Hello, I am at home now, I had FFS at Wednesday. I contracted a high fever, so I won't stay long...

I had nearly everyting: chin, jaw, nose, type 3 forehead sinus removal, orbital recontouring, hairline lowering, brow raising, zygoma arch ostetomy, facelift, and liposuction from chin, all in one go...

SURGERY TIME: 9 HOURS!

My God... it's is worse than SRS... so much pain, vomiting blood the 1st day. I have never been so deep in Hell, because is what it felt like. I was staying in hospital, so I had good access to medication. Morphine, and paracetamol. Morphine made me nauseous so I went with paracetamol only.

I think it was too much... the worse thing is the nose, had anxiety with breathing for 2 days. Then, I got used to it.  it is so weird.... so much to talk about, but too much pain and fever to think clearly.

I am slowing healing, chin packing is gone. Remarkebly, ther was very little swelling. sorry for spell mistakes, it is so hard to type right now. Feels like I am hammering nails!

Big hug! Feel better soon, and thanks for updating us. 

Hugs, Devlyn

Thank you Devlyn Marie!

Did this all alone... so hard when I have no-one to care for me.... all hugs are very welcome

You do have a tough row to hoe. Which surgeon did you go to?

Local maxillofacial surgeon, specialist in trauma surgery and works in The Netherlands. His interest lies in facial surgery, and he met Noorman van der Dussen to discuss my case.  I was the first transwoman he did. I went on my gut feeling. It never let me down in my life. And I think he did a marvelous job. Swelling is much less than I often see. My eyes weren't black/bloody and no bruising around my eyes. Only bruising is around jaw. Little bit of green/black.

It really helps to write here, it takes my mind away from healing.

Another big thing was taking a hot shower. Absolutely amazing, it felt Like I was in heaven. Althoughh I had to avoid the face.... I may shower the face/hair sunday. They already washed my hair in the operatind room, when they were finished. Yet it still has scabs and blood.

Oh, that shower at home! that boosted my morale.

Quote from: 2cherry on November 11, 2016, 02:03:27 PM
It really helps to write here, it takes my mind away from healing.

Another big thing was taking a hot shower. Absolutely amazing, it felt Like I was in heaven. Althoughh I had to avoid the face.... I may shower the face/hair sunday. They already washed my hair in the operatind room, when they were finished. Yet it still has scabs and blood.

Oh, that shower at home! that boosted my morale.

I have had a very minor thing with hair implants only and I get the whole " in the shower" and what a relief it is . I can't imagine what the last few days have been like for you especially since you have been on your own.

That is one heck of a lot of work to have done in one go. I am having Rhinoplasty only in two months and that is going to be bad enough on its own without adding in all the stuff you had.

Sounds like you are feeling a bit better now? Have you got you nausea under control? Peppermint tea can help with that or ginger tea if you prefer. Hope you are keeping your fluids up...I can't imagine even completing a simple task would be very easy?  hope you have a reasonable day today

Hugs
Liz

Oh 2Cherry thank you for coming on here and sharing this. I'm sending you massive healing vibes and love. You're incredibly brave. I know it's not quite the same, but you're not totally alone in the sense that we're here. Rooting for you honey. Well done and speedy healing now xx

Thanks so much for the kind words... means a lot to me. Writing and reading these little posts means much when you're alone...

Just dozed off into sleep, and waking up randomly. Happens alot...

My bandages on my head are gone now. That was another big relief. My Forehead is so flat..!! it's incredible!    

I must focus on the good and sunny days that will come.

Major downside was the other patients next to me. I was in local hospital, so I landed on mediumcare, a step below IC. So all night random screaming, whaling, crying, snoring... the snoring was sooo annoying. At one moment 3 guys were snoring together! did not sleep that entire night. 

I try not to laugh, because it hurt and the casket tries to com of my nose when I do...

Wow, congrats to you! Major surgery indeed but it sounds like you're doing well... Sending you positive wishes for a fast painless recovery!

