Quote from: Steph34 on February 16, 2016, 10:50:00 AM
The excess carb/insulin theory has been thoroughly debunked
Lipids. 2009 Apr;44(4):297-309."We recently proposed that the biological markers improved by carbohydrate restriction were precisely those that define the metabolic syndrome (MetS), and that the common thread was regulation of insulin as a control element. We specifically tested the idea with a 12-week study comparing two hypocaloric diets (approximately 1,500 kcal): a carbohydrate-restricted diet (CRD) (%carbohydrate:fat:protein = 12:59:28) and a low-fat diet (LFD) (56:24:20) in 40 subjects with atherogenic dyslipidemia. Both interventions led to improvements in several metabolic markers, but
subjects following the CRD had consistently reduced glucose (-12%) and insulin (-50%) concentrations, insulin sensitivity (-55%), weight loss (-10%), decreased adiposity (-14%), and more favorable triacylglycerol (TAG) (-51%), HDL-C (13%) and total cholesterol/HDL-C ratio (-14%) responses. In addition to these markers for MetS, the CRD subjects showed more favorable responses to alternative indicators of cardiovascular risk: postprandial lipemia (-47%), the Apo B/Apo A-1 ratio (-16%), and LDL particle distribution. Despite a threefold higher intake of dietary saturated fat during the CRD, saturated fatty acids in TAG and cholesteryl ester were significantly decreased, as was palmitoleic acid (16:1n-7), an endogenous marker of lipogenesis, compared to subjects consuming the LFD."
Nutr Res. 2013 Nov;33(11):905-12."We hypothesized that a CRD (<50 g carbohydrate/d) for 6 weeks would improve lipid profiles and insulin sensitivity, reduce blood pressure, decrease cellular adhesion and inflammatory biomarkers, and augment VEF (flow-mediated dilation and forearm blood flow) in statin users."
"Daily nutrient intakes at baseline (46/36/17% carb/fat/pro) and averaged across the intervention (11/58/28% carb/fat/pro) demonstrated dietary compliance, with carbohydrate intake at baseline nearly 5-fold greater than during the intervention (P < .001). Compared to baseline, both systolic and diastolic blood pressure decreased after 3 and 6 weeks (P < .01). Peak forearm blood flow, but not flow-mediated dilation, increased at week 6 compared to baseline and week 3 (P ≤ .03).
Serum triglyceride, insulin, soluble E-Selectin and intracellular adhesion molecule-1 decreased (P < .01) from baseline at week 3, and this effect was maintained at week 6."
Mol Cell Biochem. 2007 Aug;302(1-2):249-56."The body weight, body mass index,
the level of blood glucose, total cholesterol, LDL-cholesterol, triglycerides, and urea showed a significant decrease from week 1 to week 56 (P < 0.0001), whereas the level of HDL-cholesterol increased significantly (P < 0.0001). Interestingly these changes were more significant in subjects with high blood glucose level as compared to those with normal blood glucose level."
"This study shows the beneficial effects of ketogenic diet in obese diabetic subjects following its long-term administration."
QuoteAromatization does not make sense because it is a minor influence on T levels in men
In men who gain weight and become more and more obese, there is increased conversion of T to E as aromatase is abundantly found in adipose tissue. More T to E=less T overall
Quotewhose SHBG forms primarily in response to the presence of T.
SHBG is produced in response to E (in portal vein, from intestines to liver, where E stimulates SHBG), not in response to T. This is why transwomen's levels of SHBG increase, this is why SHBG increases during pregnancy, this is why SHBG drops in transmen. More E = more SHBG, regardless of genetic sex. Ample studies confirm this and many TS women in this forum can attest to this, including myself. My SHBG is very high.
QuotePeople with insulin resistance tend to have high or borderline high blood sugar. My fasting glucose level tends to be borderline low, like near 70. That is strongly indicative of normal insulin function.
People who are insulin resistant have high blood sugar because cells are resistant to insulin, hence sugar remains in blood and becomes elevated. Your levels may be in the normal range but that doesn't necessarily imply that insulin levels are low. A person will produce higher and higher levels of insulin in response to cells becoming less and less sensitive to insulin, keep their blood sugar normal but eventually, no matter how high your insulin is, your cells suddenly stop responding and this is when the real problems begin. You don't want to wait until you get there, trust me! High insulin levels, in the presence of normal blood glucose are often times the precursor to diabetes and insulin resistance. I would test my insulin levels to be sure. You may have high insulin and yet normal blood glucose. Blood glucose only is high when insulin resistance occurs. Don't wait until then!
