Hello girls,

So a very few weeks ago I had lower face FFS. The doctor did bony and soft tissue work.

I had:

Mandibular angle contouring

Jaw narrowing

Genioplasty with bone osteotomy

Neck lipoed and tightened (not like a facelift, but just redraped, I suppose)

Buccal fat pad removal

Masseter muscle reduction

Some rearranging of the soft tissues on my chin.

Now, as far as I can tell it will all be beautiful, but being only a few weeks out I am still very much very swollen, and so my cheeks do look a bit puffy in a way that they haven't since my teens, and obviously it makes my jaw and chin look bigger than they will after a few months. Ladies who have had serious jaw work, how long did it take before you felt like your jaw looked really nice and defined and without much swelling? Also, has anyone had restricted jaw movement after surgery? I suspect this is due to the master muscle reduction, and was wondering how long it took before you could fully open your mouth again? I can eat and talk normally, but vertically I can only fit around a finger and a half into my mouth and I'm getting a little impatient for my mouth to work fully again.

You poor lass but give it time and I am sure you will be fine .. 

Hugs

Paula

What is a buccal fat pad? and what sort of rearranging of the soft tissues on the chin do you mean?

I have fat tissue around my mouth, especially just under my mouth above the chin that looks very unflattering and rather masculine. Is there a way to get this fixed? by either lipo of filling it in?

Wow sounds like a lot! Hope your recovery keeps going well. Swelling is such a pain in the butt.

Quote from: JaniceNL on December 25, 2015, 03:35:31 PM
What is a buccal fat pad? and what sort of rearranging of the soft tissues on the chin do you mean?

I have fat tissue around my mouth, especially just under my mouth above the chin that looks very unflattering and rather masculine. Is there a way to get this fixed? by either lipo of filling it in?

The buccal fat pads, are two, well, pads of fat present in the cheeks (one on each side). It's not generally recommended to have these removed, but I had a lot of soft tissue in my lower cheeks and with a jaw tapering it would just become jowls, basically. It's weird because I had slightly hollow cheeks (in a nice way), yet I still had a lot of lower facial fat and after the removal my cheeks look as full as in my teens thanks to swelling, I guess. By soft tissue rearrangement I mean the chin and lower lip have been pushed up in such a way that now my lower teeth are basically completely covered, which is very feminizing and youthful, and that the skin around my chin has somehow been tightened over it, as I had quite loose skin in the area prior to surgery.

Btw, I think I lied to you girls - my jaw angle itself is unchanged except for the masseter muscle reduction. I know it doesn't sound like it considering all the surgery I had on it, but my jaw was already quite feminine and aesthetically pleasing shapewise, so the jaw angle contouring would only have given me a weird face shape. It's more like the rest of the jaw was contoured to run smoothly into the jaw angle, if that makes sense. So I have retained my facial height and width and the angle of my face which also ensures that the head doesn't look too small for the body!

Quote from: Debra on December 25, 2015, 06:29:17 PM
Wow sounds like a lot! Hope your recovery keeps going well. Swelling is such a pain in the butt.

Thank you! I just want to be able to fully open my mouth again, haha!

Out of interest, who did your surgery?

I had everything you did, except for Buccal fat pad removal, 3.5 months ago, and I am still very swollen; and I am able to fit three fingers in my mouth at this stage.

Omg thank you so much for responding! Did you go through periods of "is there even a difference" or "I can see a difference, but is the shape good enough" etc during the first few weeks? Like, I can tell all the masculine gender markers are gone, sometimes I love the results, other times I'm not sure anything is different etc. I'm trying to be patient but it helps to hear from others who have been through the same.

I have some lumps and a little unevenness on my right and left side, and some other things that aren't right, like my upper lip looking longer than it did pre op due to the fat transfer I had, so yeah I'm trying to be patient, and hoping that I won't need a revision.

