I'm dating and in love with a gay man. I decided summer of last year to just stop talking about being trans with people who don't already know. The sense of relief not having to relive the stupid Fing questions over and over and over was almost immediate. If someone asked, I was honest and then just refused to talk about it. I just want to be a regular guy working a blue collar job and not stand out.
Then I met this guy and I'm finding out that people he's introduced me to are asking him if I'm trans. I've told him I don't care if he tells close friends and family because it's serious between us and they'll find out anyway.
What's bothering me is that these people are ASKING about me. Because I don't pass. The fragile ego I've built for myself that I believe I look like a man is not strong enough to be crushed every time someone guesses. It's invalidating and humiliating for me.

I've been on this journey for over 3 years and I still feel defeated because the uphill battle to be loosely stealth unless they are important to me (or my partner) is still no where to being won.

I'm beginning to wonder if I should embrace being androgynous. At least I don't get pegged as totally female anymore. Thoughts on my wondering? Opinions that might snap me out of this 3 year funk? Wanna tell me I'm being a fool? I just need some support from my brothers.

is it the LGBT community that asks when he introduces you? because the LGBT community tends to "know" one of their own. if it is someone else who is completely random, then i don't even know unless they actively participate in the LGBT community as an ally but even then, i dont know why cisgender people think we have some "tell" when we don't. even the LGBT community thing bugs me because i don't feel as if transgender people have "tells" where people think they can just spot us differently from a cisgender person unless we are in the early stages of transitioning, etc. even then it is hard to tell sometimes. i wouldn't let it get to you if that is the case though with it being LGBT people asking.

if it is REALLY bugging you, ask the person straight up what made them think that.

The two guys who asked him are very close friends of his that he grew up with, but they are straight and they are not actively involved in the community and are mostly allies at will. They are supportivery but don't go out of their way about it.
I honestly don't want to know. The answer isn't something I want to hear at all.

Quote from: randomroads on May 29, 2016, 08:10:10 PM
The two guys who asked him are very close friends of his that he grew up with, but they are straight and they are not actively involved in the community and are mostly allies at will. They are supportivery but don't go out of their way about it.
I honestly don't want to know. The answer isn't something I want to hear at all.

well they know some how, so it makes sense if it is his friends but it still red flags me. i'd ask because then i might be able to change what ever it is that people find makes them think i'm trans. it isn't a bad thing but when you're stealth, i get why it is annoying.

I completely get your frustration. I don't know you well enough to even know the details of your transition, and so many factors come into play.

Some guys do take longer. As far as I can tell, very few of us who are on T for a long time ever get stuck in a no man's land (urgh, unintentionally funny--or not) of androgyny. Three years is a while if you have been on a strong dose for the whole period. But only time will tell.

Also, are these the only people questioning your status? Is it possible that your young man is inadvertently dropping hints or signals to his closest friends?

Frankly, I would want to know as much as possible about my "tells." Knowledge is power--or can be--even if the knowledge is unpleasant.

P.S. Some people find that not caring how they come across to others makes a difference. Maybe "embracing androgyny" really IS the ticket.

Don't have any answers but do want to chime in some support. Being read or misgendered sucks. I think everyone is under such scrutiny now. I had a cisgender coworker who was bullied at work because they thought she looked transgender to them. People suck.

Don't you really hate how people have to be so nosey and gossipy about other people? It really makes my blood boil, it's absolutely none of their freaking business. Sadly it is a fairly inescapable component of human society and being trans makes us a major curiosity. I couldn't begin to say how or why they are reading you, could be they know enough about trans to know "the signs", or at least they think they do. Plus passing in close social settings is going to be a hard egg to crack because people have more opportunity at scrutiny. So it's not that you're not passable, most likely you are, it's just that the situation and the people involved would very probably make it more difficult for most fans people.

Don't have much advice. I agree it could possibly be that some people are allies or know people who are trans/gay; so aware what 'signs' to look out for. I think it has become increasingly hard for trans people to live stealth now because trans issues are now in the spotlight. People are a lot more aware on how to spot a person who could possibly be trans; just like trans people have always done.

I'd say embrace your androgynous side. If someone asks say you are in a confident way. If you act hesitant they may probe you with more questions. You have two more years of male puberty ahead. There's always a chance you could look more masculine.

Do you have a certain answer that you'd prefer he gave if someone asks him when you're not there? I think generally 'that's none of your business' is good but it will also be read as an affirmative answer. So maybe, 'Yes, but it's not actually polite to ask'...

When in doubt, ask. There's gotta be something that's giving you away. It may not even be the way that you look necessarily, but mannerisms. It's sad that people feel the need to focus on things that we clearly don't want to discuss, but having that one conversation may help you avoid hearing the same things in the future.

Quote from: FTMax on May 30, 2016, 05:36:26 PM
When in doubt, ask. There's gotta be something that's giving you away. It may not even be the way that you look necessarily, but mannerisms. It's sad that people feel the need to focus on things that we clearly don't want to discuss, but having that one conversation may help you avoid hearing the same things in the future.

^ Agreed.
There are really only two things you can do or accept at this point:

1. Endure the annoyance of asking. Ask several people and try to ask individuals that you know won't just say things to make you feel better like "Oh no, it's 100% male to me no questions!" even though they may be thinking something else. This is a circumstance where brutal honesty is going to help you out in the long run.

2. Accept yourself as you are with the understanding that you may never pass 100% of the time with 100% of people. I know the thought of this blows but if the things people are bringing up are things you're either unwilling or unable to change this will ultimately bring you the most peace. If it makes you feel any better, there are plenty of cispeople that fall into a slightly grey area, as well. I have a friend that's constantly being misgendered as a man (she's a straight tall woman with short hair) and she used to completely unravel when it would happen. A few people suggested to her that she should grow out her hair, start wearing a lot of makeup and really femme up her otherwise casual attire. She decided that doing these things would cause her to sacrifice parts of herself she enjoyed too much to let go. She now has quite the myriad of snarky responses when it happens and has learned to just shrug it off.

Quote from: randomroads on May 29, 2016, 08:10:10 PM
The two guys who asked him are very close friends of his that he grew up with, but they are straight and they are not actively involved in the community and are mostly allies at will. They are supportivery but don't go out of their way about it.
I honestly don't want to know. The answer isn't something I want to hear at all.

I hate to say this, but if they've been friends for that long then he might have mentioned something about your sex life that gave it away.  I dunno about your man, but personally I talk about my sex life all the time.  He may have accidentally mentioned something along those lines that tipped them off.  Or mentioned something else related to transition that made it click for them.  So it may not be your looks at all.  If I were you, I would want to know the answer simply because making assumptions leave you with an incorrect idea of what happened.  It could have been a million things, and here it is getting to you because you're certain deep down inside that it's the way you look that tipped them off.  I currently don't totally pass--not 100% of the time--but, in general, people don't assume I'm trans--they are just unsure whether I am male or female and avoid calling me pronouns.  So the fact that these guys assumed you were actually trans makes me think something OTHER than your looks tipped them off.  I have found that "trans" is not usually the first thing that enters cis people's minds, especially when it comes to FTMs.