I just wanted to connect with some other people about the bummer inducing experience of getting misgendered after starting to transition. I'm 5 months in. I've been having some great experiences of being read as male and friends and coworkers are starting to get the hang of pronouns.

Earlier tonight, I went to home depot with my partner to buy some blinds. The middle-aged man serving us referred to us as 'girls'. At first I thought I misheard. Then he did it again. My partner, who feels bad for me in these situations, didn't know what to say. I finally said, 'I'm not a girl." "Oh," he said, and that was it. I've been bummed since.

This kind of bummer/dysphoria happened a lot before transitioning. When I first started on T and got 'ma'amed' or 'ladied' I would think, "It's just a matter of time" and not be phased. Now though, with things changing, but slowly, the strong dysphoria is back.

As I write this, things are shifting. I really just needed to get this guck out in a supportive environment.

Thank you.

Welcome to Susan's Place. Sometimes that happens and it's not fun. After 33 years that still happens to me a the result of my voice. I wasn't able to fix it with therapy and I found Susan's place while looking for a surgical solutions. In your case, you really haven't been on T long enough to see all the effects. For a MTF we really need about 10 years on HRT to see all the effects. In your case the changes happen much faster but I think you may need a bit more time. I am sure that day will come when they won't think of calling you ma'am.

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Hey there and welcome to Susan's!
I can totally relate. Before T, you don't really expect people to gender you correctly. But after T, you are on this hopetrain that people will finally get it right. Whenever that hope is stomped down, it feels like a stab in the kidneys.

There is not much that can be done about this. But do know that in time, the number of misgenderings will go down. Just do not expect miracles to happen too soon, and do try to shrug it off when it happens. Cis people have no idea how hurtful it can be to be misgendered because most of them never really think about gender and gender issues. It may help to know that they will not misgender you out of malice or to hurt you, but simply because they don't know any better.

Give it some time and you will be fine. You already knew this, but it's good to keep repeating it to keep yourself going.

Thank you to you both. I knew I came to the right place.

I am hoping that in time, misgendering will happen less frequently. I think I might also start writing down and collecting (at this early stage of transition) the times when I am correctly gendered. That way, when I am mistaken by someone, I can remind myself of how often it ISN'T happening.

Thanks again for your replies.
And thank you for the warm welcomes and orientation to Susan's Place.

Honestly, im over a year on t and i have had top surgery, i have a deep voice and even facial hair (not much but noticeable) and yesterday my mom and i went into a store and the woman greeted us with "hi ladies" and my mom just looked at me. I think although it sucks but the further along on your transition, the less you care. Before id get so dysphoric over it and now its like it must be an honest mistake and it does happen even to cisgender people. I dont think too much into it anymore. I dont have a "soft feminine" face but i do look like my mom and i do tend to have a baby face so i can see how it would happen but honestly you just get comfortable with your identity and start not caring. Its just like when people can mistake a straight man as gay, it happens and he shouldmt get offended if hes comfortable and confident in his Sexuality and realize its not offensive. However if someone KEPT misgendering me, then id be like ? And feel dysphoric

Pre-T I passed extremely well (except for one weird patch of time) and I was already pretty masculine in things like body shape before T. So I expected I would stay that way, but actually I e experienced on the lower end of changes. I don't think my passing has been any better, in fact it was worse for a while. It's very hurtful that T didn't do much for my being read as male. Particularly with my voice that didn't change much. Wel it did change quite a bit but it's still not a masculine voice.
I'm over a year on T now and I've finally noticed a shift for the better recently, though I think it's only because of my facial hair. It's some hair on my chin. I shaved for a thing a week before Halloween and my passing dropped dramatically even though The hair I shaved off was barely visible. but I still get misgendered more than I should and it tends to be when I'm with other pre-T trans guys who don't pass well at all. Not a good confidence boost. It's slowly getting there, but much slower than I expected.

I know that feeling you have experienced, and I am sorry that you have to endure it!  I am about 5 years into my transition and still get misgendered    Often it happens on the phone, despite trying my best to speak from the chest...but now and again in person as well, which is almost embarrassing to me!  I have had chest surgery, my hairline has receded quite a bit, and I have a pretty solid goatee...dark blonde, yes, but pretty thick.  How is it possible that people look at me and automatically think female???!!!!  I am fairly lean, as I am a runner, and I sometimes think that accentuates my female skeleton, but I see other guys who look similar to my size.  Quite frankly, the misgendering really gets to me, as I have tried very hard at being my best masculine self.  It sends me down a spiral wondering "why the heck did I transition at all if people are still never going to see me???!!?!!"  And then thankfully somebody will call me sir and I feel a small bit of relief until it happens again.  I fear it will never go away entirely, but I really wish it would...

