I recently got my blood work done, and my Testosterone was through the roof (300+) while taking a full dose of spiro.

I am on a ketogenic diet (for seizure control) and have been doing more and more intermittent fasting (IF) for the nerve growth factor (nerve damage to my right eye).

What I didn't expect was that my Testosterone would shoot up this high. (Granted I've had troubles keeping it in normal ranges due to some spiro tolerance issues and I tend to exercise quite a bit).

I have been IF nearly every day for a couple months now.  Average time is 18-20 hours with some days being l less and some more.

Increases in Testosterone as well as HGH are known with individuals who IF on a regular basis. I am not wanting to stop, however I do want to get my Testosterone back down.

I recently added in finasteride at a fairly high dose (after we got blood work back).

Does anyone here have any experience or tips? (Besides stopping IF, which I can't do as I am out of treatment options for the nerve pain).

Thanks!
Brooke

Testosterone levels fluctuate on a daily basis based on a host of factors.

Spiro, in addition to reducing testosterone, blocks it so that measuring blood levels, you will not be able to tell how much is really able to bind to receptors and do damage. Measuring free or bio-available T would be more accurate as SHBG typically increases on HRT in transsexual women and binds T to a greater extent.

Finasteride does not reduce T, only DHT levels. It can actually even slightly increase T levels due to less T converting to DHT.

I also fast for my health by skipping lunch and going 12-14 hours between breakfast and dinner. I don't know how it affects testosterone, but it sure makes me feel good, and gets rid of most health issues.

I take derris scandens, a natural Thai herb for back pain that I found blends my female and male personalities, tamping down my aggressive male side, while eliminating dyslexia symptoms, which I LOVE.

When I googled it on US medical websites, they said the herb is an effective muscle relaxer, without side effects, and lowers blood pressure, which could explain why it sharpens my eyesight. If nothing else, if it doesn't work to lower testosterone, it's still a great muscle pain herb.

http://www.oasis-stad.com/product.php?id_product=518

Excellent information. Thank you Kay!

That is very helpful, I will get that rechecked asap. Pretty sure only total was checked.

Learn something new everyday

Thanks!


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Quote from: Raell on November 18, 2016, 11:14:59 PM
I also fast for my health by skipping lunch and going 12-14 hours between breakfast and dinner. I don't know how it affects testosterone, but it sure makes me feel good, and gets rid of most health issues.

I take derris scandens, a natural Thai herb for back pain that I found blends my female and male personalities, tamping down my aggressive male side, while eliminating dyslexia symptoms, which I LOVE.

When I googled it on US medical websites, they said the herb is an effective muscle relaxer, without side effects, and lowers blood pressure, which could explain why it sharpens my eyesight. If nothing else, if it doesn't work to lower testosterone, it's still a great muscle pain herb.

http://www.oasis-stad.com/product.php?id_product=518

I'll take a look at that. I'm actually using a Rx muscle relaxant for muscle spasms.

Do you know why it's helping with the dyslexia symptoms? I have nystagmus and strabismus in both eyes. The dancing eye and lazy eye gives me the word flipping and movement issues.

Thanks!
Brooke

My feeling about this herb is that it relaxes you and in so doing, allows the body and brain to work more optimally, hence the improvement in dyslexia, sharper eyesight, etc.

 

No unqualified advice please.

Herbal medications particularly when used in complex medical/physiological situations require careful evaluation.

Quote from: KayXo on November 18, 2016, 11:01:33 PM
...Measuring free or bio-available T would be more accurate as SHBG typically increases on HRT in transsexual women and binds T to a greater extent.

Finasteride does not reduce T, only DHT levels. It can actually even slightly increase T levels due to less T converting to DHT.

I got my free T results from that same test (found it in online portal- thanks doc! :p )

Free at that point in time was 17 Pg/Ml

I have since started a moderate dose of finesteride and have upped my E dose dramatically.

I just got blood work done earlier this week with these new changes (changed things six weeks ago). We shall see.

Does E act as an AA, or does it have no impact on the levels?

Thanks,
Brooke

E can act as an AA but it's not a powerful one. For some people it's sufficient but for most of us it's not.

Thanks Dena. That's what I thought, and I don't expect to see the increase in E affecting my T levels much.


Hugs,
~Brooke~

I don't know how derris scandens would mesh with other hormones you are taking, or with your high testosterone, since I don't take any medications or hormones, except for derris scandens-a local Thai herbal remedy-which is considered a safe muscle relaxer, on the USA medical websites, with no known side affects.

http://www.oasis-stad.com/product.php?id_product=518

http://thailand.digitaljournals.org/index.php/JTTAM/article/view/18775

I doubt your doctor would have any idea how such an herb would work with hormones, since all the studies I've read online were for long-term muscle pain relief.

