So I'm a year and a half into the hormone treatment plan from Hell (apparently Hell opens its gates in Mt. Vernon, Baltimore). I'm very behind in my transition and still have my female voice (only a very slight drop within the first few months). I've lost a little bit of fat from my face, but, generally, my face is still very young/femme. My eyes and eyelashes are big, so I doubt that helps me look my age. I'm about 5'4" and weigh 120-130lbs, and I'm post top surgery, so I have a pretty thin male/andro body type.

Suffice to say, I'm never surprised when I get misgendered by strangers. Still happens just as often as before T, if not more often. I'm used to it, and I take it with a grain of salt.

My problem is that those around me still admit they don't see me as anything other than female, and they think top surgery was a funny choice. They often still misgender me, even after over a year of practice. Only my very ally friends call me the right stuff 100% of the time.

I feel like a lot of the problem is my mannerisms. I've recently discovered that I have Asperger's (on the Autism spectrum), and these are things that I cannot change about myself. I come off as more quiet or reserved to strangers, and this behavior is often more associated with being female. I may also latch onto behaviors of those around me in an attempt to "fit in", and I'm not quite sure how many female "mannerisms" I mimic. Also, I fidget when I'm uncomfortable, and I guess being unsure of yourself/what to do with your body parts is not a masculine thing.

All of these factors, combined with my last relationship (he was very mentally abusive and often wouldn't want to have sex with me unless he saw some transwoman porn first), have pretty much completely destroyed the view I had of myself in my head.

I used to see myself transitioning into a man, being accepted as a man, living as a man.

Now I just see myself, as me, neither male nor female, stuck with this face for an eternity. I try not to refer to myself in third person, even when quoting people, so I don't have to gender myself. No, I don't feel that I am androgyn or anything of the sort. All I've ever wanted ever since I was little was to be male. That's it. And it's never felt so completely far away.

I don't know what can possibly be done to give myself back any form of confidence at this point. Is it even possible? Has anyone else experienced anything similar?

My life is such a mess.

I have sort of similar feelings. I tried to keep my expectations low when deciding to take T but I still don't feel completely 'right' or as happy as I feel I'm expected to be. Even though I get gendered correctly it's only because I look like a 17 yr old boy (just turned 23  ), I still can't grow facial hair (my doctor saying everyone has different changes from T and although I agree with that my T levels are in the low male range which seems unusual as well as other trans men are able to grow something) and I dislike how bulky I'm starting to look snd sort of miss how my body used to look. My dad and brother still see me as my old self and pretend that me being trans doesn't exist; my relatives use my real name and pronouns and treat me the same but I'm not sure how much they understand about trans stuff.

I likely have aspergers too (going to ssk my GP to refer me to a specialist to get a diagnosis) and am also quiet and reserved. I latch on too the behaviours of my male coworkers but find it difficult to mimic them authentically and feel like I still come across as awkward and not quite male enough for them.

I simply don't fit in and feel like I'm seperate from everyone else. I'm going to volunteer for an LGBT charity which I hope will make me feel better about myself. Plus fovusing on training for a new career and setting the wheels in motion for top surgery even though it terrifies me. But apart from that all I can hope is that when male puberty ends in 4 years I'll be used to my new body and it would have developed how I'd like it too. I've considered going off T and living as female; although not seriously; but thinking back to how I was pre T that would be a nightmare scenerio.

I did go to a therapist (CBT) for my social anxiety last year for a few months which sort of helped; as I realised T isn't a cure all and my anxiety was a seperate entity from me being trans. So maybe you could try that.

Sorry for turning this into a vent about me .  I thinks it's very common for trans people to feel this way. In trans meetings it's never discussed which is unhealthy. Plus the media and trans youtubers make it seem like ince you transition you immediately feel great and happy. I think it's simply a long process to at least feel content let alone feeling happy in oneself. Think how you felt pre T and how feel now. It's not much but it's something.

Wish I could offer better advice.

To cut to the chase, I would say you need to find validation from yourself, not from others. To do that you need to understand and accept logically and emotionally that the opinions of others are not worth more than your personal truth.

The way I always think of it - if I don't respect myself enough to believe in myself, why should I expect anyone else to respect me? And if I do respect myself that much it doesn't really matter if other people don't.

Pretty much how I circumvent the whole external validation thing and don't seem to suffer at all from it.

