At work I present as a female. Since last October. I wrote a fair email to everyone in the department, where I explicitly state I wish to be addressed as a 'she' and that I identify as a female.

There is that colleague who insists on calling me 'man' whenever we converse. He also uses other names, such as 'dude', 'guy' (singulars). He is convinced all of them are gender neutral.

I am not a native speaker, and neither is he. I would like to avoid official channels yet to resolve the dilemma 'appropriate or not'. I am hoping somebody here could help me understand where are the boundaries.

Multiple times I made clear to this colleague of mine I don't appreciate being called by any of those names. I want to be addressed as 'Ms', or by my name or by a nickname I already disclosed. He thinks it is his right to address me as he wishes. Doesn't my word count for something? Sarcastically, he apologized to me saying 'sorry man' when I told him it hurts me.

The emotions aside, I would like to know US legal and linguistic bits. Big thanks!

The only person who still deadname me and use 'son' is my dad... Everyone else call me mam' , miss or just my name Elodie.

I however had an experience with an old date friend. We always used  Man, dude  as words to talk to each other so i just chill with that.  However if it was someone random i would be upset.

From.what you describe, he is clearly showing disregard to you, your wishes and your feelings. It seems you've warned him enough and he is showing defiance - probably to prove a point. Personally, I would take it up with HR.

People say man and dude to girls they see as good friends.

Oh no! At work.
Call a local LGBT office and request lawyer referrals. Some will give free advice and tell you what you need to do to put legal things in motion.

Make plans because you may need another job if you proceed with a lawsuit. Actually,  you may want to just plan on it,  but don't do it unless you absolutely need to. 

Maybe that's Wat I should hav done wen I worked at Walmart cause my department supervisor called me sir cause she was mad at me  n I was like Wat did u say n she said she knew Wat she said n she had a grin on her face n wen the head manager came into the office cause she heard me n my supervisor argueing she asked Wats the problem n I told her my supervisor called me sir n my supervisor said no she didn't n then the head manager told me that whether she did or not dosnt matter cause since I am legal still male she can do so n then I brought up bout opening a case n the head manager said that she dosnt want to hear bout opening cases cause then she gets insulted.

I've had other incidencea wit a girl who knew me from before who intentionally called me he n him Infront of customers n other employees and even got mad wen I reported her for it.... She even told me she was goin to punch me in my face for reporting her.

It really depends on the person. My friend from when I was a kid calls me man a lot, but not really in a hurtful way. He just talks like that in a kinda dude bro way, so I don't get mad. Of course he's one of those guys that's into fitness and he's an NYPD even. He also used to call other girls dude and stuff.

Quote from: KittyKat on January 18, 2016, 01:14:45 PM
It really depends on the person. My friend from when I was a kid calls me man a lot, but not really in a hurtful way. He just talks like that in a kinda dude bro way, so I don't get mad. Of course he's one of those guys that's into fitness and he's an NYPD even. He also used to call other girls dude and stuff.

So, I'm not an native english speaker, but I do know these: There are people who call girls "dude" and "man" and "bro". Maybe its what he is doing. Maybe not.

Wich one is it? I dunno. Guess you will have to feel it.

Quote from: wanessa.delisola on January 18, 2016, 01:39:52 PM
So, I'm not an native english speaker, but I do know these: There are people who call girls "dude" and "man" and "bro". Maybe its what he is doing. Maybe not.

Wich one is it? I dunno. Guess you will have to feel it.

There's certain people that pretty much call everyone dude, bro or man.

I'd it's all about the rules of your company whether they consider it harassment or not. I don't know if your legal status is male or not, it probably will come to how your company interprets it. Obviously he's not going to stop because you ask him to. If your pre everything I don't think you can legally do anything and I doubt your company needs to do anything.

Thank you for replies so far. I sense a second tier may define this one better.

Please beware that this topic is about interpretation, not about resolution. We have mechanisms to deal with this type of things, but they require very careful use. I used them once and it is like 'just' touching a huge telescope whose gears make deafening thunder sound that nobody really wants to hear. There are alternative approaches as well. It is mine to pick what to do.

Let us assume that business communication understands certain standards. It is a company, not a street. Are there [referenceable] linguistic standards to justify what I just heard today? Feel free to share.

I don't know your solution, but I worked with someone for 6 years who was a manic depressive and everyday would try to instigate arguments and quarrels amongst the night crew. He constantly said that he would get a lawyer if anyone especially the company tried to interfere with his free speech. Honestly he was one depressing person who made everyone's life miserable , but nothing could be done. Management didn't want a law suit nor did anyone else.  He never step over any boundary of physical abuse it was all mental which you really couldn't legally prove. We had to put up with him and it wasn't fun. He was the epitome of the bad apple.

There are no linguistic standards.  Some people do say man to everybody.  However that's for casual use.  In a business environment it's normal to expect a bit more professionalism.  This guy is just being intentionally rude and acting like an as*. 

It's hard to say much more without knowing more like what type of business it is and some background on the employees.


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Quote from: KittyKat on January 18, 2016, 01:14:45 PM
It really depends on the person. My friend from when I was a kid calls me man a lot, but not really in a hurtful way. He just talks like that in a kinda dude bro way, so I don't get mad. Of course he's one of those guys that's into fitness and he's an NYPD even. He also used to call other girls dude and stuff.

Not when you repeatedly ask them to stop and they arry on!!

Quote from: Deborah on January 18, 2016, 04:41:55 PM
There are no linguistic standards.  Some people do say man to everybody.  However that's for casual use.  In a business environment it's normal to expect a bit more professionalism.  This guy is just being intentionally rude and acting like an as*. 

It's hard to say much more without knowing more like what type of business it is and some background on the employees.


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IF you read the OP's  message carefully, then you will find that she has repeatedly asked him to stop  calling her "hey man" but he refused. That's when it becomes obvioudly disredpectful.

I call all my friends, both boys and girls, dude, bro, and man. It's pretty common in the U.S.

Maybe give him a copy of this? You can change she to he and hand it ti them

http://letsqueerthingsup.com/2014/09/15/what-youre-actually-saying-when-you-ignore-someones-preferred-gender-pronouns/

Calling a group of people "guys" is the only acceptable one in my book. I remember girls going nuts at the stoners at school for calling them man or dude.

Not acceptable for me.

Does he call all other women in your department the same way? If not, this man is clearly undermining your position.

On Language:
Technically, man and dude are not gender neutral, no matter how often people use it as a neutral pronoun. Is it used that way, yes, but then the secondary meaning depends on context and how close you are to a person, like how you would call grandmother, nana or, lola, or grammy. Obviously wouldn't call the unlikeable grandmother something like nana, and the more discomfort, you would probably address her as formal as you can get, grandmother.

Dude is extremely casual and unsuitable for the workplace. Sir, madame (ma'am), and miss also might be too formal depending on the type of office environment you're in. These titles were sprung from military rank and file from Western hierarchal structure and often are most commonly used when addressing a peace officer in public, a superior, or a stranger. In the office, you're most likely to use a person's name or what they choose to be called. The company's culture and standards are what you are most likely to go by. For example, in the Army you might be addressed by your last name or to be called maam, but while working in the office, the first name just might be it.

I would refer to your Human resources manual for specific boundaries, as there are no "US" standards. All of this also differs depending on the state in which you live. In California, where I live, it is against the law to discriminate against TGs.

Here's a link with all the states and their availability of protections offered:
http://transgenderlawcenter.org/equalitymap

The female version of dude, dudette is almost never used commonly anymore. Chick is probably the most acceptable and modern version of dudette.

Bonne Chance, Martine.

Audree