Apparently the broadcast was split into two parts, and the second part is here:

http://www.wtsp.com/mb/news/health/can-a-drug-make-you-transgender/215234337

There's also the live Q&A sessions on Dion Lim's facebook page (although I wasn't terribly impressed with the second one, as the guy she was interviewing was pooh poohing the idea without coming up with any valid reasons for doing so).

It looks like they got the go ahead for a second story about DES and transgender, which is due to be broadcast in 1 day's time. Here's the trailer for it:

Maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way but here it is...

I'm all for figuring out why I'm the way I am.  It has caused me quite a bit of stress and anxiety throughout my life and I'm sure more is in my future.  However, my goal is to find a way to fit in as a "new normal".  I need to know/believe that I was born this way...it was the way nature intended, for whatever reason. 

This DES situation makes Transgender identity look more like a "Frankensteinian" thing....pointing to the fact that we weren't born this way, we were created!  Almost treating a trans person as though they have a deformity.

I think that is the wrong message to the world. 

I'm not going to dispute whether DES may have caused an increase in trans births...I just don't know.  But hopefully, the average person can see through this and see that being trans is not only because of this.

The anti-trans groups are just waiting for more ammunition for their hate campaigns.  I think this just gives them another way of showing that what we do and what we are, is not natural.

Ok, I'm stepping off my soapbox...LOL


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Apparently, because of the Florida shooting, the broadcast of the sequel now won't take place until some time later this week.

Quote from: Amber42 on June 12, 2016, 08:26:18 AM
This DES situation makes Transgender identity look more like a "Frankensteinian" thing....pointing to the fact that we weren't born this way, we were created!  Almost treating a trans person as though they have a deformity.

I think that is the wrong message to the world. 

Well, I think that if a drug is responsible for a significant number of cases of transsexuality, then the world should know about it, and it's counterproductive to keep it a secret. At least it provides a rational explanation for some of the more skeptical members of the public as to how transsexuality can arise, and that trans people actually are who we perceive ourselves to be - people whose bodies have developed along the lines of our genetic sex, but whose brain has developed as the opposite sex (or partly male and partly female in my case).

Something had too happen to make me born a freak of nature. I'm all female except one thing,I developed like a girl except for periods instead I had alot of pent up rage that scared me. To the outside world I'm a male due to a disguise I got good at making,its hard being neither male or female.

Quote from: HughE on June 12, 2016, 07:43:49 PM
Well, I think that if a drug is responsible for a significant number of cases of transsexuality, then the world should know about it, and it's counterproductive to keep it a secret. At least it provides a rational explanation for some of the more skeptical members of the public as to how transsexuality can arise, and that trans people actually are who we perceive ourselves to be - people whose bodies have developed along the lines of our genetic sex, but whose brain has developed as the opposite sex (or partly male and partly female in my case).

One one thing I find it useful for is explaining a possible cause of my state, in particular dealing with those who believe that it is a 'lifestyle choice' or a 'mental illness'.  By showing a possible organic cause, I can argue that this is a medical issue, and I can point to treatments like HRT as the only medical care available to address the issue.  As I've mentioned before, accepting my transgender nature and receiving treatment is a lifestyle choice only if one also considers self-medicating into a stupor, or suicide to be alternative lifestyle choices.  Hint: They aren't.

I've taken to carrying around some images on my 'phone; scans and slice images of brain tissue like this:

  Finally! Some local news organization actually picked-up on the possible effects of this drug. Transsexualism may be only one of the ticking time bomb effects of DES. My prostate problems and an autoimmune disorder (a new found possibility?) I am currently fighting may be traced to my mom may have taken this drug. A loss of a daughter to adoption and her history of anemia makes my mom a good candidate. She wouldn't talk about the subject in the 1980's when it came out that the sons and daughters of DES were having fertility problems and having more reproductive cancers. She did on the gay, abortion and other hot topic issues at the time.
  That geneticist from Johns Hopkins mentioned in the article did not mention that certain disorders that are DNA related can be in people not missing or having certain markers that prevent them from getting those disorders get it anyway by some proven environmental cause. She is carrying that same flag that her previous researcher stymied me from getting any treatment in the late 1970's
  Hot topic here: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,84224.200.html
Last page, but a lot of info in this thread.

Joelene

I think this DES thing needs to be talked about and brought into the open. Some good research could clarify why and when some DES babies became trans. We know that incidence of transgender varies between societies, even though it's always there, which could indicate a mixture of genetic and environmental triggers.

Knowledge can be a double edged sword but I think the balance here is on knowing the truth rather than ignorance.