Just because it works for me, doesn't mean it will work for anyone else that way, but I'm grateful it sharpens my eyesight, relieves dyslexia and dysphoria symptoms, and somehow blends my gender sides.

If I skip taking it, I usually find myself losing my keys, or forgetting my umbrella at the mall, or even confusing my class schedules at work, like I did before I started taking it. If I go over a day, my male side starts to assert himself, conflicting with my female side.

I have heard that intermittent fasting will make T levels rocket, yes.

But then also that if you break the fast with something small it will stop the excess T production.

If you're on ketogenic mode, you should still be able to eat keto friendly foods without having to fast and it will maintain your keto state? It's the fasting itself and not the keto mode that increases T apparently.

Quote from: Kylo on December 31, 2016, 06:51:01 PM
I have heard that intermittent fasting will make T levels rocket, yes.

But then also that if you break the fast with something small it will stop the excess T production.

If you're on ketogenic mode, you should still be able to eat keto friendly foods without having to fast and it will maintain your keto state? It's the fasting itself and not the keto mode that increases T apparently.

That's my understanding as well. I believe it is the stress response.
17 for bioavailable T isn't too bad though.
I really enjoy the fasting though. That clarity of mind is amazing, and every meal tastes amazing.

For most of this year I had been doing just keto, and my eating habits slowly changed, found myself going without food for longer and longer periods of time. Started for convenience, continued as it has been helping with some nerve damage, brain damage (cerebral palsy and several years of partially controlled epilepsy).

In any case I don't see myself stopping anytime soon. Just have to get rid of the gonads ASAP :p


Hugs,
~Brooke~

Yeah, I do it myself too, the health benefits are good. Supposedly extends lifespan significantly in test animal subjects as well done long term and I guess it's well known to benefit humans in similar ways.

I've seen those studies as well. How long/often do you IF?


Hugs,
~Brooke~

I used to do it once a week a day or so but lately I've added the one meal per day regime as well and sometimes just choose not to bother with that if I don't feel the need.

I think the more one eats the more one seems to want to eat, and vice versa. I have a slow metabolism (despite being pretty active, it's weird) so it's always been a case of needing less food than other people. They're eating three big meals per day and I'm not able to imagine how I'd feel eating that much.

Also you're right about the clearing the mind. Sugar seems to dumb the brain down so much in my experience...

Definitely. I was at a sushi party last night. I opted for non rice rolls (spy wrap). By the end of the night I was still with it, whereas everyone else was ready for a nap. Sushi , wine, beer, huge dessert... followed by the food coma.

Noticed that allot with the holiday season. Every one was so lethargic after big get togethers. On Xmas day I was the only one in my family not to need a nap. So weird how cutting some things out makes the difference.

I totally get that feeling with eating less or more leading to the need.

I hope also read that keto diets actually make the body more efficient in the use of energy leading to the reduced need for as much food


Hugs,
~Brooke~

I guess it's because fat is actually the body's preferred fuel. It wasn't built to be eating refined carbs every few hours... nobody ever gets an insulin resistance disease running on keto.

It's odd to think that what most people do every day in the West is basically unnatural and puts their body into response spike and recovery mode, it seems fairly evident these days that a lot of cancers are caused by what we are ingesting too

haha, I might be starting to sound like a health freak. I'm not really, but I'm in my 30s now... I can't just eat any old junk anymore, I'm doing what I do now because I can feel the damage from not doing it.

You might find this article of interest. https://intensivedietarymanagement.com/fasting-and-autophagy-fasting-25/

I'm playing with the benefits of IF and autophagy for the excess skin I have on my belly after losing about 100 lbs over the past 18 months.

This Dr uses IF with his obese patients who are undergoing weight loss with keto. He has claimed that even with patients who have lost over 100 lbs did not need to be referred for excess skin removal.

Autophagy definitely seems to have benefits and appears to also be linked to longevity, lifespan and prevention of neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's.

Definitely odd that the "healthy" low fat diet may be completely wrong.


Hugs,
~Brooke~

I do wonder if the one meal a day could help speed up the fat redistribution as well.

Considering that fat doesn't really move, the redistribution we see is from small amounts of weight loss and weight gain.

My hypothesis is that during the feed cycle we are eating more calories than we can use, and therefore the excess is made into fat. Then the fast comes and we start burning fat.

Based on the hormone profile it would suggest that the preferred areas of fat burning for m2f with correct levels would be in the typical male areas like the belly. Whereas the preferred storage of fat deposits would be in typical female areas, such as the hips, buttocks and thighs.

We shall see if my personal timeline for fat redistribution is faster than the quoted 1-2 years or more.

Also wonder if the increase in HGH that occurs with IF will help or hinder breast development.


Hugs,
~Brooke~