This thread was a point of conversation between myself and my endo today.  I start HRT next week, and asked him his thoughts on progesterone as it seems to be a debated topic.  He said personally he hasn't seen any proof that it is accountable for the results some say it's had, but he did relent and say if I did wish to have that prescribed he would do so for me.

So my question to you iKate is if you had to do it all over again knowing what you know now, would you take progesterone from the start, or wait for your 11 month mark as you did?

Quote from: iKate on October 07, 2015, 09:33:15 AM
My hips and butt are filling out even better now. My jeans are tighter for sure. I gained maybe 3lbs so that could probably account for it, but the shape seems different. I can wear men's jeans and they look like a woman is wearing them.

Same here - I weigh just a little more than I used to but my butt has expanded and my boobs have rounded out and no longer resemble traffic cones.

With my weight basically the same its apparent that my fat distribution has definitely changed on P. I'm pretty much a happy camper now, but it did take about a year for the weird mood changes to slack off.

Quote from: Brooke33 on November 10, 2015, 07:47:10 PM
This thread was a point of conversation between myself and my endo today.  I start HRT next week, and asked him his thoughts on progesterone as it seems to be a debated topic.  He said personally he hasn't seen any proof that it is accountable for the results some say it's had, but he did relent and say if I did wish to have that prescribed he would do so for me.

So my question to you iKate is if you had to do it all over again knowing what you know now, would you take progesterone from the start, or wait for your 11 month mark as you did?

i would take it from the start. Absolutely. I didn't take it until 10 months in because I wasn't sure my doctor and nurse practitioner would prescribe it. But as it turns out she's pretty open to it.

My philosophy is that if the goal is to feminize, you can't and shouldn't pick and choose female hormones. You should opt for the whole package and correct dosages. Cis women have progesterone from the get go. Why can't we? I've heard a lot of inconsistent excuses from some endos and others in the medical and non-medical community. The one I dislike the most is that we don't breastfeed so we don't need to develop milk producing parts of our breasts. Honestly I want my breasts to be fully functional rather than just cosmetic. It is important to my well being as a woman. Heck, I would want a uterus if I could get one.

And for me it works and works very well.

The latest is that even though I've lost weight, my jeans are tighter. When I slide them on in the morning they hug my hips and butt rather than just hanging loose. I wear size 6 jeans and size 8 tops but it's going to be size 8 for my bottoms soon. 

From someone that's been on it for 3 and a half years since the very start of hrt, I definitely have to say its made the biggest difference in terms of helping me gain weight plus stabilizing my mood.

That's one concern I would have is the weight gain.  I'm actually trying to lose weight currently (also recommended by my GP).  My weight's not very high, I'm 5'5 and 161lbs currently (was 182 about 2 months ago, but I'm doing well), but would like to get back to the mid 140s like I used to just to be at a 'normalized' weight for my height.

On the flip side, I'm wondering if once I start the T-blockers, the loss of muscle mass will drop weight fast as muscle weighs more than fat, and that would kinda balance out the weight gain from the estrogen/progesterone.  Does that make sense, or is that a poor expectation?

It does make sense.  I have been on progesterone for 10 months and have not had any problem with weight gain.  I have actually lost 35 lbs during that time.  While I did make the effort to lose the weight there was a 2.5 month period where I quit tracking my food and was eating a lot of junk (like multiple candy bars and bags of chips every night).  Even during that time I only gained back about 5 pounds.  Some of that loss is due to muscle but most was due to losing fat I think.  But that's really hard to quantify how much of each exactly.  I have a really hard time judging myself in the mirror, half the time seeing a huge body when I look at myself and at other times feeling better about it.

So, weight loss isn't especially hard on progesterone.  But you do need to track your food and activity just as you would losing weight at any other time.

I am 5'11" and started at about 205 in Jan when I started HRT.  Right now I'm at 169 lbs and have lost 2 lbs in the last week since I got back to being disciplined about eating.  I'm hoping to lose another 10 to 15 lbs to maybe get rid of what fat I have left in the muffin top area.  That would be nice since that fat has been there since I was a little kid.


