The detransitioners they were transgender until they weren't

http://www.thestranger.com/features/2017/06/28/25252342/the-detransitioners-they-were-transgender-until-they-werent

The Stranger/By Katie Herzon  06/28/2017

Very interesting article. 

Interesting. Makes you think twice about transisioning. It's not just a quick fix to your problems.

Quote from: MeTonie on June 28, 2017, 11:56:09 PM
Interesting. Makes you think twice about transisioning. It's not just a quick fix to your problems.

Absolutely correct.  I personally think it is very important to identify and begin processing all of one's issues before and during transition, and before taking permanent measures. It's not necessary to complete a course of therapy, but awareness of just what is motivating oneself, and having some clarity into one's thinking and emotional states is very important. 

I suspect that such introspection and self-knowledge armors one against 'red-pilling' as done by certain alt-right groups and feminist radicals to convince someone to radically change their belief systems.  I know this has been used against some trans folks and feminists to produce fairly upsetting results.

I'd also note the case of Ryan described here.  On HRT, their mental state was what they describe as 'cloudy', and discontinuing HRT brought them relief.  I suspect that is a clue as to how the neuroendocrine system in the individual is set, and provides a glimpse into whether medical transition is appropriate.  (My personal experience indicates that HRT and medical transition is appropriate for me.  I experienced great relief and clarity of thinking on HRT that I had missed since my early teens.)

There's always going to be some people get it wrong and I don't think we can expect to get it right every time. We're only human. In the past the numbers were biassed towards not enough transitioning, and few regrets. For the foreseeable future I'd expect those proportions to shift a bit, but still be heavily biased towards regret over not transitioning.

Its going to be a very long time, if ever, before it flips over to the other way. Ignoring peoples rights to self determination, we need to bear in mind that more people have been helped than harmed these days than ever before. Raising barriers will hurt more than it helps.

To put it another way, harming people is the price we pay for helping, and I don't think there's any way around it.

Quote from: Michelle_P on June 29, 2017, 12:37:58 AM
I'd also note the case of Ryan described here.  On HRT, their mental state was what they describe as 'cloudy', and discontinuing HRT brought them relief.  I suspect that is a clue as to how the neuroendocrine system in the individual is set, and provides a glimpse into whether medical transition is appropriate.  (My personal experience indicates that HRT and medical transition is appropriate for me.  I experienced great relief and clarity of thinking on HRT that I had missed since my early teens.)

That jumped out at me too.  My own response to HRT (estrogen + spiro) was the opposite of Ryan's - mental and emotional dissonance lifted and I gained peace and a clarity of thought.  That has been a stable, long term condition.

People make mistakes, they refuse to be true to themselves. I think having your psychological house in order is a priority before making any physical changes. I think online forums have a place in support, however there is nothing quite like sitting and chatting with someone to restore a sense of peaceful mind.

HRT did not have me in a fog but has been nothing but pleasure and restored hope to me.

Good to see an article on detransitioning which is unbiased. Of course we need to move away from the assumption that just because you're not medically transitioning anymore; that doesn't necessarily mean you're not trans.

I wonder if percentage of 'voluntary' ftm detransitioners is significantly higher than mtf detransitioners?


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I've always said a detransitioner walks a longer, harder path than most people, and needs all the support we can give them. Sadly, the opposite is true. I've watched the people right here on this forum act like animals towards people who say that they're going to detransition.   

Hugs, Devlyn

Quote from: Devlyn Marie on June 29, 2017, 06:31:48 AM
I've always said a detransitioner walks a longer, harder path than most people, and needs all the support we can give them. Sadly, the opposite is true. I've watched the people right here on this forum act like animals towards people who say that they're going to detransition.   

Hugs, Devlyn

Absolutely!  There can be tremendous social pressure put on an individual to detransition.  There can be tremendous pressure to move forward and complete a transition. Social shaming may be involved as well, when a peer group strongly disapproves of an individual's action.

I think it is important as a community that we recognize this capability within ourselves, and treat the decisions individuals reach regarding the path that they take in life with respect, even if we do not understand it.

I remember back in the 80s reading a Nebula or Hugo(maybe both) award winning short story, I can't remember the title or author, about a future where young people were increasingly changing their gender due to relaxed social pressure and enhanced medical technology.  But in the story it was quite common for people to keep switching genders back and forth and each time they did so they became increasingly hideous in appearance.  The main character was a mother with a daughter who had become so hideous that she stayed in her room all the time and never went out.  The mother eventually referred to her daughter as "that thing in the other room."  I thought after reading the story that transition regret was pretty common.  The story certainly gave the bleakest, most transphobic, portrayal of transgender life imaginable.  Also reinforced by the media treatment of us at the time.

Turns out it's quite rare.

