Quote from: redhot1 on March 28, 2016, 08:38:59 PM
I just want to be a liberal from now on, but I don't feel 100% compatible with it.

My only suggestion is to read up on liberalism.  A lot of people use the term incorrectly.

Have a nice day,
Paige

I have mixed views. It's perfectly fine, you don't have to put a label on yourself. I stopped doing it because I realized no political label really fits me. I have mixed views, I can go from conservative, right-wing ideas when it comes to issues like illegal immigration, borders, national culture and security, etc. to left-wing socialism when it comes to economics and social issues. So I'm just mixed. I changed my ideas a bit, as I used to reject socialism completely in the past.

Keep in mind concepts and terms like conservatism, right-wing, left-wing differ depending on where you come from. As a European citizen, the modern US Republican party is a very strange type of conservatism, also very extremist, and maybe only the craziest extremists here have similar views.

You shouldn't force yourself to be liberal, or any other political label. You can be conservative and support LGBT rights (like some conservatives in Europe), but if you're American, being Republican and LGBT is kinda like saying being black and a member of KKK   

QuoteCindi's post is my story too.  The Republican Party of today is not the party of the 60s and 70s before I could vote nor is it the party of the 80s when I did begin to vote.  Today it has morphed into a thinly veiled party of religious fundamentalism.  So, if you are a religious fundamentalist then the Republican Party is for you!

I'm extremely interested in American politics and spend a lot of time reading or listening about it, and I absolutely agree with this. The GOP became the Christian ISIS. I don't like democrats either, but I kinda see them as the lesser of two evils. I do support Sanders though, because our ideas about economics are very very similar.

The Tea Party is particularly scary. I've heard it's now a large portion of the GOP? Just saying....I can't believe these people have followers.

When I see anti-masturbation campaigns, conversion therapy for lgbt people, and all that "pray the gay away" crap, and hugging random men to "cure homosexuality", or beating pillows screaming "mom why did you do this to me?" to beat the gayness away, I totally lose faith in humanity and I don't know whether to laugh hysterically or cry and slap my face cause I just can't believe what I see.

Quote from: Paige on April 19, 2016, 08:52:28 AM
My only suggestion is to read up on liberalism.  A lot of people use the term incorrectly.

Have a nice day,
Paige

That too. It's especially Americans who do this, with the liberal vs conservative thing.

Jossam, maybe it's just me being an American citizen, but I find it fascinating now that one can be conservative about immigration and national issues, but liberal or socialist on economic and social issues.

I for one can't find a consistent political views. I might read more.

Do you want to be liberal or openminded very openminded
like you mind your own business in ppl issues, and this is the thing to be openmindness
minding our own business.

I am a mixed bag of both the right and left to be completley honest. Although generally i learn much more to the left on most issues i do have a few conservative tendencies. The issue is how far does one go. In Canada I could support either the Liberal Party , which I did in the 2015 Federal election or the Conservative Party ,which I probably will do in the next Ontario Provincial election as the provinical Liberals have been in power since 2003 and are getting very arrogant and too comfortable in power. We have a very strong 3rd party up here called the New Democratic Party which has done our country a great service too.

If i were an American I would vote Democrat in every Senate and House election for the time being  and for the near future more the likey, the Presidency itself. On the other hand if I were living in say Vermont or Massachusetts I could very well support a state wide Republican as they are much more moderate and more of a live and let live variety. Govenors Baker and Phil Scott seem reasonable

Think for yourself!!

Isn't there, like, a pill or something?   

I identify politically as a socially liberal, Adam Smith libertarian, fiscally conservative, constitutionalist.  None of these terms mean what most USAians think they mean.  I've actually been thrown out of one political organization that claimed these words while actually insisting on being strict authoritarian internally!  I couldn't handle the mental gymnastics to believe in both sets simultaneously.

I don't really think it is possible to significantly change a persons bias toward or against being liberal.  The bias appears to be linked to a primitive balance between curiosity and fear.  A personality that is biased towards fear rather than curiosity tends to be less liberal, more risk averse and reticent to accept change.  A bias towards curiosity leads to being more open to change and exploration.

