Quote from: LucyNewport on August 10, 2016, 09:08:11 AM


Ultimately, she is not/cannot be attracted to a woman. I am not/cannot be a man. Something will eventually give.

I think this is a problem that for many couples and it is just too hard to get past. One of the things I think that has helped us is that I just don't care that much about sex. I gave up asking for sex well over 10 years ago, I never liked it much anyway so stopping was more of a relief than anything. So without the sex and the pressure to perform(for either of us) I think we just relaxed about it because it wasn't a big deal for either of us.

For many couples the wife or Husband just can't get past it. But imagine for a minute or two how you would feel if roles were reversed and it was your spouse /partner transitioning would you handle it any better?  For me I am not sure I would handle it as well as my wife has.

Liz

This has been a great discussion.   My wife and I have been working to stay together. A year and a half ago, I was halfway out the door.  A year ago, I was convinced we weren't going to last, but my wife was NOT letting us get divorced.  6 months, I was more willing to work on us. Now, things are better than ever.  Well, up until few days ago.  We're starting to fall into the same fights we used to.  She's back to reminding me of the things I did wrong in the past (anywhere from 6 months to 6 years!).  One day, she's encouraging me to "come all the way out" and or hide anything and the next she says everything is moving too fast.  It's frustrating and I'm trying to see it from her side, but when she accuses me of not caring about her feelings, it's hard.  It's like, all I do is consider your feelings. Doesn't mean I'm always going to do exactly what you want every time. 

It's funny that we have so many issues, but the trans issues are not that big compared to our other problems.


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It's actually not her that stopped the intimacy, but me. I just don't have a sex drive anymore and trying to do anything anyway results in an argument, so I don't even bother anymore. I'm sure that's a big part of our problems, but I don't think it's the biggest one.

I'm also tired of the arguments that get more and more frequent over time. It's like on the one hand she couldn't be more supportive of my transition and on the other hand, she's so afraid of it, she tries to block it from proceeding any further.

Like Emily, I've gotten bit by the "don't bother" bug as well.

I'd ask my spouse if she wanted to do something with me (walk, grocery store, check out the bookstore, grab lunch, etc), and she'd say no.  After a large enough number of "No" responses, with no positive feedback, we just tend to assume "No" as the default or only response and stop asking.  She eventually notices and accuses me of not wanting to do anything with her.

*SIGH*

Oh, and I sigh too much.  (Last night's complaint...)

Some days I just can't win.  But it's the only game in town, so I keep on playing.               

My wife would have never described herself as a lesbian or even bisexual. About the most she ever said is that she found some women attractive and maybe if she were on a desert island, she could make it work. Well i seemed to have made her set sail for that island.

Two yrs past the transition decision and through all the physical changes we have remained close. We plan the future together, parent, pursue business interests etc. I would not have thought that is was going to happen for us for sure, but like many i knew it was either transition or death spiral. There were lots of hard moments.

In public we are showing more affection but it went largely away for a time, and i knew it would take time. I'm a super affectionate person. Sex has continued pretty much uninterrupted but we have had to learn new things and ways to make that happen and enjoyable for both, and the amount of it is probably half, mainly i think because i just don't have the same drive as before.

We have no vow of monogamy in this relationship either and she could find a boyfriend at any point if she wanted to but, she has been saying for years the effect of " Why would i do that? - the reward would not be worth the headaches "

Since i am an overall happier person, we joke and laugh more than we ever did. She has noticed this and she recognizes other positive changes. She defends me and talks me up to everyone that.

This really does sound like I'm bragging as i write this, but i really want to encourage people to hang in there and not give up on someone you love, because of change. What comes out the other side can be better.

Hi,

I started transition March of 2012. I went full tome, with name change June 2014.  I recognize a lot of what we went through it this thread.  However...

We now hold hands in public.  She calls me her wife.  She steals my clothes, jewelry and I steal hers.  It's all good... It just took a long time and it was HARD for both of us.

She needed to know, in no uncertain terms, that I  loved her.  THAT meant more than my gender.

Hugs

Jen

...from my reading of this thread, it would be easy to deduce, there doesn't seem to be any way to make this work long term, unless both people are on the same page and committed to the transition as much as they are committed to the relationship ...

Just an observation

Liz

Quote from: JLT1 on August 11, 2016, 07:49:02 PM

She needed to know, in no uncertain terms, that I  loved her.  THAT meant more than my gender.

Jen,

That is very sweet and also very wise!

Quote from: ElizabethK on August 11, 2016, 08:15:20 PM
...from my reading of this thread, it would be easy to deduce, there doesn't seem to be any way to make this work long term, unless both people are on the same page and committed to the transition as much as they are committed to the relationship ...

Just an observation

Liz

Good observation but i'm not sure I agree. What i see is a commitment to the relationship that overrides the transition, and then often, realization that the transition was the best for their spouse. That is a huge demonstration of selflessness too.

I might be just having a semantics exercise in my head.

I lean to what Robyn said. 
Continued love and understanding by both parties is the path to staying together.  Obviously this is easier for some than others depending on how open minded the other person is.  Also for us who are transitioning, we need to find the balance between moving forward but not moving too fast. 

Lots of love is needed.  Good luck girls.  I hope we all can pull it off.

Quote from: RobynD on August 12, 2016, 01:53:55 PM



I might be just having a semantics exercise in my head.