Quote from: ElizabethK on November 11, 2016, 02:33:56 PM
I have had a very minor thing with hair implants only and I get the whole " in the shower" and what a relief it is . I can't imagine what the last few days have been like for you especially since you have been on your own.

That is one heck of a lot of work to have done in one go. I am having Rhinoplasty only in two months and that is going to be bad enough on its own without adding in all the stuff you had.

Sounds like you are feeling a bit better now? Have you got you nausea under control? Peppermint tea can help with that or ginger tea if you prefer. Hope you are keeping your fluids up...I can't imagine even completing a simple task would be very easy?  hope you have a reasonable day today

Hugs
Liz

hi Liz,

Yes, today I am feeling much better! I think it's because the fever went away partially. No nausea anymore. Skin feels just very bruised, as if something is sucking my skin off. Weird kind of pain. I also made the switch to Ibuprofen, coming of from paracetamol. Much better...

Already ate soup, potato chips, cheese, lots of pudding and soydrinks... and heaps of ice cream!  potatochips are hard to eat, but I managed it. The salty flavor did good for my mouth actually. I made couple of smoothies with frozen fruits and soy protein powder. And even a cheese sandwich (severe beaten!)

For fluids, I bought soy drinks in bulk... so I now have lot of chilled (unsweetened) soymilk ready for grabs. It is great and tasty. Sometimes Tea, but since my smell isn't back yet, it doesn't taste as good... stacks and stacks of paper cups with chilled water, for cleaning mouth and sipping.

I think that's good on day 4....

Also had all day bowel movements... the food started it I guess... it made me come back alive, movement is very important indeed. Cleaned dishes, did small things in my house and sat on the sofa listening to the radio. Sometimes behind PC.

Today I could also wear my contact lenses again, which is a boost as well.

That's great to hear 2Cherry and those sound like excellent food tips. I've taken note for my FFS in under three weeks  Wow you had a lot done but I know at least one other person who went for the whole full works in one go and she was glad she did once she got through the first week or two. I'm continuing to read this thread and rooting for you with continued good healing. xx

I think you are the first person who brought "zygoma arch osteotomy" to this group.  It sounds very interesting.  If I wasn't done having bone surgery this would be on my list of potential procedures.  Then again, maybe it was available from my surgeon, but I never asked.

Regardless, may your recovery go well and be unevenful.

Hi 2cherry

I know this is a bit eewwww but having "movement" is very critical...as the old saying goes if you don't "evacuate" it will kill you. Apart from all that it will make you incredible uncomfortable and from what you have already said you have discomfort in spades already.

You sound to me like you are doing remarkably well. I can have my Rhinoplasty any time I want but it is unlikely to be before the beginning of next year. So have you managed to get a look at the work that has been done? I would imagine it would be too early to actually see any difference  yet?

Hugs

Liz

Quote from: deeiche on November 12, 2016, 11:33:39 AM
I think you are the first person who brought "zygoma arch osteotomy" to this group.  It sounds very interesting.  If I wasn't done having bone surgery this would be on my list of potential procedures.  Then again, maybe it was available from my surgeon, but I never asked.

Regardless, may your recovery go well and be unevenful.

It is actually called: "zygomatic sandwich osteotomy". Sorry, my head wasn't clear enough... 

This technique is well known in maxillofacial surgery, often used for trauma patients, or birth defects/deformities. FFS is simply maxillofacial facial surgery applied to feminization instead of reconstructing faces from trauma and defects, which is the usual scope and domain of maxillofacial facial surgery. So any surgeon trained with maxillofacial facial surgery, can basically do an entire FFS. They can also reconstruct faces from victims of motor vehicle accidents, cancers on the face, face transplants, and much more. They simply do everything that involves the face.