Imitating people is a thing, and I tend to do it with certain accents and appropriate them without trying, so I appreciate what you mean when you talk about mannerisms. However being reserved and not talkative with strangers is just as much a male thing as female thing if not more so, since females are typically more social. I know plenty of reserved men, who only get easily sociable after a few beers.

You said that you take the misgendering with a grain of salt so I think you're more than halfway there in terms of dealing with that. The people around you who misgender on purpose need a talking to about how it makes you feel or they need shedding from your circle. Real confidence does have to come from within, not from other people propping you up.

Remember there are cis men with the exact same problems, some of them get misgendered for feminine hair or faces or long eyelashes, maybe their mannerisms and social confidence as well.

Quote from: Elis on March 20, 2017, 04:19:54 PM
I have sort of similar feelings. I tried to keep my expectations low when deciding to take T but I still don't feel completely 'right' or as happy as I feel I'm expected to be. Even though I get gendered correctly it's only because I look like a 17 yr old boy (just turned 23  ), I still can't grow facial hair (my doctor saying everyone has different changes from T and although I agree with that my T levels are in the low male range which seems unusual as well as other trans men are able to grow something) and I dislike how bulky I'm starting to look snd sort of miss how my body used to look. My dad and brother still see me as my old self and pretend that me being trans doesn't exist; my relatives use my real name and pronouns and treat me the same but I'm not sure how much they understand about trans stuff.
[.....]
Wish I could offer better advice.

Thank you for your story, I'm very grateful that you shared. I think it's important to share the personal aspects of our individial journeys here. Good luck with the diagnosis, and I think you should be happy that you can look like a 17yo boy--I'm 26 and I look like I'm 13. Hopefully you'll be able to grow that facial hair soon and grow some confidence with it.

Honestly, I was always so excited for my facial hair to grow in. Since I'm being so severely undertreated with hormones, mine are taking a while to sprout, also. I've had a thin mustache since...probably Elementary school, if I'm being honest, so I should have a lot more hair than this by now. But at this point, my self esteem is so low towards my transition, I look in the mirror, and I don't even care anymore. I don't even look forward to it. It means nothing to me anymore. I tell myself that I need to get my shot every two weeks, and I do, but really, there's no drive left anymore. No spark that gets me excited about getting my next dose of hormones. It's all just blah to me, now that I feel blah.

@Kylo
I get what you're saying, and I try to give myself those types of pep talks all the time, but nothing ever seems to land for me when it comes to my complete and total lack of self-confidence. I don't think I care as much about what other people think, but since I can't find anything about myself that looks very male, I can't even get the confidence ball rolling. Like, if I actually looked pretty male, I wouldn't mind wearing things that might be deemed "femme". But since I look like a young lesbian, I avoid things I might otherwise wear/buy.

Idk, my masculinity that comes from within has always been my only real source of confidence, and now that that doesn't exist, I'm just kind of at a loss.

I can relate to potentially having aspergers and being awkward and reserved...I hate it and I feel it's not a manly trait to be so passive and submissive, it hurts my credibility a lot. I also wanted to make a thread ranting about that aspect of myself now that I think about it.

Im sorry to hear youre so lost though, maybe just being yourself is all you need for the moment until maybe things adjust someday

Hello  fellow autistic ahah I can understand that part. But the thing is lots of men have aspergers even cis men (especially cis men) and also everyone is different and theee is no one cookie cutter to define "man"
I hope things get better.

hey so I'm late to the party here but I joined just to respond to this topic. I was in your same place a few years ago.

It took me over a year and 3 months to pass AT ALL. I'm talking one sir for 5 ma'ams. Like you I'm 5'4" and I had some pretty feminine features and not much voice dropping. And even after that long time...it took a while. I didn't solidly and confidently pass until 3 years and still got misgendered every couple months or so. Only after about 3 and a half did I pass all the time and now, 5 and a half years on T it's no longer an issue. I'm 100% stealth (moved across the country to get away from it all), never get misgendered, and feel completely comfortable and sure. I'm still short and have a higher voice but it doesn't seem to be as much of a factor as it once was.

