Ok,
So well I think I am leaning toward Haben.. from what I have learned. 
I have a lot of Friends now that are CIS.. they including my ex think my voice is fine but that is in front of them and I struggle.. I hate to talk in public..
I am also in sales so I need to be out selling again in my business. I need to pass without much effort.  Seems I have done well with how I pronounce but resonance needs improved.. Heck to be honest I am sure it all needs improved.
I am 57, with the surgery should I be able to pass.. seeing that I pass fairly well now with voice.
Whats I am told is no one thinks I can possible be male because of the way I look even if I am a little deep.  So I suppose that helps.. I just want to be able to enjoy being out and not think about it.
I talk a lot usually.. and well now I am more subdued because of the voice..
Urrrrrr. 
Anyway, I think I am going for it.. why not?  Right?
Keri

Why not.

That said, have realistic expectations from the surgery. For some people it works great, some don't get a lot of pitch increase. Also there is resonance you need to train out.

I had mine at Yeson and it is the single best thing I ever did in my transition. There is zero chance of me being gendered male when I talk. I haven't heard the word, "sir" in about 4-5 months when referring to me. It also overrides any ambiguity people may have from my appearance (I haven't had FFS yet) although that in itself isn't an issue.

There is a silence period after the op. Dr Haben says a few weeks but if you're doing sales calls I would say at least a month.

I don't think I would ever regret it..even if I sounded a bit hoarse.. I know girls who smoke who sound sexy.. funny thing is people say my voice is sexy.. dang.. Even so.. I don't want to think about it.. I want to be as vocal as I used to.. which I am sort of.. but I hold back..
Keri

It seems according to people your voice passes fairly well as is. Maybe you just need to get the resonance thing down? As you probably already know the surgery won't fix resonance. It's funny how resonance can totally make your voice sound way deeper than it is. For me I got the surgery because I had resonance down but pitch was something I didn't want to have to worry about.

You really have provided to little information for us to give a good answer. I don't know if you saw my thread but surgery push my voice up to a normal male range from a very low Bass range. Post surgical I still need to use a trained voice to move from the male range to the female range. if you are lucky you can get a 80 hz boost to your voice. Even with the pitch increase, you may still need to use the trained voice to improve the resonance.

Know exactly what you need before you approach a doctor and ask the doctor if he can do it. In my case I had a bit of a surprise because I knew what I needed and I knew what the doctor could provide but my vocal cords were different lengths. This complicated things because the results would be guessed off the longer cord and I was tied at 40% of the longer cord or 50% of the shorter cord. I lucked out and may end up with 70 to 80 hz from the surgery and I need every bit of that to put me in the lower end of female.

As for thinking about it, I have use a trained voice for so long, I don't think about it. I have to force myself to use the chest voice because I have forget how to use it.

Feel free to ask me questions about Dr Haben because I knew a good deal about the surgery before I went and I ask many more questions while I was there. I also don't mind responding to your questions.

Hi Dena,
Well everyone I know says I am making too big a deal out of it...  Seems those who know me and socialize with me think its fine... so I assume with some practice I would be fine. I think what I will do is just wait until after GRS and give myself more time to practice.. then see what happens.. I always wanted to learn to sing and have a great range so maybe I should start with voice lessons..
Its amazing what we go through to be ourselves.. transition is not for the faint of heart for sure but so worth the effort.
Keri

Well, if others say your voice is ok, then the next question is, what is bothering you - does it take you too much effort to do your voice, does it not work as well in other situations, are you getting misgendered because of the voice in real life or on the phone?

As others also said, if your issue is resonance or one of the other voice parameters, it may be that your voice does not improve much with surgery, because those issues will persist or even worsen. A few patients had voice surgery and say they have a voice afterwards that is worse than before. Apparently the reason may be that they had a good trained feminine voice before and afterwards their base pitch is higher, so it takes less effort to do that voice, but they still use the same voice basically, so to others it seems like no change, but they have some additional hoarseness which makes the voice sould less good than before.