Liz

Fun thread. Not too sure what to make of it all beyond "The Human Condition"

My wife and I have been together, one way or another for nearly 40 years, officially married for almost 20, Living In Sin, for about 30. The first 10 was on/off, seeing others, non-exclusive, etc.. The 'Off' part came from me in search of being "Normal" with a woman far from that. An amazing person, full of love and life, a totally free spirit. In other words, my opposite. One I was attracted to before, during and after my 'Practice' marriage, as well as before, some during, and after, my almost marriage.

Like ANY couple, we have our.... moments. At the end of the day we both don't let things get carried away because it generally is over silly stuff, or things we both knew all to well what we were getting ourselves into many moons ago. While we try not to live in the past, we are human.

And I have heard a BIG earful 'Of the past', transgressions that is, after dropping the T-Bomb on her. Some days I still do. I cannot blame her. Decades ago I 'Settled' on being "Just a CD", which she knew of as well as my failed transition experiments. But having the T-Bomb dropped is not something she signed up for. Well, neither did I! I avoided dealing with my transness for decades.

But dealing with it has led to a lot of personal growth for me, and even some for a much more evolved her. Our love for each other is probably stronger then it ever has been. Today, she cannot think of me as her husband, not with boobs nicer then hers. I still occasionally hear "I did not marry a woman. I like how men make me feel....." As well as plenty of talk of some sort of a future together.

To get this free-spirited hippie chick who swore never again to get married there were conditions. One was a somewhat bitter yet simple one to agree to because we both put the others happiness on par or above our own. That provision was if the other other wanted out, no fighting, no arguing, we split as friends, if not even lovers. People grow, sometimes in different directions. Just the way life is.

The other condition hearkens back to our early years of non-exclusivity. In essence the open-marriage option. "Sex is sex"  This one was a also somewhat bitter for me, being a helpless romantic and having difficulty with having sex with someone who you are not in love with after being your BFF. TBH - My sex drive was FAR from that of a typical person, and I knew it.

Today there is a lot of talk dancing around this option. After dropping the T-Bomb an option for her. But today I see it was her way of projecting what was truly on her mind. That as I grow and learn what it is to be the real me, on and the years of HRT, I'd be the one wanting to experience being a woman sexually. At first, thanks to my betrayal, she had a lot of fear over me just "Walking Away" leaving her high and dry, without support or resources to fend for herself. Today she does not see that happening, only me continuing to grow as a woman. No doubt she has picked up on me often saying one guy or another is good looking, even very attractive. I haven't told her of the too arousing dreams I've had.

We have a good partnership. We compliment each other well relying on the strength of the other to shore up a weakness. We both learn from the other and grow as people. So far in generally the same direction. Yes, my life would be a lot different if we did split back when things were dicey. Just as it would be if we split today. Or tomorrow.

Will she want to live with a woman? Will I? Can we deal with it emotionally? Or, will the day come that I will go full-time, not that it matters at home?

Would our lives be better if we had split, or do? I guess we both answered with our feet by choosing to stay together, for now. Still, she asks for assurances I will see to her needs if we do. Living in separate states, or on the same street, or in the same home.

One day at a time

I think my marriage is in the same place. Super supportive SO, but she is not gay and doesn't want to be seen as such. We are holding on for now, but in the future...

I came out to myself, my wife, family, friends, and workplace six weeks ago. Three days ago our marriage disintegrated. I left, realizing my wife's verbal abuse was not going to stop.  She has been clear that she would not tolerate my body changing. Fortunately I have supportive friends and family.

Put yourself in her shoes and think what would you will be doing if its happen to you.its natural..she married you with a reason and every woman does the same.

I am divorced but not because of wanting to transition. I do think if we were still married and I approached her with this she would have divorced me due to that. Living together married is not the same as being married and having a relationship. I think it is the rare marriage that can survive a partner transitioning. But I do know that I am much happier being single than I ever was being married. I was married 15 years and we do not interfere in each others lives.

Heather

Quote from: sid104 on August 13, 2016, 10:52:41 AM
Put yourself in her shoes and think what would you will be doing if its happen to you.its natural..she married you with a reason and every woman does the same.

We discussed my transition before getting married, so she was well aware of what was coming.

Quote from: sid104 on August 13, 2016, 10:52:41 AM
Put yourself in her shoes and think what would you will be doing if its happen to you.its natural..she married you with a reason and every woman does the same.

I only partially agree. If gender and the physicality of all of that is one of the most important things to a person, then yep staying together is going to be really hard. If the sum of the friendship, family, shared experiences, spiritual beliefs and other factors over ride that, then it may not.

It would be wrong to call one set of values shallow and the other not, they are just different. We all marry for different reasons. It is hard to paint everyone with the same brush.

Quote from: RobynD on August 11, 2016, 06:48:22 PM

This really does sound like I'm bragging as i write this, but i really want to encourage people to hang in there and not give up on someone you love, because of change. What comes out the other side can be better.

No Robyn it was really helpful for me.  I was getting quite depressed with a lot of the other posts.  I doubt it but maybe my wife and I could make things work.

Thanks,
Paige

This has been good info for me. My wife and I initially decided to try to make it work. She asked for the divorce a couple of weeks ago. She just can't get around her old ideas. She still sees it as a choice and wrong and I'm going to hell. She had already become verbally abusive also. When I started shaving my legs and pits it was too much. She started timing how long my showers were and bitching about it. I was actually relieved when she asked for a divorce. I am not taking it as hard, but I don't think in hind site that I was ever really capable of loving her in the same way.