Thanks, guys. I appreciate you sharing your experiences. I totally relate to how confounding it is when people read trans guys (with deep voices, facial hair, flat chests, short hair, and receding hairlines) as female. It makes me paranoid that, from the recesses of my female socialized brain, I'm subtly communicating something with my face or walk or stance or gestures that says "woman". I puff up, shoulders back, chest out, go to my deepest voice range, and start walking like a gorilla to compensate. It's so baffling to me. I think you're right, tapping into that sense of security in who you are and yourself as a man can make a difference. I'll get there, I'm sure.

Thanks again.

One thing that I don't see mentioned a lot here is recording yourself. Set up a camera somewhere that you interact with people (home or work maybe) and see if there's anything about it that reads female to you. Even just voice recording your conversation, you might find a lot of stereotypical female vocal cues.

Good on you for calling dude out though. Knowing when and how to correct someone is probably one of the toughest things when dealing with misgendering, and I think you did well even if you didn't get much of a response.

That's a great  idea (video or audio recording). I think I'll try that.

Thank you.

Quote from: HeyTrace19 on November 10, 2015, 02:15:37 PM
Quite frankly, the misgendering really gets to me, as I have tried very hard at being my best masculine self.  It sends me down a spiral wondering "why the heck did I transition at all if people are still never going to see me???!!?!!" 

Trace, this is EXACTLY where I was yesterday. EXACTLY. Thank you for expressing this.

I do think the way you talk (not the depth of your voice but the emphasis on words) has an effect. Many women and some gay men tend to raise and lower their voices as they speak while most straight men are a bit more monotone.  I have always spoken in a monotone voice from the chest, and despite dressing extremely feminine with long hair, makeup, dresses, and heels, talking this way made people think of me as "one of the guys".  I wasn't misgendered as male, obviously, but I was that girl people called "dude" and fist bumped and talked to about the crazy stuff their girlfriends did, while most women didn't connect with me at all, often thinking I was a bit of a jerk because I always spoke in such a monotone while their voices went up and down to express interest and excitement.  I would definitely record your voice and see if you are speaking in a masculine monotone "bro" voice or a more feminine way.  Once you pass better you can talk however you want, but it might help you pass before T finishes the changes.

Quote from: FtMitch on November 13, 2015, 01:39:58 PM
I do think the way you talk (not the depth of your voice but the emphasis on words) has an effect. Many women and some gay men tend to raise and lower their voices as they speak while most straight men are a bit more monotone.

Very good point. I would also add that the rate of speech is another difference. Cis men tend talk slower than cis women. When I'm conscious of my rate and tone (and depth) of speech, I'm misgendered less. My hope is that with one conscious utterance at a time I can extinguish all those voice and mannerism artifacts of my socialization as female that were reinforced over such a long period. 

Quote from: HeyTrace19 on November 10, 2015, 02:15:37 PM
I know that feeling you have experienced, and I am sorry that you have to endure it!  I am about 5 years into my transition and still get misgendered    Often it happens on the phone, despite trying my best to speak from the chest...but now and again in person as well, which is almost embarrassing to me!  I have had chest surgery, my hairline has receded quite a bit, and I have a pretty solid goatee...dark blonde, yes, but pretty thick.  How is it possible that people look at me and automatically think female???!!!!  I am fairly lean, as I am a runner, and I sometimes think that accentuates my female skeleton, but I see other guys who look similar to my size.  Quite frankly, the misgendering really gets to me, as I have tried very hard at being my best masculine self.  It sends me down a spiral wondering "why the heck did I transition at all if people are still never going to see me???!!?!!"  And then thankfully somebody will call me sir and I feel a small bit of relief until it happens again.  I fear it will never go away entirely, but I really wish it would...

I would love to talk to you more about your transition. I've bee transition for 5 years now and recently every now and then I get cisgendered.

I feel your frustration! I'm almost 7 months on T and I don't think I've ever been gendered correctly by strangers. It makes it harder to motivate myself to even try to pass because every time I do something like get a new haircut or wear more masculine clothes or bind I get ma'amed and feel like what's the point of even trying? I guess the only thing that helps is focusing on the ways my body has changed already, even if it isn't enough to pass. I can still see from looking at pics that I look different from when I started this journey.

Quote from: TATE on October 17, 2016, 06:27:57 PM


I would love to talk to you more about your transition. I've bee transition for 5 years now and recently every now and then I get cisgendered.

Sorry to hi jack the thread for a moment but want to welcome TATE to the site.

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