Hi there, my name's Charley. (Not sure if I like the spelling yet, so I may change it later!) 31 year old trans guy, living in Scotland. I've known for several years that I wanted to transition, and two years ago I finally got the guts to go through with it! I booked my appointment... Then there was a hitch - they told me I needed to lose weight before going on T, so I've got another appointment in a few months time. As you can imagine this was hard to hear, but I'm doing my best to get through it and have already lost a few pounds. Also recently gave up smoking!

I live with my partner who is also a trans guy.
Unrelated to my transition: I was also diagnosed with transverse myelitis, which put me off work, made it difficult to get out (I would get tired out just going to the corner shop for a pint of milk!) and is probably the biggest contributor to my weight problem. I'm just now starting to recover, but things have been hard.

I like science fiction, books, and old video games.  I enjoy making art and writing fiction. Recently finished my first novel and I'm working on my second. At the moment I've been feeling depressed, and that's part of my reason for making an account here. I don't have friends to talk to besides my partner. I'm shy and have been diagnosed with OCD on top of that! So I'm hoping to get chatting to and connect with new people.

Welcome. I noticed the OCD. I have that, or Im told I have that by one of the top clinicians in in England. Also shes not my Counsellor, shes my boss. Fortunately, for me, having A boss with these skills makes my employment more secure, she is very understanding.

Yeah I turned 30 Just over a week ago, and only just discovered I have OCD. Ive just written A blog for pride, about how my local community business has supported me as a trans woman.If you want to look at that .

Anyways. Enjoy your stay. And hope you find your Name

Welcome to Susan's Place. I am glad you finally stepped out of the shadows were we can see you. If you are here for company, there should be no problem with that. As you may have noticed, this site is active 24 hours a day so there should be somebody to chat with. Speaking of chat, we also have a chat should you desire a one on one conversation with somebody. Personally, I like to spend a little more time considering my response so I am more comfortable on the forum.

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Hi Charley 

Welcome to Susan's Place    Glad to have you here, join on in the fun

Hugs

V M

Hi Charley!  I am glad you decided to sign up - so much better to see you here.  It's awesome you enjoy writing - writing novels is quite an accomplishment.  And you are working on your health in so many ways.  Congratulations on quitting smoking, a major milestone.  Losing weight is never easy, I have done it.  If you ever feel discouraged, think about how much better you feel after each improvement. 

Although your HRT was delayed it sounds like you're on a good path to get there and you are determined.  I have found great people here, each with a unique story but we all have many things in common. 

I am looking forward to your success and future.

Welcome!

Kendra

Thanks for the warm welcomes everyone! I'm looking forward to taking part in the forums! I've always had a bad habit of joining forums then forgetting to log in, or not wanting to, but I'm gonna try really hard to stick with this one.

For some reason I can't preview the post, so I hope it comes out alright and doesn't have weird formatting or anything.

ButterflyVickster:

Happy birthday for last week! That would be interesting to check out!

With regards to OCD, one thing that's helped me immensely is the Everybody Has A Brain channel on youtube. The guy who runs it (who has OCD himself) has a unique way of talking about OCD and the videos have helped me so much, both to understand how OCD works and to learn how to deal with it. I definitely recommend checking them out - that goes for anyone who has OCD, anxiety or similar.

Dena:

I didn't realise there was a chat! I might check that out another time, I think forum is a good place to start for now.

Yep, one of the things that drew me here was the large number of members, and huge variety of topics to post about. My doctors have all been urging me to join local LGBT and trans groups, but it seems like all the LGBT and trans groups out there are... just that. They don't have a mandate/purpose/reason for meeting up, other than the fact they're all LGBT. So I might have zero in common with them as people, and thus zero things to talk about. (As an introvert with chronic shyness and OCD, that doesn't help!) It just seems really depressing, especially when I'm still waiting to get T... the idea of meeting a bunch of people just because they are also waiting to get hormones or are already getting it. Give me an LGBT book club or something!
But here, there's so many different topics, including ones for hobbies, and a lot of users, so it seems more likely that everyone can find someone to talk to about their favourite subjects.