Aw I'm sorry to hear that! I don't have any bumps or irregularities, I believe my surgeon does the chin and jaw in a way that prevents this. He did mention something like that. Everything looks nice, it's just with the amount of things he did, I feel like I look nice and it all looks feminine, but it just looks very much the same.. like, I look a lot like myself. More than I expected haha! I think it throws me a little because the results are basically like.. If I took good photos, from the best angles before surgery and slightly edited my jaw and chin to look more narrow, that's what I look like. I think I can go from profile picture to profile picture without anyone noticing. And it's not like I wasn't considered beautiful before, so it's not bad, I just expected more of a change , I suppose. Was just wondering how much of this is due to swelling. Don't get me wrong there is a big difference in the width of my jaw, no male gender markers left, but the chin still seems a little too.. not big, just.. Boxy? And yet as I say this, it's so definitely changed, that I almost feel bad for saying it. It's only been a couple of weeks, I'm sure it's just the swelling.

My chin looks boxy too, but when I pull the skin taught on either side it reveals a smaller more defined chin, so it's the swelling making it look bigger. When I had type 3 forehead surgery several years ago, I could tell from the start that I was going to have a good result, but since there is so much soft tissue involved with jaw and chin, there is so much more swelling, and it makes it more difficult to assess the outcome in the beginning.

Is it possible to go from a fairly masculine jaw to a feminine one or is the best you can hope for is a having a masculine mandible but soft enough to pass for female.  I consider the jaws  that models have or like Angelina Jolie to be very feminine, like they really don't look like handsome jaws like that Channing Tatum or something like that, which are more the kind I am talking about.

Seems foreheads are one of those areas you can get dramatic change but jaws they can only alter them a little.  Its like Iv rarely ever seen a dramatic jaw result, everyone who posts pics always already had a feminine jaw and is just showing off their changes in eyes and cheeks usually... jaw results are hard to find.  Maybe everyone who has a masculine jaw is just stuck and thats why you don't see those before and afters

*Update*

Today, out of nowhere, I just noticed a significant decrease in swelling. My jaw looked so beautiful and chin was nice a pointy (but not too pointy), and he results from the buccal fat removal are starting to become apparent and so far I LOVE the effect it had! Last minute decision by the surgeon and boy am I glad he decided on it (there was no extra charge for it, so obviously not a US surgeon). This is only a few weeks out. I can't wait to see what the first and subsequent months have to offer! The nose is still very swollen, yet more defined than before, since it was a revision. I'm just waiting patiently. So happy about today, I really needed a glimpse of what was done!

SamSparks, of course you can get w very feminine jaw, it's all a matter of choosing the right surgeon. You might not be able to get the exact jaw you want, due to where the bone ends and nerves begin, but say you have a wide face: women have wide faces too. The objective should be to get your facial width within what's average for a woman with a wide face. About the jaw angle, I think softening is preferable to elimination. When the jaw angle is tinkered with too much there's that weird banana face effect, and the head often looks too small for the body, making broad shoulders look broader. Basically get the jaw width from right before the angle down to the chin taken in a lot, have the chin height shortened and the chin made nice and feminine in shape, and unless you have very flared jaw angles, just gently soften them up. The mandibular angle itself is far less important than the rest of the jaw width and chin contour in many cases. Did any of this make sense? I'm really tired!

Quote from: SamSparks on December 27, 2015, 07:24:33 PM
Is it possible to go from a fairly masculine jaw to a feminine one or is the best you can hope for is a having a masculine mandible but soft enough to pass for female.  I consider the jaws  that models have or like Angelina Jolie to be very feminine, like they really don't look like handsome jaws like that Channing Tatum or something like that, which are more the kind I am talking about.

