Is it easier to walk like a man after T? I'm just now starting to get an STP to wear full time in hopes it will make me walk more male. I have always sat like a male naturally until corrected.

My problem is I naturally smile at everyone and say "hi" when I'm in a good mood. Is that too feminine? I need to learn to stop talking with my hands. However I had a very masculine grandpa that spoke with his hands and threw them up in the air and pounded his fists while expressing anger and strong emotions.

Early on in my transition I spent a good year imitating how men walked and sat and sort of did things. I found I had to put in the effort. After about a year or so I got on T and then I stopped really noticing that I had to "try" so much. Do I think it's because of the T? No, I think if I had not put in the time practicing and putting it into muscle memory I would not have changed my walk. So I definitely suggest doing your best to learn how to walk. it's sucky right now and I know it feels a bit fake, but it gets easier and easier and eventually it's just how you will walk.

As for talking, I still speak like a woman, if that makes sense. I still use the same rises and falls and ways of speaking. Early on I tried so hard to change my speech patterns and to lower my voice, behave more calmly, but about a year into the T I decided to stop trying. I speak how I would normally. Early on it was a problem and I would get misgendered a lot because I didn't have facial hair, a deep voice or a masculine build yet (even though i'd already had my chest surgery), but now that I have facial hair, a deeper voice (i'm a tenor, slight baritone when singing) and a more masculine build, no one misgenders me. It's worth mentioning about a year ago I started taking singing lessons and  I actually found that helped SO MUCH with me being able to lower my voice to it's more natural, deeper sound. I think this is because when singing you need to learn how to control your pitch and then you can pick up lower tones much easier.

I don't know if that helps at all. I think you can either decide that you want to put in effort studying and training yourself to be more 'masculin' like I did with walking, or you can just shrug it off if you are comfortable with that aspect of yourself, as I was about my speech patterns. But you definitely won't get a change unless you teach yourself to do it that way, the T helps you pass by lowering your voice, and I guess if you find yourself too stimulated downstairs you may naturally start walking with a wider stance, but generally speaking i'd say the T only helps, but it won't change how you walk or talk, so practice now and it will be second nature in a few months/year

T isn't going to change your bone structure. The way you naturally walk might change some if you change your leg musculature through exercise, but otherwise you'll have to consciously train yourself to walk more like a man probably.

Try remembering not to walk "on a line" but on "two parallel lines" and bring the rest of your body into that movement rather than trying to keep the rest static.

I've always had a bit of a male swagger apparently, I remember my dad making fun of it when I was a child and nobody knew. Wasn't conscious or anything. I'm conscious of it now, though. I also remember a female friend in school specifically talking about walking on the line to make their walking "more feminine". A lot of it is probably just down to habit.

I'm also naturally more monotone when speaking - I didn't have to do much when comparing the way I talk to male voices and female voices to sound more masculine than feminine. Voice training is a part of transition for many people and it's probably one of the easier aspects to master just by habit.

What's annoying is that people respond to me better when I'm going up and down with the tone and smiling and all that, which had begun to "train" me into doing it at one point because obviously people seemed friendlier to me when I did. That's got to go, whether they like it or not, not least because people should be able to handle someone talking without grinning from ear to ear or flexing their tone a lot. I suppose it varies between cultures, some are more smiley and gesticulatory than others and expect it from you.

I have always had a manlier walk, and I think packing has improved the look of it, if that makes sense. I mean I can't keep my legs as close together as I normally would have otherwise.

The rest, I don't think T has anything to do with it, it's more so socialization. I don't really smile at people ever. With other guys, I will nod in their direction if it makes sense to do so, but otherwise I keep to myself.

Maybe there's some complicated biological reason that would make you walk in a more masculine way, who knows. But more than likely it's just a habit. It took me a while to learn to walk manlier, but mostly I just concentrated on not letting my hips swing around and walking on 2 lines, like the others said. Packing does help, as it forces you to keep your legs apart.