QuoteThere seems to be no solution for chronic stress; it is part of who I am, unfortunately.
You can take time off, relax, do things that you enjoy. Do yoga, exercise. Take medications for that. Progesterone is also calming due to the sedative effects of its metabolite, allopregnanolone. Finasteride/dutasteride can have the opposite effect due to inhibition of allopregnanolone formation.
QuoteProgesterone does seem to make it worse
Strange.
It's supposed to make it better. It does for me. I take it with food to increase effect, I also don't take finasteride/dutasteride.
QuoteAlso, estradiol valerate injections (which I no longer use) increased my abdominal fat dramatically within the first 48 hours post-injection. I thought female hormones were supposed to help with fat redistribution, not give me a potbelly!
Only 48 hours and you are already jumping to conclusions. It was most probably water retention, which can be countered by progesterone due to its antimineralocorticoid effects.
QuoteLike all fads, low-carb diets need to reinvent themselves every few years
Low carb diet is a way of life, not a fad diet, as I explained before. One needs to understand the intricacies of the diet, to eat enough fat, not stray away from saturated fats. Take enough salt, etc.
QuoteA varied diet is the only way (besides supplementation) to prevent nutrient deficiencies.
http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf"Two normal men volunteered to live solely on meat for one
year, which gave us an unusual opportunity of studying the
effects of this diet. The term "meat," as used by us, included
both the lean and the fat portions of animals. The subjects
derived most of their calories from fat and the diet was quite
different from what one, who uses the term "meat" as including
chiefly lean muscle, would expect."
"It is well known that the Eskimos have lived on an almost exclusive
meat diet for generations. Certain explorers in the North
also have subsisted for long periods on meat. Dr. Vilhjalmur
Stefansson in particular has demonstrated that it is feasible for
travelers in the arctic region to "live off the country," which
means living on meat alone. The experiences of Stefansson and
his companions have been given in his book "The Friendly Arctic"
(2). He spent over 11 years in arctic exploration, during 9 years
of which he lived almost exclusively on meat."
"Thomas (4), finding no elevation of blood pressure and
rarely any evidence of renal disease in the examination of 142 Eskimos,
concluded that a carneous diet under strenuous living conditions does not
produce renal or vascular disease."
"buffalo meat was the "staff of life" of the Central Plains' Indians. He cited also Head's
account of subsisting on the native diet of beef and water while crossing the
South American Pampas. All of these races are noted for their endurance
of exertion and hardships."
"Thomas (4) found no rickets or scurvy among the Greenland Eskimos,
but a large incidence of these diseases among the Labrador Eskimos who
live mostly on preserved food including dried potatoes, flour, canned foods,
and cereals. Stefansson (7) reported three patients with scurvy on his last
expedition, one of whom was our subject, Andersen. These cases were
caused by eating canned foods with only a small amount of cooked meat,
and were cured by eating raw meat."
"Lieb, in 1922 ( 8 ), carefully examined Stefansson and stated that he found no evidence of injury from the prolonged
and exclusive use of meat. He mentions the experience of two other men who lived mainly on meat for shorter periods."
Conclusion of the study:
"At the end of the year, the subjects were mentally alert,
physically active, and showed no specific physical changes in any
system of the body."
"In these trained subjects, the clinical observations and
laboratory studies gave no evidence that any ill effects had
occurred from the prolonged use of the exclusive meat diet."
"Vitamin deficiencies did not appear."QuoteDr. Atkins himself was one of them. He was overweight and had a heart attack due to his diet
Not quite.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Atkins_(nutritionist)#Death"Atkins suffered cardiac arrest in April 2002, leading many of his critics to point to this episode as proof of the inherent dangers in the consumption of high levels of saturated fat associated with the Atkins diet. In numerous interviews, however, Atkins stated that his cardiac arrest was not the result of poor diet, but was rather caused by a chronic infection.[9] Atkins' personal physician and cardiologist, Dr. Patrick Fratellone, confirmed this assertion, saying, "We have been treating this condition, cardiomyopathy, for almost two years. Clearly, [Atkins'] own nutritional protocols have left him, at the age of 71, with an extraordinarily healthy cardiovascular system".