I did actually read all those links already, but I'll probably read them a couple of times over just to make sure I didn't miss anything, so thanks for including them

Kendra:

Weirdly enough I didn't find it that hard to give up smoking (I've replaced cigarettes with vape) and losing weight is pretty easy now too. I don't say that lightly - all my life I've struggled with my weight. It has always felt like all I needed to do was eat 2 biscuits and then I would gain a stone! (Ok, that's an exaggeration, but you know what I mean!) My partner helped me draw up a new diet plan and... it's amazing. I don't feel like I'm on a diet. I eat pretty much what I want, all the time, never feel hungry, never feel like snacking, and yet I've consistently lost a stone every week since I started. So, on that note, if anyone's reading this and wants to know the details of the actual plan so they can try it for themselves, feel free to send me a message.

The only thing that really super annoys me is that we didn't know there was a BMI requirement for getting HRT. I was on the NHS waiting list for over a year, at the end, they told me that I needed to lose weight. Why couldn't they have told us at the beginning?! I could've probably lost it already if I'd known! It's so sad to think of all the folks whose transition have been delayed for this reason, especially those who find it harder to lose weight for various reasons.

Quote from: gooseberry on August 02, 2017, 07:04:20 AM
For some reason I can't preview the post, so I hope it comes out alright and doesn't have weird formatting or anything.

I ran into the same problem for a month until I realized the Preview appears higher up the screen.  Scroll up, it's there.  Maybe we should add this to the guidelines we send to all new members (the pointers Dena added).

There are many excellent transgender meeting groups in the world but I have also seen members describe some disasters.  If you have access to a well-organized group in your area you might want to consider trying it.  A good local group provides a different type of interaction - an additional resource.  If the group turns out to be poorly run or potentially damaging, I'd bail immediately. 

Losing weight was not easy for me.  That was one of the 3 most difficult challenges I've faced and the results were very rewarding.  Eight years after I dropped one third of my weight, I quit drinking and that made it easier to maintain my weight. 

Quote from: gooseberry on August 02, 2017, 07:04:20 AM
> losing weight is pretty easy now too. I don't say that lightly -

Alright I caught the pun.  Time for you to meet Devlyn.  I say this with a heavy heart.

I am not a good source of information for the NHS process, but it may be possible for a licensed private endocrinologist to evaluate and get you onto an earlier track for HRT.  They might use a different BMI threshold with more frequent monitoring of other health factors.  I know that's theoretically paying twice for something - NHS as a taxpayer benefit and then paying out of pocket for a private care, but it is an option.  HRT is relatively inexpensive compared to the price of private surgery. 

Kendra

Oooh thanks, I didn't know that about the preview!

I'm honestly so surprised at how easy I'm finding the weight loss. It's not easy for the vast majority of people. So many  struggle hard with this problem, as I did in the past. At the risk of sounding patronising, you did great to achieve your weight loss goals, and to give up drinking too! (By the way, I hope I didn't seem like I was bragging when I posted about how easy it was. My intention was to let people know that there are different ways to do it, and that I'm willing to share my diet plan if anyone wants it.)

Re: transgender groups, yeah, this is what I'm afraid of. Usually when I've tried to take part in a group in the past, I'm the person that sits in the corner not saying anything, and then I end up feeling worse... it feels like the doctors are trying to push me into joining a group like it'll magically fix all the problems. And maybe it will help, but I don't want to go just because I feel like I've been pressured into it, know what I mean?

Private medication is definitely something to consider. My doctor was VERY unclear about what weight I should be... I was told to get T you need BMI of 35, but my doctor told me to lose 3 stone, which would give me a BMI of 30. Then they made me an appointment dated 6 months later... who loses 3 stone in 6 months?! Technically I /should/ get approved for T on the NHS in December, as I should have a BMI of 35 by then if I keep on track. If they delay me again, I was planning to seek private treatment at that point to cover the gap. But you brought up a good point I hadn't thought of, that they might take other health factors into consideration instead of just BMI alone! So I'll do more research on that too! Thank you for that insight!

Hey gooseberry; nice to meet another person from the UK

Sorry the NHS is giving you the run around .  Don't get why you're made to lose weight first; as you'll be having regular blood tests done within the first year to make sure your all round health is good; not just your hormone levels. And BMI is commonly known to be useless to check health. Yiu can be chubby with a high BMI and still be healthy; it's not an accurate way of measuring your health. Don't get why doctors still use it .  Anyway rant other  . It's healthy to lose 2 pounds a week and diet is more important than exercise.  Hope you have success in losing weight

As for support groups; I get what you mean. I don't find them particular helpful; even though luckily there are some good ones in London; but I feel I need to have more in common hobby wise with someone than just a medical condition. Saying that FTM London is good if you're ever visiting. Each month they have a particular topic to discuss and then you have some time after the group to talk with different people or/and go to the pub afterwards.or just quietly leave if you choose too  . Although the group is rather large which I don't like.