I always talked very monotone, probably a result of growing up with brothers. Sort of on a related note, I watched an interesting documentary on Netflix called "Do I sound gay" that talked about the origins of speaking patterns and why some people sound a certain way. Mostly came down to socialization and picking up habits from people around you. Very interesting stuff!

Quote from: Bastian on March 03, 2016, 09:44:51 AM
Early on in my transition I spent a good year imitating how men walked and sat and sort of did things. I found I had to put in the effort. After about a year or so I got on T and then I stopped really noticing that I had to "try" so much. Do I think it's because of the T? No, I think if I had not put in the time practicing and putting it into muscle memory I would not have changed my walk. So I definitely suggest doing your best to learn how to walk. it's sucky right now and I know it feels a bit fake, but it gets easier and easier and eventually it's just how you will walk.

As for talking, I still speak like a woman, if that makes sense. I still use the same rises and falls and ways of speaking. Early on I tried so hard to change my speech patterns and to lower my voice, behave more calmly, but about a year into the T I decided to stop trying. I speak how I would normally. Early on it was a problem and I would get misgendered a lot because I didn't have facial hair, a deep voice or a masculine build yet (even though i'd already had my chest surgery), but now that I have facial hair, a deeper voice (i'm a tenor, slight baritone when singing) and a more masculine build, no one misgenders me. It's worth mentioning about a year ago I started taking singing lessons and  I actually found that helped SO MUCH with me being able to lower my voice to it's more natural, deeper sound. I think this is because when singing you need to learn how to control your pitch and then you can pick up lower tones much easier.

I don't know if that helps at all. I think you can either decide that you want to put in effort studying and training yourself to be more 'masculin' like I did with walking, or you can just shrug it off if you are comfortable with that aspect of yourself, as I was about my speech patterns. But you definitely won't get a change unless you teach yourself to do it that way, the T helps you pass by lowering your voice, and I guess if you find yourself too stimulated downstairs you may naturally start walking with a wider stance, but generally speaking i'd say the T only helps, but it won't change how you walk or talk, so practice now and it will be second nature in a few months/year

I've seen plenty of cis men talk with their hands and act emotional. Look at some of those patriarchal politicians and clergymen. I also see many men crossing their legs like I do now as a woman. I also have always put my ankle on my thigh as well as crossing my legs. I never much attention to gestures and speech of cis people until now. Then again, how do we know they're cis gender just by looking at them.

Oh and no, I don't think talking with your hands is a specifically feminine thing.

You don't have to not say hi to people, but maybe switch to "hey" or "sup" or "how are you" if you're worried about it. Just pay attention to how guys greet you and do the same I guess. It's all practice.

Quote from: T.K.G.W. on March 03, 2016, 11:02:32 AM
T isn't going to change your bone structure. The way you naturally walk might change some if you change your leg musculature through exercise, but otherwise you'll have to consciously train yourself to walk more like a man probably.

Try remembering not to walk "on a line" but on "two parallel lines" and bring the rest of your body into that movement rather than trying to keep the rest static.

I've always had a bit of a male swagger apparently, I remember my dad making fun of it when I was a child and nobody knew. Wasn't conscious or anything. I'm conscious of it now, though. I also remember a female friend in school specifically talking about walking on the line to make their walking "more feminine". A lot of it is probably just down to habit.

I'm also naturally more monotone when speaking - I didn't have to do much when comparing the way I talk to male voices and female voices to sound more masculine than feminine. Voice training is a part of transition for many people and it's probably one of the easier aspects to master just by habit.

What's annoying is that people respond to me better when I'm going up and down with the tone and smiling and all that, which had begun to "train" me into doing it at one point because obviously people seemed friendlier to me when I did. That's got to go, whether they like it or not, not least because people should be able to handle someone talking without grinning from ear to ear or flexing their tone a lot. I suppose it varies between cultures, some are more smiley and gesticulatory than others and expect it from you.

As a child I was constantly corrected to be more emotional, smile, laugh and stop looking like "a tin soldier" because my facial expression is naturally neutral.

I have never been able to walk without my feet pointing outward. Once someone told me that was masculine.

Quote from: spro on March 03, 2016, 03:02:33 PM
Oh and no, I don't think talking with your hands is a specifically feminine thing.