My surgeon recommended a zygomatic sandwich osteotomy. Because he said it's better to use my own bone than implants. I kinda agreed... He used the piece he sawn off my jaw, modeled it, and placed it in the zygoma, to make the cheeks more laterally bulky. He told me he did 3-5mm, very minor, so that it looks natural and not out of place. It is also easier than implants, because implants can be difficult to position symmetrically.

He made two tiny cuts in my upper corner of mouth, and cut the zygoma and place some bone in it to lift it. "it's pretty easy" he told me. LOL. I guess so! remarkably, I had no swelling on my eyes.

He never done a feminisation "project", but was raging with enthusiasm when I approached him at my local hospital. I like that, surgeons who want to do something  extraordinary, escape their routine. I guess, pulling wisdom teeth all day long gets boring! We continued to e-mail one other for 4 months, creating a plan. And I decided that he was the one for me. I guess I sparked his interest in FFS, I hope so, we could use more surgeons. Maybe that way the prices will go down as well. Who knows, would be a pleasant side effect. But then again, he's very down to earth, and may never do another one. He just works at a local hospital. But who knows... He did enjoy doing it though, and that is satisfactory for me as well. His curiosity is something we both share. I like that in people.

He also proposed a tracheal shave for another time. I told him I did not want a scar. But his approach was different as well: he told me he could shave the tracheal apple through a minor cut in the mouth.. what???. He said: look, if you turn your head forward and to the side, a minor cut in the gumline can access the trachea very easy. And so I was stumped....  This guy is either a genius or simply made that up on that spot, or probably both, because it sounds incredible.

But I digress... *blame it on the morphine, antibiotics and post ffs escapism* 

Some other minor interesting observation:

I had my shower again, and was allowed to have water on the back of my head. The front I may wash tomorrow. But clumsy as I can be, some water spilled over the forehead running down my brows, and... straight into my eyes! Previously, the brow ridge directed any water to the brows, and it ran off nice to the sides, or simply ramped over my eyes. Now water simply dumps into my eyes.  Am I seeing some evolutionary trait going on here? ....like sweaty Neanderthals with bulky brow ridges?   

Day 5.

Just realized it is only day 5. It seems so much longer. Time passes very slowly when I am healing. The days in the hospital felt like weeks! especially day one, when I woke up on medium care. I guess that was the worst day of my life. I truly asked myself: what have I done? why did I choose to do this? Please Note: I've been busy with and thinking about FFS since 2008, so it's not a rash decision. I've had all other procedures. For me, FFS was the icing on the cake.

On day 3 I was very refreshed, felt great actually most of the day. Day four was also good. Day 5:

I managed to sleep for couple of hours, most I could since post-op. All the days before I would wake up every 15 minutes. Right now I can sleep 2-3 hours. I feel better when I am awake then when I sleep. because when I wake up, it feels like my face is burning slowly... as if someone poured gasoline on it, and slowly lit it. Best way to describe it I think. It goes away with massage, painkillers, and unexpectedly: movement. the more I move, the less pain I seem to feel. That numbing feeling is annoying, because it's between pain and soreness, difficult to describe.

Also had a couple more nightmares. The anesthesia is still in my system.  I've had 12 hours of it, so it seems only normal that my body doesn't enjoy it.

The flu has subsided, and is under control. Sometime I still shake and shiver, and sometimes feeling incredibly warm. At one moment I woke up, and my face was glowing. But when I touched it, it was not hot. Lot of healing going on.

I notice some yellowing under my eyes and yellowing of my skin around the mouth. Also my neck is yellow... the lymph nodes are doing their job? the swelling slowly drops from my face, into the lymphs. I also massage my face, and rub some water with a soft cloth.

Overall, I am doing OK for day 5.

Some tips:

- Get your hair loosely braided before FFS. I regret not doing it. I had to cut a piece of my hair as it was completely caked with blood and wrapped extremely tight. It was a side bang so it's not really problem. I guess I cut 6 inch tight wrapped into a ball of of my left bangs. I think braiding hair might prevent some of this, especially if you have difficult hair that's quickly a mess.