But I remember how bad it felt. Honestly thought i'd never get to live as a man at all, always stuck inbetween, and sometimes I wanted to give up. which for me meant suicide because I would never detransition. That's why I joined to respond because there seemed to be no hope for me - just guys on youtube who passed after 3 months on hormones and guys who didn't seem to have these issues. Even after all this time stealth with no worries it sometimes hits me: "wow, I made it through." I had a moment even yesterday with my gf, we were out and I just was one of the guys, no question, and it hit me that at one point I never thought i'd get to this point, I teared up and got emotional. Cause I remembered there was a time i thought it would never, ever be OK. But at the end of the day, it was, it just took me longer than others to get there and I'm glad I hung on, but man did my confidence take a beating in the process.

So yes there is hope and there is a good chance that with more time this problem will go away, but the waiting is a terrible thing. I do want to address the fact that you mentioned having unsupportive people in your life - I think that is BS and I would suggest confronting them on it. It's harder with family but you do not have to accept people treating you that way. Youve suffered enough man, don't worry about making others unhappy because they're hurting you way more than you will hurt them by insisting on being treated as the man you are. I wouldn't be surprised if that's a factor. Waiting so long for the transition to "kick in" and to be seen as you are is traumatizing and i don't use that word lightly, like I said my own confidence took a hell of a beating. it's hard enough waiting for hormones to work, screw everyone in your life who wants to tear you down and make you feel less than. You're not.

Dont know if you will ever see this since my reply is late but I wish you the best of luck with all this and I hope it resolves for you sooner rather than later. It can be hard but the day will come where these things happen less and less, and eventually, hopefully, not at all. And you can look back and be proud that you survived this trying time and came out the other side all right.

Quote from: blashyrk on June 10, 2017, 01:17:58 AM
hey so I'm late to the party here but I joined just to respond to this topic. I was in your same place a few years ago.

It took me over a year and 3 months to pass AT ALL. I'm talking one sir for 5 ma'ams. Like you I'm 5'4" and I had some pretty feminine features and not much voice dropping. And even after that long time...it took a while. I didn't solidly and confidently pass until 3 years and still got misgendered every couple months or so. Only after about 3 and a half did I pass all the time and now, 5 and a half years on T it's no longer an issue. I'm 100% stealth (moved across the country to get away from it all), never get misgendered, and feel completely comfortable and sure. I'm still short and have a higher voice but it doesn't seem to be as much of a factor as it once was.

But I remember how bad it felt. Honestly thought i'd never get to live as a man at all, always stuck inbetween, and sometimes I wanted to give up. which for me meant suicide because I would never detransition. That's why I joined to respond because there seemed to be no hope for me - just guys on youtube who passed after 3 months on hormones and guys who didn't seem to have these issues. Even after all this time stealth with no worries it sometimes hits me: "wow, I made it through." I had a moment even yesterday with my gf, we were out and I just was one of the guys, no question, and it hit me that at one point I never thought i'd get to this point, I teared up and got emotional. Cause I remembered there was a time i thought it would never, ever be OK. But at the end of the day, it was, it just took me longer than others to get there and I'm glad I hung on, but man did my confidence take a beating in the process.

So yes there is hope and there is a good chance that with more time this problem will go away, but the waiting is a terrible thing. I do want to address the fact that you mentioned having unsupportive people in your life - I think that is BS and I would suggest confronting them on it. It's harder with family but you do not have to accept people treating you that way. Youve suffered enough man, don't worry about making others unhappy because they're hurting you way more than you will hurt them by insisting on being treated as the man you are. I wouldn't be surprised if that's a factor. Waiting so long for the transition to "kick in" and to be seen as you are is traumatizing and i don't use that word lightly, like I said my own confidence took a hell of a beating. it's hard enough waiting for hormones to work, screw everyone in your life who wants to tear you down and make you feel less than. You're not.

Dont know if you will ever see this since my reply is late but I wish you the best of luck with all this and I hope it resolves for you sooner rather than later. It can be hard but the day will come where these things happen less and less, and eventually, hopefully, not at all. And you can look back and be proud that you survived this trying time and came out the other side all right.

That's a hell of an entrance, Blashyrk: Great first post. I certainly hope you stick around.
Welcome to the site.

second your first post being great, blashyrk

Now that this thread popped again I'll add regarding the autism I had a friend who learned she had autism, the way she coped and dealt with it was intentionally putting concise effort into relearning mannerisms, voice inflection, facial expressions. There are some things that come naturally to most that you yourself have to take the time and effort to learn if you wish to improve. Challenge yourself each day to change your posturing, how you interact with others, and more in order to get better at it!