You don't have to not say hi to people, but maybe switch to "hey" or "sup" or "how are you" if you're worried about it. Just pay attention to how guys greet you and do the same I guess. It's all practice.

I normally say "hey" or "hello there". I'm too much of a gentlemen to say "sup"...

Quote from: FTMax on March 03, 2016, 12:50:33 PM
I have always had a manlier walk, and I think packing has improved the look of it, if that makes sense. I mean I can't keep my legs as close together as I normally would have otherwise.

The rest, I don't think T has anything to do with it, it's more so socialization. I don't really smile at people ever. With other guys, I will nod in their direction if it makes sense to do so, but otherwise I keep to myself.

I smile and nod at people I like whether it's sexual attraction or just friendly. I always thought it was masculine because it reminds me of men tipping their hat to women in old movies, only I do it mostly to men I find attractive and they usually look down.

Quote from: spro on March 03, 2016, 02:59:18 PM
Maybe there's some complicated biological reason that would make you walk in a more masculine way, who knows. But more than likely it's just a habit. It took me a while to learn to walk manlier, but mostly I just concentrated on not letting my hips swing around and walking on 2 lines, like the others said. Packing does help, as it forces you to keep your legs apart.

I always talked very monotone, probably a result of growing up with brothers. Sort of on a related note, I watched an interesting documentary on Netflix called "Do I sound gay" that talked about the origins of speaking patterns and why some people sound a certain way. Mostly came down to socialization and picking up habits from people around you. Very interesting stuff!

I must be somewhat masculine because girls always complimented me on my intelligence and sometimes mistook me for a lesbian because when they talked about typical women things to me such as pregnancy and boyfriends I didn't respond emotionally. I was unconscious of why I had social conflicts like this until my early 20s.

I feel like I should just add in relation to my answer about how I chose not to really retrain my speech pattern: I decided early on (maybe 4 months after going onto T?) That I was fine with coming off as a gay man when I spoke to people. One of my good friends from highschool had that 'classic' gay speech pattern and as someone who is big into art and the theater and is generally flamboyant in character and is actually gay, I decided it didn't matter to me if that's how people saw me. So that's why I chose to not work on that. So what i'm saying it, the choices that you make are yours. Do what feels right to you, that's the whole point of all of this right? So just do you!

Quote from: Bastian on March 03, 2016, 06:15:06 PM
I feel like I should just add in relation to my answer about how I chose not to really retrain my speech pattern: I decided early on (maybe 4 months after going onto T?) That I was fine with coming off as a gay man when I spoke to people. One of my good friends from highschool had that 'classic' gay speech pattern and as someone who is big into art and the theater and is generally flamboyant in character and is actually gay, I decided it didn't matter to me if that's how people saw me. So that's why I chose to not work on that. So what i'm saying it, the choices that you make are yours. Do what feels right to you, that's the whole point of all of this right? So just do you!

I am also into the theater (watching), and love ballet and want to take it up as a hobby someday. My speech pattern isn't that womanly I don't think.

What I've gotta get used to is getting fist bumps and other bro-like greetings from cis het guys.  I'm so used to being around dykes and gay guys that it is very weird to suddenly be included as one of the (hetero) guys.  Instead of feeling like I've been raised in a barn, I feel like I've been raised by civilized people and now I have to go adjust to barnyard customs.  That's me now, just a regular straight guy.  How boring. :-) 

Quote from: unclesean on March 25, 2016, 02:33:10 AM
What I've gotta get used to is getting fist bumps and other bro-like greetings from cis het guys.  I'm so used to being around dykes and gay guys that it is very weird to suddenly be included as one of the (hetero) guys.  Instead of feeling like I've been raised in a barn, I feel like I've been raised by civilized people and now I have to go adjust to barnyard customs.  That's me now, just a regular straight guy.  How boring. :-)

I'm very impulsive and uninhibited and I think women view me as animalistic and rude, because they often correct my behaviors. I have tourettes to top it off and face discrimination from people who don't understand that it's not a choice, but a medical condition. I'm not saying that the first part has anything to do with tourettes though. I have a feeling even if I end up a good looking guy that has body builded I may be an object of ridicule for my disability.