I wonder if the incidence of trans really does vary between societies.  Maybe what is varying is the degree of repression between societies while the rate of trans stays constant.


Sapere Aude

Quote from: Deborah on June 13, 2016, 09:14:37 AM
I wonder if the incidence of trans really does vary between societies.  Maybe what is varying is the degree of repression between societies while the rate of trans stays constant.


Sapere Aude

I almost hope your suggestion is wrong! It will just encourage our detractors to say, "see, if we hold fast THOSE people will be "better"".

Based upon history, it's almost certainly true that repression reduces the visibility of minorities and that's all they really want, for us to jump back in the closet so that they can nail the door shut.

I can't believe people think we are some pharmaceutical science screw up ... Sorry that is a insult to the 9th degree. And before pharmaceuticals how can one explain trans ? #rollEyes


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Quote from: TinaVane on June 13, 2016, 05:01:49 PM
I can't believe people think we are some pharmaceutical science screw up ... Sorry that is a insult to the 9th degree.

Like it or not, there's plenty of research in animals showing that being prenatally exposed to certain hormones can cause opposite sexed development to take place. In particular, estrogens have been shown to cause female development in biological males, whereas hormones with androgenic properties (testosterone, DHT and synthetic hormones derived from testosterone) have been shown to cause male development in female fetuses. The only controversial thing about it is that doctors and the pharmaceutical industry weren't paying attention to what was being shown in the scientific research, and as a result, hormones with potentially gender bending properties have ended up being prescribed to millions of pregnant women over the years, for preventing miscarriages and premature births, and for various other medical reasons. DES is just one of them (although probably the worst example, since the doses involved were so high).

Trans people (and intersex people) have existed throughout history, so obviously DES etc aren't the only thing causing people to be born trans. However, hormones and other drugs with potentially gender bending properties have seen such a lot of use in women's medicine that I think they must be an important cause.

Roll eyes ...


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Having been delayed for several weeks as a result of the Florida shootings, the sequel was finally broadcast last night.

http://www.wtsp.com/news/health/women-say-des-made-them-transgender/264909475

I'm wondering whether, now that one TV station has "broken the ice", there's any way of getting other media outlets to pick up on the story. There's good theoretical reasons for thinking that other synthetic hormones besides DES (in particular, the progestin class of hormones) might also be able to cause female brain development in biologically male fetuses, so it's not just a historical thing, it's something that could also apply to drugs still in use.

This is something that I have wondered about, but I'll likely never know. I was born in 1969 at a Catholic charities hospital and adopted instantly. No previous birth certificate. So I think it's possible but unknown.
Oh well, I am who I am. Cause or no cause   

A part of me thinks that this theory could be real and a part of me feels so insulted by it. Like I am an accident after all? I want to ask my mom if she took this DES crap because she had a miscarriage right before I was born since she never really took good care of herself, so I am told by my father everyday. Not sure if it means anything though. But it makes me wonder. Still, I can see how this might affect mtfs, but how do you explain ftms? Maybe I missed something.

Quote from: King Phoenix on July 06, 2016, 03:30:53 PM
A part of me thinks that this theory could be real and a part of me feels so insulted by it. Like I am an accident after all?

I have never heard of DES being associated with FTM transgender offspring.  For MTF, the link is well-established, but not the other way.  It is an estrogen, so it makes sense that it would work in the MTF direction.

For me, I am almost certainly the result of DES.  It gives me a certain peace of mind knowing that I am not imagining this.  I don't find it insulting or demeaning in any way.  It's just my history.

I know people here are going to dislike what I am about to ask but, if a drug can cause it, do you think there is one that can reverse it? I hate being transgender. I don't want this. I want to be cisgender.

Quote from: King Phoenix on July 06, 2016, 08:18:59 PM
I know people here are going to dislike what I am about to ask but, if a drug can cause it, do you think there is one that can reverse it? I hate being transgender. I don't want this. I want to be cisgender.

Some portions of the brain are fluid and change as we grow, other areas like sexual preference and gender identity are set before we are born and can't be altered. Possibly an estrogen blocker would reduce the discomfort you feel but the ability to alter your brain ends long before you are born.

Quote from: Dena on July 06, 2016, 08:35:43 PM
Some portions of the brain are fluid and change as we grow, other areas like sexual preference and gender identity are set before we are born and can't be altered. Possibly an estrogen blocker would reduce the discomfort you feel but the ability to alter your brain ends long before you are born.

Well, dare I ask but, what if I took more estrogen? Will that make me a woman? I don't want to be a man but I really do because it feels normal to me but I don't because I just wanna be what I was supposed to be. I feel like a freak. I hate this. Being trans only brings pain to the sufferer and those around them.