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Ugh so I'm worried that my endo doesn't know what he's doing or he's following an outdated protocol. Two months into HRT and he put me on medroxyprogesterone, non-cycled. I'm not sure why he prescribed synthetic over bio-identical - I'm guessing because synthetic is cheaper?

It's been a little over two weeks and so far I haven't noticed any negative effects.

I'm hoping that from a biochemical perspective medroxyprogesterone will have the exact same action on breast tissue receptors as bio-identical progesterone. I have not seen evidence that contradicts that statement. I just hear people talking about "negative side-effects" but so far no negative side-effects. I figure it's not hurting me and there's a chance it will help with breast development so might as well keep taking it until I experience negative side-effects.

Quote from: Brooke33 on November 12, 2015, 11:27:35 PM
That's one concern I would have is the weight gain.  I'm actually trying to lose weight currently (also recommended by my GP).  My weight's not very high, I'm 5'5 and 161lbs currently (was 182 about 2 months ago, but I'm doing well), but would like to get back to the mid 140s like I used to just to be at a 'normalized' weight for my height.

On the flip side, I'm wondering if once I start the T-blockers, the loss of muscle mass will drop weight fast as muscle weighs more than fat, and that would kinda balance out the weight gain from the estrogen/progesterone.  Does that make sense, or is that a poor expectation?

I'm 5'6" and 150lbs. I want to get down to the 140s as well. I do not want to be rail thin, just not chunky. I'm size 8 tops and apparently almost size 8 bottom too.

Yes, your muscle mass will drop drastically. You will lose a LOT of weight and physical size that way. It's as if I had someone aim a shrink ray on me.

Quote from: RachelsMantra on November 13, 2015, 11:00:11 AM
Ugh so I'm worried that my endo doesn't know what he's doing or he's following an outdated protocol. Two months into HRT and he put me on medroxyprogesterone, non-cycled. I'm not sure why he prescribed synthetic over bio-identical - I'm guessing because synthetic is cheaper?

It's been a little over two weeks and so far I haven't noticed any negative effects.

I'm hoping that from a biochemical perspective medroxyprogesterone will have the exact same action on breast tissue receptors as bio-identical progesterone. I have not seen evidence that contradicts that statement. I just hear people talking about "negative side-effects" but so far no negative side-effects. I figure it's not hurting me and there's a chance it will help with breast development so might as well keep taking it until I experience negative side-effects.

Cycling shouldn't matter much. The MPA though, I would try to stay away from. I heard that it can cause some of the bad mental effects. Bio identical (prometrium or equivalent) all the way.

Action on receptors in brain and breast are different...
bioidentical is the one, like in cis people...

Quote from: iKate on November 13, 2015, 11:41:43 AM
Cycling shouldn't matter much. The MPA though, I would try to stay away from. I heard that it can cause some of the bad mental effects. Bio identical (prometrium or equivalent) all the way.

I keep hearing about these "bad mental effects" such as crazy mood swings but I have never ever been a moody person and I rarely experience swings in my emotions so it would really surprise me if medroxyprogesterone made a huge difference to my overall mental life. I will keep monitoring how I feel though. I don't see my endo for like another 3.5 months and my plan is to stay on medroxyprogesterone for that time.

Quote from: RachelsMantra on November 13, 2015, 12:04:33 PM

I keep hearing about these "bad mental effects" such as crazy mood swings but I have never ever been a moody person and I rarely experience swings in my emotions so it would really surprise me if medroxyprogesterone made a huge difference to my overall mental life. I will keep monitoring how I feel though. I don't see my endo for like another 3.5 months and my plan is to stay on medroxyprogesterone for that time.

There is also supposedly hair loss.

I wouldn't know as I haven't tried it but that alone is enough to scare me off.

Quote from: iKate on November 13, 2015, 02:18:44 PM
There is also supposedly hair loss.