- Showers are great. They improve circulation, bruising seems to fade quicker. Massaging really helps.

- Often look in the mirror. Because your skin is numb, you don't feel the stains of food/blood and other stuff on your skin. Can be dangerous, especially with Ice packs. I didn't use ice packs much. Only first two days. This kind of bruising is hard to treat from the outside. The skin simply will be cold, but does nothing for the pain. Ice-cream did help. I am glad I bought enough of it. Soft ice cream, small Popsicles was a relief. More so than icepacks.

Quote from: ElizabethK on November 12, 2016, 02:18:37 PM
Hi 2cherry

I know this is a bit eewwww but having "movement" is very critical...as the old saying goes if you don't "evacuate" it will kill you. Apart from all that it will make you incredible uncomfortable and from what you have already said you have discomfort in spades already.

You sound to me like you are doing remarkably well. I can have my Rhinoplasty any time I want but it is unlikely to be before the beginning of next year. So have you managed to get a look at the work that has been done? I would imagine it would be too early to actually see any difference  yet?

Hugs

Liz

Most remarkable change is the forehead. The forehead is as flat as it could be. So amazing. Even without makeup, I look female. Can't wait to see what happens when I am allowed makeup! lot's to look forward to. The jaw is nice, my face seems more subtle, more rounded. It is hard to tell, because of swelling my face looks like a pear. But if I push the skin, it looks more rounded. The chin... I can't really tell. Maybe bruising, or maybe it's so subtle that I just don't remember how it was... Cheeks are very subtle, but due to swelling I can't truly tell the difference. The raised eyebrows was another massive improvement that is clearly noticeable. The orbital rims were also shaved down, opening my eyes even more. There is no shadow in my eyes anymore, also the over hanging eyelids are gone due to the browlift.

The nose... I can't tell yet... still has a cask on it. I asked him to be very cautious here, and not make it too small. The nose is the main thing on people where I can see if they have done any surgery. I often see small noses, those extremely sloped noses look just too unnatural. So I asked him to make the nose simply straight, remove the hump, and not too much sloped. Hairline: most obvious. It was brought down about 1.5cm, and the sides were closed. Great improvement. Yet, I still might opt for minor hair implants. I wanted the surgery first, and it did help. Max 1 cm of implants and any baldness left would be completely gone.

Some other tips that worked for me:

- When you do the nose, you won't be able to breath through it for some time. This can be frightening, especially if you hyperventilate. (which I did) but, after two days the body seems to get "used" to breathing through the mouth. This was also the reason why I woke up every 15 minutes, because I was afraid to choke. But at day 3, I didn't even noticed that I now breath through my mouth. So relax, it will be better. At day 5, I can breath a bit through my nose, but not enough to do complete inhaling/exhaling yet. To simulate this: pinch your nose and try to breath. That is how it feels like plus ten times more congestion and swelling. Maybe you can get used to it by training this daily, to only breath through your mouth. You will get used to it, even if it seems frightening.

I cannot blow my nose, but I clean it with q-tips and papercup of sterile water with a bit of salt in it. I use about 30 q-tips on each session (once a day), and I never reuse them. I then use a flashlight and a mirror to very, very, very carefully clean the nose inside and dissolve clots.  Not any deeper than the cotton itself! not rubbing, but gently touching and slowly turning. This greatly helped me breathing.

Also: buy Vaseline, and rub the lips every two hours or so. That prevents cracking and keeps them moist. Lipbalm didn't do anything for me.

So far, the nose is truly annoying. If I didn't had to do it, I definitely would let it alone. Maybe doing the nose separate would have been much better. It's just super uncomfortable.

Hi 2cherry thanks so much for sharing  , it's facinating especially   as i myself will be doing the same 
Sounds like you got a really good surgeon , i guess for someone like  that ffs  would be awalk in the park ....how amazing
Get well soon: )