There's also TAGS swimming group which is a swimming group for trans people. They might have some groups further north I think or you can also make that suggestion to them.

There's also TMSA UK; a trans masculine support and advice fb page.

Yeah, I know what you mean. According to BMI charts I should be 9-10 stone... at one (particularly bad) point in my life I was the "ideal" weight, 9 and a half stone, I reached this weight by eating 4 pieces of toast a day and nothing else - and on top of that working 8-10 hour shifts in House of Fraser (where you're not allowed to sit down). Everyone at work said I looked too skinny! I could fit into size 8 women's clothes... sometimes size 6 (this was long before I figured out I was transgender), I am not that slim naturally and it doesn't feel right for me. When I put on weight, I also put on muscle, it wasn't very visible but I could tell it was there because I could lift heavy boxes at work (went to a grocery store with lot of heavy boxes in the warehouse) without much problem. So... yeah, sorry for rambling... I don't feel that it's a great indicator, and certainly shouldn't be the only indicator. It just felt so wretched at the consultation, to be postponed because of this.

But anywho that's what's happened so that's what we have to deal with.

Yeah, that's the way I feel about trans groups... as for swimming, I can't imagine swimming at all until after top surgery. Don't know which changing room to use and can't stand the thought of wearing a swimming costume. Having transverse myelitis complicates it too (a spinal problem that usually passes, but can leave permanent affects. I'm not sure how well I'll recover right now) So that's something I might look into... a few years from now.

Quote from: gooseberry on August 02, 2017, 11:00:26 AM
Yeah, I know what you mean. According to BMI charts I should be 9-10 stone... at one (particularly bad) point in my life I was the "ideal" weight, 9 and a half stone, I reached this weight by eating 4 pieces of toast a day and nothing else - and on top of that working 8-10 hour shifts in House of Fraser (where you're not allowed to sit down). Everyone at work said I looked too skinny! I could fit into size 8 women's clothes... sometimes size 6 (this was long before I figured out I was transgender), I am not that slim naturally and it doesn't feel right for me. When I put on weight, I also put on muscle, it wasn't very visible but I could tell it was there because I could lift heavy boxes at work (went to a grocery store with lot of heavy boxes in the warehouse) without much problem. So... yeah, sorry for rambling... I don't feel that it's a great indicator, and certainly shouldn't be the only indicator. It just felt so wretched at the consultation, to be postponed because of this.

But anywho that's what's happened so that's what we have to deal with.

Yeah, that's the way I feel about trans groups... as for swimming, I can't imagine swimming at all until after top surgery. Don't know which changing room to use and can't stand the thought of wearing a swimming costume. Having transverse myelitis complicates it too (a spinal problem that usually passes, but can leave permanent affects. I'm not sure how well I'll recover right now) So that's something I might look into... a few years from now.

Yeah not great :/. I have a naturally stocky build and a slight stomach yet according to recent blood tests I'm healthy. Be interesting to find out what my BMI tells me; each time I've checked it it's been almost 'too high'  .

Yeah can't imagine swimming without having top surgery done first either. Can't even gain the courage to go to the trans swimming group.

Hi Charley, welcome to Susan's Place! I'll just weigh in on the puns.
On a scale of one to ten I eight them up........<crickets >   

See you around the site!

Hugs, Devlyn

Welcome Charley!

It's weird they'd want you to lose weight before going on T. I would definitely question if that is part of NHS's official guidelines ( they must be published out there somewhere).

I agree that a healthy, long term diet plan is important, as long as you don't overeat on all the delish healthy foods

I thought I'd lose weight faster by cutting out alcohol ( I drank double shots of whiskey every day, sometimes two shots - I just love the stuff). For the last 4 months or so I had no alcohol whatsoever, but my weight loss is not any faster than with just keeping drinking alcohol. It's obviously not making any difference in that regard.  I clearly just eat more than I need. I could get back to my whiskey indulgence, but it's probably healthier for my liver to stay off it or drink less ( actually easier to not have the stuff in my house to begin with unless it is dispensed on a timer I can't hack  )

Exercise is important too though. You will really reap the benefits of it on T, I'm told. If you can't afford going to a gym or just don't want the company and time consuming commute to and from, you can easily and very effectively work out from home. I'm using resistance tubes ( Bodylastics, look them up) and have done so for years with excellent results every time I persevered with them. There are also body weight only exercise regimes, and there are some very good and free resources online for this type of exercise. I see really no need at all to go to a gym to build muscles, lose weight and feel fantastic.