"Dr. Patrick Fratellone treated Dr. Atkins from 1999 until 2002, and also worked with the doctor at the Atkins Center. He says Atkins suffered from cardiomyopathy, a chronic heart weakness. But this condition, he says, was caused by a virus—not his diet: "I was his attending cardiologist at that time. And I made the statement... When we did his angiogram, I mean, the doctor who performed it, said it's pristine for someone that eats his kind of diet... Pristine, meaning these are very clean arteries. I didn't want people to think that his diet caused his heart muscle – it was definitely a documented viral infection."[14]
"Critics often misinterpreted this incident as a heart attack instead of an episode of cardiac arrest caused by his condition and often use the two interchangeably when citing the incident however the two are distinct problems. The American Heart Association clearly defines and shows the distinction between the two."
"A medical report issued by the New York medical examiner's office a year after his death showed that Atkins had a history of heart attack, congestive heart failure and hypertension. It also noted that he weighed 258 pounds (117 kilograms) at death,
but Dr. Atkins weighed 195 pounds (88 kilograms) the day after he entered the hospital following his fall; he gained 63 pounds (29 kilograms) from fluid retention during the nine days he was in a coma before he died.[18][20]"He was just under 6 feet tall so 195 lbs is not overweight.
Also, one does not always follow one's own advices anyways. So, even if what you had said was true, it didn't necessarily mean he followed his own diet. Many doctors smoke, eat unhealthy and yet advise the contrary to their patients. One needs to prove, as well, that heart attack would have been CAUSED by his diet and not by something else (i.e. stress). You quickly jump to conclusions before taking the time to read between the lines and dig deeper.
Quotelike you, he believed that saturated fats were healthy
Not a belief. Corroborated by science.
Am J Clin Nutr. 2010 Mar;91(3):535-46."A meta-analysis of prospective epidemiologic studies showed that there is no significant evidence for concluding that dietary saturated fat is associated with an increased risk of CHD or CVD."
Ann Intern Med. 2014 Mar 18;160(6):398-406."Current evidence does not clearly support cardiovascular guidelines that encourage high consumption of polyunsaturated fatty acids and low consumption of total saturated fats."
Adv Nutr. 2013 May 1;4(3):294-302."This review calls for a rational reevaluation of existing dietary recommendations that focus on minimizing dietary SFAs, for which mechanisms for adverse health effects are lacking."
Quotea person does not need to count calories as long as one avoids the carbs.
JAMA. 2007 Mar 7;297(9):969-77."In this study, premenopausal overweight and obese women assigned to follow the Atkins diet, which had the lowest carbohydrate intake, lost more weight at 12 months than women assigned to follow the Zone diet, and had experienced comparable or more favorable metabolic effects than those assigned to the Zone, Ornish, or LEARN diets"
QuoteI need to eat at least 300g of carbs daily to prevent dizziness.
This is because you lose water and salt when you start restricting carbs. You need to increase water and salt consumption as you do when on Spiro. Bouillons/broths help.
Quoteon Fridays, I eat as much fat as I want - no limits - and the result is increased caloric intake and resultant abdominal fat gain.
You can't gain fat so quickly. LOL. Were you exclusively eating protein and fat, and no carbs? Try that, fatty meat and butter and see how much you can eat...The problem is we can overeat fat WHEN combined with carbs. THAT is the problem.
QuoteI think I would throw up on purpose... total gross-out, ewww! In addition to animal "foods" being totally disgusting and slimy
You seem to be already biased, have a moral prejudice. This is not about emotions but about setting facts straight. We need to remain objective and disconnect from our emotions. You sure have the right not to like animal foods, to each their own but animal foods are no less healthy because you find them disgusting.
Quoteanimal agriculture leads to Holocaust-like treatment of farm animals and terrible pollution.
Do you use a car? How many things do you do that contribute to pollution, and to a greater extent than animal farming/raising?
One can buy directly from farms who raise their animals ethically, give them proper outdoor access and freedom/space, raise them on organic grounds, do not give them hormones or antibiotics. It's not always that much more expensive.
Or one can eat low carb/high fat without including animal foods. It IS possible and doable.
QuoteIt is also a major factor in heart disease, which is often linked to abdominal fat. The evidence is so convincing
I'm afraid you haven't really taken the time to read either the studies I provided or the science in general. This seems not to be the case.
