Your doctor is wrong, misinformed, and possibly making assumptions - don't forget that people who are familiar with someone often seen less in terms of changes because they see what they expect to see (like, my mother didn't think I looked any different when I was being read as female 100% by strangers). So if he thinks HRT won't work, he'll probably see "proof" that it doesn't.

There are no guarantees, of course, and not everyone sees the kind of changes they hoped for. But in any case, if properly prescribed and monitored HRT doesn't help, getting it illegally from shady sources *definitely* won't.

Your doctor probably just wants you to have realistic expectations

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Yeah like not everyone experiences dramatic shifts in the face but some of us do and usually most experience some changes at best regardless of age.

Quote from: Maybebaby56 on October 18, 2016, 06:16:54 PM
But yes, your doctor is clueless.

With kindness,

Terri

This made me laugh. And I second that.

I've been on HRT for 8 years and because I'm not socially transitioning I have to keep a light beard to hide the changes in my face. No idea if my face is actually feminine without the beard, but it's definitely not normal male anymore.

I will get ffs if I socially transition. I expect it will do some good.

Quote from: supergirl23 on October 18, 2016, 06:27:13 PM
So just to clarify, I will see facial changes? I have very weak bony structures so basically I have nothing to worry about?

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The thing is: Testosterone works in devious ways. On the one hand, it increases muscle mass everywhere in your body, and it reduces fat. On the other hand, it will cause some facial features (mostly your brow ridge) to keep growing as you get older, it's actually one of the few bones that grow most of your life.

This is also one of the reasons those of us who are older usually have more difficult time to pass. Bulky brow ridges are a very masculine feature, and since the brow ridge keeps growing as we age, the face looks ever more masculine. In such cases, FFS might be needed.

So that's the one side. On the other hand, there's the more malleable parts: your muscle mass and fat. HRT will make you loose your masculine muscle mass within 2-3 years after starting. Now concider the following: there are 21 individual muscles in your face! These will also diminish in size, which will have an impact on your facial contours.

Then there's the accumulation of fat. Estrogen causes your body to create a layer of subcutaneous fat (under the skin) everywhere across your body. This also happens in your face, causing more rounded cheeks and (hopefully) a slightly more rounded contour of your skin.

Of course there are genetic factors as well. Some people simply have very square jawlines, there's not much else we can do about this than FFS. As long as you don't have such a jawline, you should be fine.

...You think maybe they meant it won't change your bone structure like FFS will?  Because it can't do that.  Only change the muscle/fat distribution...

Quote from: supergirl23 on October 19, 2016, 11:15:09 AM
So the prescription will work?

No guarantees what it will do, but it will likely do something positive with your face.

QuoteMy doctor is just severely misinformed?

That's what it sounds like.

QuoteBecause if it won't work is there a way I can get a doctor's approval through the internet?

Well, it sounds like you already have your prescription.  So, just continue taking it, and go back to your doc when you need to renew it.  So what if he doesn't believe it will work on your face?  You will be able to show him differently when it does.

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It's the common YMMV - some  people improve where others remain static.

Browse the various 'Before and after' threads here at this site and you will see many diverse examples over a wide spectrum of ages and physical characteristics.  (I'm #1362 on thread 3.0.)

Dena makes a good point about when you were on whatever was your ERT.  My initial internist began me with birth control pills as a test then Diethylstilbestrol (1979).  Those seemed to have minimal effect on my appearance.  My later internist put me on the same dose but changed to Premarin and wow the facial changes hit (1983). 

No doubt today's 'cocktail' is far better than what Dena and I were originally prescribed.  Most transition specialists today should know better what to prescribe.

I moved to Utah (1980) where no doctor would accept me; that put me off meds for more than two years.  Opportunity struck and I resumed ERT in February 1983. By May 1983, my looks apparently changed so drastically during those few months on Premarin that my employer began action to fire me from my job with the federal government.  Of course they long suspected something was up, my change was one more piece of evidence that pushed them over the edge.

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