Welcome aboard, and hopefully you'll soon join us on the T train.

Thanks for the further hi's and welcomes

I tried searching for NHS info on this weight thing, and the best info I could find after combing through the results with a fine toothed comb, was a pdf guideline sheet for doctors, which just said "consider the patient's weight." That was it. No facts or figures, just that. However when I spoke to the clinic I've had 2 different doctors and the receptionist tell me my BMI should be 35, and one doctor (the one who's dealing with me directly, lucky me) who said it should be 30. So I'm very confused but also don't know how to go about finding more info. Going private isn't a viable option right now because of the costs, but I could save up for it in maybe 2-3 months if I hoard every bit of spare cash I get from PIP (illness/disability benefit for people who can't work). The question I'm asking myself is... is it worth doing that just to get started a few months earlier? On the one hand I feel like, "I've waited this long, I can wait another few months," and on the other, "I've waited this long, and that's long enough!" Also I don't want to pay for a private consultation just to have them turn me down for the same reason. :\

With regards to dieting, Dan, what I do is select my meals to a) get the best feeling of "fullness," and b) take care of all the dietary needs (protein, carb, etc). I have a daily calorific target which (according to the plan my partner and I drew up together) I'm supposed to hit as close as possible every day. Not go under it, hit it. It's a little lower than the usual recommended calorific intake, but not low enough to make me feel like I'm starving. The goal is to keep the calorific intake stable whilst at the same time feeling well fed (and therefore less likely to snack or give in to temptation foods.) So far this is working, I've lost almost exactly a pound every week, though it has taken some trial and error to select the right meals for it: meals that are healthy, enjoyable and satisfying! For me, personally, I like to have a huge breakfast and a small lunch, if I do it the other way around then I feel bloated when I have dinner. I think the reason a lot of people struggle with weight loss is because they eat low-fat or diet meals that don't actually make them feel full, so afterwards they feel like having a snack, and after a while most of us will give in to temptation. Of course we do, 'cause we're hungry!! Or else people feel like if they eat something high-calorie like, say, a burger, then they should eat less the next day, so the body isn't getting consistency in what it's taking in, so it might try to conserve the fat it has.

That's unusual that cutting out alcohol hasn't made a difference for you, though perhaps it has, just an unnoticeabley small one? I cut out alcohol at the same time as making my other diet changes, so I have no idea how much difference its made (and I didn't drink a lot to start with anyway.) I know some people feel more hungry and tend to snack when they drink, others feel the opposite, not hungry at all while drinking, more hungry when they abstain, so maybe that could be part of it? My dad drinks a bottle of wine every night + beers at the pub, and he eats one meal a day. If he has a snack before dinner then he skips that meal entirely 'cause he says he doesn't feel hungry. (And he's not thin, either.)

Yeah, I don't want to go to the gym, but I got an exercise bike at home and I need to do regular physio anyway because of my illness, so I'm gradually incorporating some weight-loss exercises in with the physio. Exercise is hard because I can tire myself out if I overdo it... by that I mean I'll put myself in bed for a couple of days with extra-strong, prescription-only painkillers that barely take the edge off it, unable to do normal everyday stuff. Yay illness! So what I'm doing is increasing the number and variety of exercises gradually to see what I can manage and how I can get my strength up. I will look into the Bodylastics (thanks for the tip!), and I already use elastic (not for weight loss but it helps with back pain - not sure what they're called, they're just a strip of plain elastic) as the problem is with my spine I'm gonna have to be careful with them.

Whew this got long! Sorry for the wall of text, folks!

I believe the BMI requirement comes from the WPATH standards as I did a search and found one reference to 35 for MTFs and a higher risk of breast cancer. There is an additional consideration in that testosterone can increase your appetite to the point you want to eat everything in sight. On the other hand, testosterone can increase the rate you burn calories so with the same amount of food, you will lose weight. Most of the time it's MTFs who gain weight and FTMs who lose weight but the doctor may want to be sure you are able to control your weight before starting you on testosterone.

Thanks for the tip (and well done for finding that!) that gives me an idea what to look up next!