For me, its a bit like that - people say my voice sounds the same to them, but I know that for me it sounds different and for me it is easier to just speak and not think before I speak and this makes me more outgoing and talkative now. But to the outside it seems to some that my voice changed little as I am now just comfortably speaking in what before was my relaxed-trained voice. The undertones changed a little bit, so there is some change in timbre, the pitch went up a little bit, but is all just subtle changes at times. And some of these are not really going to happen with a CTA alone by the way. AFAIK CTA does not change the timbre but mainly changes the pitch only. Basically it just simulates a permanent muscle contraction of one of the two pitch shaping muscles, so your voice exactly sounds like your voice now, just it sounds like you are raising pitch.

I hope you find a great solution, but I definitely would first get a really good picture of what your voice issues are - what your original and trained pitch are, what your resonance and inflection and all of these things do and if they are ok or need improvement and then make an informed decision about voice therapy or voice surgery.

Recently I have seen a lot of people flocking towards voice surgery because of some great outcomes, but they go there and expect it to be a magical cure - a voice feminization with the knife - just do the surgery and your voice will totally be feminine all the time. That is not what it does, sorry about that. It changes some part of your voice, thats all. I always call it a voice supporting surgery because it helps to give you a feminine voice, but you still have to do a lot yourself to get it

Make a recording and post it up.

Quote from: anjaq on November 10, 2015, 06:05:10 AM
Well, if others say your voice is ok, then the next question is, what is bothering you - does it take you too much effort to do your voice, does it not work as well in other situations, are you getting misgendered because of the voice in real life or on the phone?

As others also said, if your issue is resonance or one of the other voice parameters, it may be that your voice does not improve much with surgery, because those issues will persist or even worsen. A few patients had voice surgery and say they have a voice afterwards that is worse than before. Apparently the reason may be that they had a good trained feminine voice before and afterwards their base pitch is higher, so it takes less effort to do that voice, but they still use the same voice basically, so to others it seems like no change, but they have some additional hoarseness which makes the voice sould less good than before.

For me, its a bit like that - people say my voice sounds the same to them, but I know that for me it sounds different and for me it is easier to just speak and not think before I speak and this makes me more outgoing and talkative now. But to the outside it seems to some that my voice changed little as I am now just comfortably speaking in what before was my relaxed-trained voice. The undertones changed a little bit, so there is some change in timbre, the pitch went up a little bit, but is all just subtle changes at times. And some of these are not really going to happen with a CTA alone by the way. AFAIK CTA does not change the timbre but mainly changes the pitch only. Basically it just simulates a permanent muscle contraction of one of the two pitch shaping muscles, so your voice exactly sounds like your voice now, just it sounds like you are raising pitch.

I hope you find a great solution, but I definitely would first get a really good picture of what your voice issues are - what your original and trained pitch are, what your resonance and inflection and all of these things do and if they are ok or need improvement and then make an informed decision about voice therapy or voice surgery.

Recently I have seen a lot of people flocking towards voice surgery because of some great outcomes, but they go there and expect it to be a magical cure - a voice feminization with the knife - just do the surgery and your voice will totally be feminine all the time. That is not what it does, sorry about that. It changes some part of your voice, thats all. I always call it a voice supporting surgery because it helps to give you a feminine voice, but you still have to do a lot yourself to get it

I have not really even worked on my voice that much at all.. when I say I am busy I mean I am busy.. seriously.. I should have two people working for me.. I have heard people say you can find time.. and no I cant...
I work at least 12 hours a day.. and most the time work 6 to 7 days a week..

So, I think I will get GRS.. just keep working with what I have..and go from there.. I have never been clocked because of my voice..  however I am sure people that do not know me think its deep.

I get mam'd at the drive through for food. 
Think I will just relax.. for now, enjoy what I have and always know I can improve over time.... I wish I could find a voice therapist locally in the OkC area.. but no such luck.. or at least someone who can work with trans people.
Keri

There are some out there who can Skype giving you therapy where ever you are.

Honestly if you think you're going to get surgery, I think therapy before it is a waste of time. You have to un-learn old habits and then your money's wasted. I think it is best to start with a "virgin" voice and after surgery seek therapy if needed.