I personally find the notion of detransitioning very difficult to deal with. Jeez, I'm hardly able to cope with my own transitioning. I've been a follower, however, of Julia Serano. I love her books and fiery intellect. She just posted a piece regarding that article here, which you all may find interesting as I did:

http://juliaserano.blogspot.com/2017/07/why-my-piece-wont-be-appearing-in.html

I can remember my 2 therapists both wanting me to start HRT. One explained that TG had a majority of estrogen receptors in our brain that were deprived by a well fed Testorone driven minority. Once on HRT the maorrity finalyl get enough food from estrogen. If that is our natural place mentally we will finally emerge from the fog and find clarity and peace. If this does not happen then its most likely you are not TG.

My brain was definitely starving for estrogen

Those who are born transgender would never want to de-transitition. Anybody who transitions because it's currently 'fashionable', well they had better get plenty of therapy before they go beyond the point of no return. We each have the responsibility to determine which path is the best for us, we cannot let 'fashion' dictate that.

There is absolutely no way I would ever want to de-transition. Six days into T and I've never felt better. 

Quote from: Dan on July 09, 2017, 12:28:21 AM
Those who are born transgender would never want to de-transitition.

I want to point out that even being born transgender doesn't necessarily mean that you know at an early age. I didn't know until I was 54. I too would never transition back.

:

April 22, 2015, the day of my first face to face pass in gender neutral clothes and no makeup. It may be months to the next one, but I'm good with that!

Being transgender is just a phase. It hardly ever starts before conception and always ends promptly at death.

They say the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train. I say, climb aboard!

Think outside the voice box!

Quote from: Dan on July 09, 2017, 12:28:21 AM
Those who are born transgender would never want to de-transitition. Anybody who transitions because it's currently 'fashionable', well they had better get plenty of therapy before they go beyond the point of no return. We each have the responsibility to determine which path is the best for us, we cannot let 'fashion' dictate that.

There is absolutely no way I would ever want to de-transition. Six days into T and I've never felt better.

Um, no. Detransitioners are obviously transgender. It's rather insulting to say otherwise, Dan. This is a support site for all, even those who detransition.

Hugs, Devlyn

Quote from: Dan on July 09, 2017, 12:28:21 AM
Those who are born transgender would never want to de-transitition.

Um.  Most of us are not born with a placard around our neck proclaiming us to be transgender.  In many places and times, it is possible to grow up without ever hearing that term.  (The word was not even coined until I was in my teens.)  We may grow up in a setting where the childhood behaviors we associate have a rather different label, one tied to massive shame and embarrassment as our toxic culture works it's magic on our developing minds.

Even once we know our true selves, the culturally imposed mandates may block transition, or worse, drive us back into the closet through detransition, under immense pressure from our employers, peers, family, and government.  If these pressures outweigh the level of our gender dysphoria or drive to be out, then we may very well choose a path of hiding.  It often doesn't end well for us, true, but some do see detransition driven by cultural stigma as their only viable path.

A person may be truely transgender, yet choose a path back into hiding.  That is their choice, a path they seek for survival.  I can understand this, even if it is not my path.  Others should at least accept it, even if they do not understand it.

Quote from: Dan on July 09, 2017, 12:28:21 AM
Anybody who transitions because it's currently 'fashionable', well they had better get plenty of therapy before they go beyond the point of no return.

Anyone who transitions, period, should get plenty of therapy before committing to irreversible changes.  The purpose of such therapy is not to pass judgement or 'cure' them, but to assist them in clarifying their thinking and making sure that they fully understand the consequences of their actions, the new lifetime of commitment that they are taking on, and the impact of these changes on both themselves and those around them.

Stepping past a 'point of no return' is not to be taken lightly, even if it is something we are driven to, and are certain it will bring us peace and joy.

Quote from: Dan on July 09, 2017, 12:28:21 AM
We each have the responsibility to determine which path is the best for us, we cannot let 'fashion' dictate that.

Absolutely correct.  It is the responsibility of each individual to choose their path.  Neither fashion, or the dictates of others should determine that path.  This includes a path of detransition.  If someone has determined that they made a personal mistake in moving past that 'point of no return', trying to reverse their changes as best as they can to meet what they see as their needs in life is a path only they can choose. 

I only hope that they can receive the help in making a decision to detransition that many of us receive when we decide to take irreversible actions on our paths.

I suspect over time the ratio of detransitioning between MTFs and FTMs has changed. When I transitioned, blockers weren't used and the pill dosage we received was insufficient to induce chemical castration. Injections, implants and patches weren't available or used for MTFs so pills were our only option. As the results, it wasn't until after surgery that we were able to  determine how we felt about the new chemical balance. The thought at the time was the hormone induced body changes would be the ruler used to determine how comfortable we would be in our new role.

FTMs on the other hand only used injections(no gels) so they pretty quickly  were able to determine how they felt on the new chemical mix. At that point, FTMs had the advantage as they knew well before any surgery what they were in for.

With the introduction of blockers, it's now possible to know how MTFs will feel within a month of starting HRT. This kind of evens out the the odds and may bring the detransition ratios closer to one to one.

There will always be people who discover life isn't what they expected or that they are unable to handle the issues that occur in their new life but fortunately, with proper therapy, these numbers can be very low. Older numbers that I  am aware of put detransitioners at 2-3% however it's possible the number are much lower due to a better understanding of what transgender is.