Seems foreheads are one of those areas you can get dramatic change but jaws they can only alter them a little.  Its like Iv rarely ever seen a dramatic jaw result, everyone who posts pics always already had a feminine jaw and is just showing off their changes in eyes and cheeks usually... jaw results are hard to find.  Maybe everyone who has a masculine jaw is just stuck and thats why you don't see those before and afters

You raise a very good subject.  I sure do not know the answer.  One guess is that the kind of heavy duty bone work required would only be contemplated to be done by an FFS surgeon who is trained and skilled at cranial bone surgery.  On the other hand, your comment about some famous acknowledged beautiful female faces having rather strong jaw features is factually accurate. Possibly the approach is for the surgeon to be able to "aesthetically reorganize"  (is that a new term ?  ) the facial features that can be substantially remodeled - - but only doing so in such a way that they end up in  feminine harmony  with the pre-existing prominent male structural jaw features.  Also, it may be that some fat grafting can help to re-configure the appearance to assist in that feminine result.  Forgive the speculation run rampant!       

Great news

Hugs

Paula

Quote from: BellaSwan on December 27, 2015, 08:22:01 PM
*Update*

Today, out of nowhere, I just noticed a significant decrease in swelling.

In a cruel twist, my swelling is back today with a vengeance. By head looks the same as before surgery today. Like, I literally look how I did preop. My nose especially looks identical to before. Speaking of which, I was wondering if any of you have experience with very crooked or deviated noses. Mine was very crooked/deviated prior to my first rhinoplasty, got better but went somewhat back to its original position, and then after my revision seems to be going back again due to the cartilage memory. Has anyone had success correcting a very deviated nose into a straight position and keeping it there despite cartilage memory?

Its not that I want a perfect feminine jaw.  I actually like strong jaws on females (yes I have a strong jaw, maybe im biased ha) but the whole "extending" thing that jaws do on males.  Like where the mandible just grows to0 vertically and stretches out your face.  This is a super male thing.  In females they would make fun of her for having a "horse face" if her jaw developed in this way.  I do not have like an extreme example of this, but overall my lower face is overdeveloped vertically, not for a male really (for a male its pretty ok...symmetrical... all things considered), but definitely if I want to look female.  Its really visually triggering for me and I really want to do everything possible to make it look like my jaw is shallower and basically like my face is more compact.  Like I want my lips closer to my nose and my chin close to my lips, if that makes sense.  But I know I can't "shrink" my lower face so that it all stays in proportion so I don't think its really possible to do what I want.  If I could design my face I would literally photo shop my mouth closer to my nose and then make the chin and jaw become proportional.  If only.  Thats not possible though.  So I feel like what will happen is I will get some change in my chin but overall I will still have a stretched out lower 1/3 of face.  Oh well.

Here is a pic of brad and angie.  So everyone likes to say she has a masculine jaw, but its really only wide and thats IT!  Overwise its shallower, chin has minimal vertical growth.  Brad's looks bigger even thought his isn't super masculine by any means.  That says a lot about how different male and female jaws are.  You can see his is much deeper vertically.  Brad has a very symmetrical face obviously, mine isn't even as feminine as his would be if he started to transition at my age, cause his face is more compact, his mouth is situated closer to his nose giving him a smaller more compact face which is necessary to look like a woman...


http://imgur.com/sxTecJ0

First of all, update: swelling is going steadily down, but due to having drinks New Years and a lot of salt the following day I swelled up again. It's going down again now. I am so happy so far, everything is looking wonderful! I'm sure I will be thrilled in a few months.

SamSparks: I don't think jaw height by the mandibular angle is a big male thing. Angelina's mandibular angle height is taller than Brad's. But definitely, the closer you get to the chin, the more masculine the vertical height. Keep in mind her jaw and chin have been greatly enhanced with implants - her natural jaw and chin were more delicate. She's basically used surgery to give herself a very structured face. I wouldn't recommend everyone get the work done she's had - she had the lips and eyes for a bigger facial structure. And I agree, a strong jaw isn't necessarily masculine - I kept the bony width of my mandibular angle and only thinned the masseter muscle. Love the effect it had combined with the feminization of my jawline and chin. My entire lower face looks much more refined, while maintaining structure and definition.

You have put so much work in the details of the procedures you had that it almost makes me wonder if I am equally prepared. On the other hand mabye it's just best to let the surgeon do his thing?


I would have liked advice on what to get with my face, it's sort of round and I think a more pointed chin would look better than a round one. But I can't directly post pictures here