Quote from: Paige on April 19, 2016, 08:52:28 AM
My only suggestion is to read up on liberalism.  A lot of people use the term incorrectly.

Have a nice day,
Paige

Yep, that's quite possibly one of my biggest pet peeves. It kind of drives me up the wall when people (especially Americans, which I think comes from the fact that they have a two-party system without much actual socialist representation) equate being liberal/liberalism with socialism. Liberalism and socialism are two very different things and are very much at odds with each other, especially from an economic perspective (which also tends to drive social policy as well).

Although to chime in, I find it a bit strange that people here are discussing immigration as something separate from social issues. Immigration is very much a social issue and human rights issue. I think that its being separated in the minds of many is perhaps a sign of the times we're living in where immigrants (including migrants, refugees, and those without status), especially from the global south, are routinely dehumanised.

I also find it a bit hilarious when Americans rail on against undocumented workers and migrant workers. Yeah, go ahead and try deporting all undocumented workers, your entire agricultural system would collapse Maybe try thinking about who's growing, spraying (and suffering the health consequences), harvesting, and packaging all your food for ridiculously low wages (we're talking just over $2.00 per hour low) while still paying taxes on (nearly $12 billion per year in tax money comes from undocumented workers). Let's see how US agriculture would do without a massive workforce of underpaid, tax-paying people working in an environment where workplace safety doesn't exist and they can't do a thing against human rights violations. Not to mention that over 500,000 of those workers are children as young as 11-12 years old who make even less money for the same work and same risk.

Honestly, this government-created anti-immigration craze continues to be one of the biggest swindles ever. Encourage people to hate or be suspicious of "illegal aliens" (because heaven forbid they be called people) while an entire economy thrives off undocumented labour 


And since we're stating our political leanings, I am indeed a socialist

Live in a densely populated city. Most densely populated cities are majority liberal, and most liberals live in these cities.

There's a theory going around that living in a large community and interacting with people from all sorts of backgrounds makes people more open minded and extroverted, which is associated with liberalism.

Of course the correlation could be the reverse and that people who are naturally more extroverted and open minded are drawn to the city. Probably a mix of both.

I would suggest you develop your own views on each issue, one at a time, rather than embracing one particular political belief. It's perfectly ok to have mixed views about things.

But I would also state that you might want to set boundaries for yourself. For me, I try to ensure that my beliefs do not initiate harm against others. Defending yourself is different, but try not to directly harm others is one of my tests for my personal belief system.

Now having said that, I find myself lining up with liberals on most issues, because I do not hold strictly to ideology the way many want to do, and because I use history to guide me on ideological questions.

So, for instance, the "social liberal/fiscal conservative" position doesn't wash with me because history in the United States shows no instances where civil rights progress was made without government intervention. That's a fact. If I minimize government as much as possible, I am therefore harming others by allowing their civil rights to be abridged, thus I am for an expansive Department of Justice that is very activist at all levels of society. I also oppose relegating civil rights enforcement to states because states have a 200+ year history of using those opportunities to discriminate and segregate. So the evidence simply does not fit my view that allowing states to be the controlling factor in civil rights discussions is moral or ethical. There's no historical evidence for that.

There is also no historical evidence that states will adequately regulate the environment. Just ten years before I was born, the state of Ohio allowed the Cuyahoga river to catch fire. In the 1970's when I was in high school, smog lay thick over the Ohio Valley and you could tell when you approached the valley just because of the smell. That's all within living memory. So I support a strong and activist EPA, because the states have shown little regard for the environment or keeping it clean.

On the other hand, states have shown good management of infrastructure, even federal infrastructure, when provide the funds to do so in block grants.

These are all positions that I take not because I am conservative or liberal but because I've bothered to learn what worked and didn't work in real life in the last 150 years or so.

That's how I form my political positions. Mostly that takes me to the liberal side of the aisle but not completely. You might discover that researching and forming well rounded opinions about each issue, one at a time, is a good method for you. Or maybe you'll decide you want to do it another way. It's all good! I'm just sharing how I arrived at my own positions.