenings for posthysterectomy women over 30."

I know that's referring to cis women, but note the title of the article, which is cited as the justification for this recommendation - no uterine cervix, no risk of cancer of the cervix. Again, the cervix is a specific anatomical feature, not merely "the end of the vagina," and just because this bit of the uterus has a more precise name doesn't mean it's not still part of the uterus... an organ which most trans women do not have.

In any case, you're right that the HPV vaccine has applications beyond cervical cancer, and it's probably not a bad idea for anyone who's eligible to get it. Since it's recommended for cis boys as well, having a uterus is clearly not a prerequisite for either HPV or the vaccine.

This is also why post op mtf's have pap/smear tests every 2 years to check for "cervical cancer"

Quote from: Elanore joey on August 14, 2015, 01:42:48 PM
This is also why post op mtf's have pap/smear tests every 2 years to check for "cervical cancer"

Not once have I ever heard or read this, even when talking with a SRS surgeon. Never seen it mentioned on here or by any post-op trans woman woman I know.

(Kelly : Indeed, as I said, I certainly don't, have never had it recommended, and have no intention of doing so. )

HPV can also cause anal cancer as well so Gardasil recommend that all sex should take Gardasil HPV vaccine. Meanwhile Cervarix still recommend to female.


    The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) recommends routine vaccination with GARDASIL for boys and girls ages 11 and 12. The CDC also recommends vaccination for young women ages 13 through 26 and young men ages 13 through 21 who have not already been vaccinated.
   
HPV Vaccine | Learn Who Should Get Vaccinated - Gardasil http://www.gardasil.com/...gardasil/who-should-get-vaccinated/

or you can google more about it.

Okay I did some reading.

MTF people are only at risk of cervical cancer after SRS if they have a cervix created from the head of the penis.  This is apparently possible, but it is also quite rare.
If you do not have a cervix created as part of the surgery, then you do not have any risk of cervical cancer.
http://www.cancer-network.org/media/pdf/Trans_people_and_cancer.pdf

As for vaginal cancers, we are at risk.  However vaginal cancer is a very rare form of cancer regardless of being transgender or not.

We do not need pap smears.  This is a lie.  The neovagina is made of a different kind of tissue, it is either skin or it is mucosal tissue from the urethra or colon.  These tissues do not work with pap smears.  What you should get done is have the inside of the neovagina looked at with a speculum and checked for abnormalities (warts, lesions, erosions). 
http://transhealth.ucsf.edu/trans?page=protocol-screening

This is not to say you shouldn't get the vaccine if you don't want to get it.  You should understand how your future body might function though.