I wouldn't know as I haven't tried it but that alone is enough to scare me off.

I am taking finasteride as well so hopefully that will prevent any hair loss.

Besides, the listing of scalp hair loss is just a possible side-effect not a guarantee. They have to put it on there for liability reasons but it could be an extremely rare side-effect. I take other medication that lists as side-effects "sudden death" but that's not going to stop me...

With that said, if I start noticing hair loss I will stop immediately.

Quote from: RachelsMantra on November 13, 2015, 02:45:51 PM

I am taking finasteride as well so hopefully that will prevent any hair loss.

Besides, the listing of scalp hair loss is just a possible side-effect not a guarantee. They have to put it on there for liability reasons but it could be an extremely rare side-effect. I take other medication that lists as side-effects "sudden death" but that's not going to stop me...

With that said, if I start noticing hair loss I will stop immediately.

If bioidentical progesterone is used finasteride might not be needed...
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,192953.msg1733564.html#msg1733564

As said, reactions on receptors are like in cis people...

Thanks jade, sorry it took me awhile to reply back to you. Hope you can start sooner...
Hugs xoxo

April

Quote from: Jade_404 on October 07, 2015, 06:22:35 PM
I see my Dr. in December. She had mentioned increasing my dose of E. I was thinking I would try to get a earlier appointment and talk to her about progesterone. I could use the increase of appetite And round boobs, yup sign me up! Thanks for the prometrium tip, now I know what to ask my Dr. about

BTW

iKate, Carmenkate April  , I think I joined Susans about the same time as you and I have watched you two blossom in to very beautiful women! You both started HRT before me and I do have some catching up to do. You are an inspiration , the both of you! Also very stunning 

Hugs

-Jade

Had a negative experience with Progesterone the first time around.  It had my moods swinging pretty wildly.  My endo and I discussed it in October and I elected to skip it for now.  I get the thought that it is naturally present and therefor just a part of being a woman, but that does not remove my concerns of over the top swings.

Quote from: RachelsMantra on November 13, 2015, 12:04:33 PM

I keep hearing about these "bad mental effects" such as crazy mood swings but I have never ever been a moody person and I rarely experience swings in my emotions so it would really surprise me if medroxyprogesterone made a huge difference to my overall mental life. I will keep monitoring how I feel though. I don't see my endo for like another 3.5 months and my plan is to stay on medroxyprogesterone for that time.

I wouldn't worry about it so much. I was on it until recently, and I didn't experience what I could describe as negative effects. In fact I've had pretty decent breast growth from it (solid B-cup now), non-cycled, as well as a fairly consistent period. I wouldn't even cycle it since it works differently than something like Prometrium, which I'm attempting cycling. And yes I have heard situations where it is meant to be cycled, but they don't exactly apply. But then it also has a fairly low bioavailability I believe, so I might have to figure out my own doses. :/ MY endo is certainly the one that doesn't know anything. You'll probably be fine starting on the medroxy and not cycling it. Take my advice with a grain of salt though, I am not a doctor.

EDIT: Also I will say, you're going to have to get used to mood swings anyway. It really is just a part of the female brain chemistry. Expect mental changes, especially along with the social. I've found that I have developed a certain irrationality, I've become more communicative and social, and I do experience mood swings through my cycle, but within normality for a female. You just have to sort of adapt.

Quote from: Ashey on November 17, 2015, 03:52:37 AM
I wouldn't worry about it so much. I was on it until recently, and I didn't experience what I could describe as negative effects.

Yeah, I also asked the girls in my support group and some of them have been on medroxy for awhile with no negative side effects so Im feeling better about it.

If it works for you it works. Personally I want the closest thing to what a cis female has in her blood stream, so I stick to prometrium/bioidentical P.

There's a trans woman I know who swears by Premarin as well. It works for her. Everyone is different.

I was first put on medroxy. The negative side effects (deperession/mood swings) didnt come in till about 4-6 months in. My doc switched me to Prometrium and everything got better like within a few weeks.