Quotethe American Heart Association refuses to grant its seal of approval to full-fat animal products
and yet diabetes has risen in the last few decades despite people trying to eat lower fat and following recommendations while in Sweden...
BMJ 2013; 347"An influential Swedish health organisation has recommended a diet that is low in carbohydrates but not low in fat for people who are overweight or obese or have diabetes.
The advice from the Swedish Council on Health and Technology Assessment is the result of a two year review of 16 000 scientific studies of diet.1 The recommendation contradicts the generally held belief that people should avoid foods that are rich in fat, especially those high in saturated fat.
The council, which advises the Swedish healthcare system, concluded that the scientific evidence did not support a low fat diet. Instead people should focus on reducing their intake of carbohydrates."
Just wait...in time, things will also change, here in America. It's a question of time, letting the older generations pass, and the newer generations come about very different conclusions. There is a lot of corruption. You absolutely need to read Gary Taubes's book. He is not tied to any organization, he is a scientific journalist and provides ample evidence in book.
Quotethe medical profession's consensus that saturated fats should be limited
Things are slowly, but surely changing. Doctors are influenced by pharmaceutical companies, have ties, scientists as well. Many are taught one thing at school and keep on repeating the same thing, over and over again, without reading the latest evidence or the bulk of evidence which is weak in favor of cutting saturated fats. Epidemiological studies, by the way, cannot show cause and effect, there are confounding variables.
QuoteIf you just go from 2000 to 6000 calories overnight, you might throw up, but the body learns how to process it. My abdominal fat problem is due to excess CALORIE intake - both fats and carbs.
Until you haven't taken the time to read opposing evidence in detail, we can't discuss further. I have personally listened to both sides of the argument, read tons of research. It is important to remain objective and scientific about this whole thing.
QuoteHigh cholesterol is mostly genetic, it seems. You can eat like that and have normal cholesterol because you lack the genetic predisposition to high cholesterol.
If you read the latest studies and evidence, you would know that cholesterol is but a small part of the whole set of things that matter when it comes to cardiovascular health. For instance, cholesterol:HDL ratio, so if both increase but ratio remains good, there is no problem despite high cholesterol levels. Same thing with LDL, and size of LDL particles.
Did you know that low carb, high fat raises HDL, lowers triglycerides, improves blood pressure, reduces body weight and improve glucose tolerance for some, all these being markers for metabolic syndrome? LDL particle also becomes larger, less atherogenic, Apo B drops, etc.
QuoteI stick with healthy, unsaturated fats like olive and sunflower
Sunflower oil contains high Omega-6 relative to Omega-3, which can lead to excess inflammation in the body.
QuoteMeanwhile, my mother eats lots of meat, cheese, and butter and has to take strong statins to control her cholesterol.
It has been discovered that statins don't necessarily reduce cardiovascular risk due to lowering cholesterol but rather due to some other mechanisms on platelets and artery dilation, I believe. It's been shown there is an association between very low cholesterol levels and increased mortality although this is just an association. So, things are not as simple as you think.
High cholesterol on its own doesn't say much. One needs to look at other factors. I explained this above. I hope the doctors did this as well with her.
Statins have been shown to help those with previous heart attack or stroke but not so much in those with no previous occurrences. The link is especially weak in women.
QuoteThe cardiovascular advantage of Mediterranean people also disappears when they move to the USA because they eat more fatty meat.
Because that's the only change they make when they move to the US!?
QuoteI really do not care to argue anymore about diet.
Should you change your mind and decide to pursue this argument, please PM me. We can exchange ideas for as long as you want.
QuoteThe take-home message here is that abdominal fat is a complex problem with no easy solution. "Eat less, exercise more, and give the hormones 2-5 years to redistribute fat cells" may not be what people want to hear, but the truth can be quite bitter sometimes.
You first say the problem is complex and then go on to state that those three things, patience, eating less and exercising more is the solution, a fairly simple approach.
People eat less, exercise more but get more frustrated, hungry, etc. Obesity has increased in America, despite this advice and millions following this recommendation. It just doesn't work that way. One needs to dig deep into the science, understand hormonal intricacies, how hormones affect fat storage, appetite, etc.
You know the best way to get ready to someone's invitation to a copious dinner and be sure you'll be hungry enough to eat everything there? Eat little and exercise a lot that day. Come dinner, you'll be HUNGRY, trust me you!