I live in Texas, and down here most people smile and say 'hi' to one another--including male strangers to other male strangers--but when I was in New York City everyone looked at me like I was a serial killer for even smiling at people I didn't know.  It really is a cultural thing, IMO.

As for walking, there IS an in between.  Yes, some people have a hyper feminine "runway walk" where their feet practically cross over one another and some people walk like John Wayne entering a saloon full of bank robbers.  But most people, in general, are somewhere in between.  I feel that as long as you're not swinging your hips all day long and popping a hip to the side when you stand, people probably aren't going to peg your walk as particularly feminine, even if you don't "spread 'em" and walk on two wide apart lines. 

The same for talking.  You can be friendly and smile without coming off as either feminine or gay.  Sure, maybe you can't be as "omg, that is, like, so awesome!" as you could if you were trying to come off as feminine, but you don't have to be "yo, sup, homie?" with no variation in tone either.  In fact, normal men DON'T talk like that.  Normal men are somewhere in between Twilight Sparkle declaring that friendship is magic and the Terminator announcing that he'll be back.

Honestly, I wouldn't worry too much about it.  Remember in high school when you were SURE that everyone else was watching your every move and it made you really self conscious when, in reality, most people were too busy worrying about themselves to think about you?  That's kind of the world in general, IMHO.

Quote from: FtMitch on March 29, 2016, 01:35:31 PM
I live in Texas, and down here most people smile and say 'hi' to one another--including male strangers to other male strangers--but when I was in New York City everyone looked at me like I was a serial killer for even smiling at people I didn't know.  It really is a cultural thing, IMO.

This sort of culture difference works even in such a tiny country as Finland. Where I live, people don't even like to look at each other in the eyes in the street, let alone smile or - god forbid - greet. It's a running joke that one's assumed to be drunk or not from here if they do that. But go 200km in the south and it's different. People are far more friendlier even if it's a big city. It was so confusing...
Overly friendly behavior with smiles and his is usually associates with small communities here, where everyone knows everyone.

I've been told even pre-T that I have a male walking style. I never consciously taught myself to walk like that, it's just something that happened naturally. Like my fiancée says, my hips apparently move barely at all when I walk so I suppose that's the key? Lol I don't know.
I think it also contributes to whether you look appear male or female is how you hold your arms to your side. If the elbows point towards your sides, it appears more feminine compared to if you point your elbows away from your sides. Difficult explain stuff like this when it's just past 6am. x_o

Can't say much about speaking, though. Due to my native language I speak kinda monotonously by default and it carries over to English as well. But when speaking Finnish I think I have the advantage of having quite strong dialect. Not even gonna try to explain it, though. This language is a mess even for a native speaker.

Quote from: Tossu-sama on March 29, 2016, 10:21:55 PM
This sort of culture difference works even in such a tiny country as Finland. Where I live, people don't even like to look at each other in the eyes in the street, let alone smile or - god forbid - greet. It's a running joke that one's assumed to be drunk or not from here if they do that. But go 200km in the south and it's different. People are far more friendlier even if it's a big city. It was so confusing...
Overly friendly behavior with smiles and his is usually associates with small communities here, where everyone knows everyone.

I've been told even pre-T that I have a male walking style. I never consciously taught myself to walk like that, it's just something that happened naturally. Like my fiancée says, my hips apparently move barely at all when I walk so I suppose that's the key? Lol I don't know.
I think it also contributes to whether you look appear male or female is how you hold your arms to your side. If the elbows point towards your sides, it appears more feminine compared to if you point your elbows away from your sides. Difficult explain stuff like this when it's just past 6am. x_o

Can't say much about speaking, though. Due to my native language I speak kinda monotonously by default and it carries over to English as well. But when speaking Finnish I think I have the advantage of having quite strong dialect. Not even gonna try to explain it, though. This language is a mess even for a native speaker.

I've kept my arms crossed in front of me all my life.