Deniz
I could relate at one time as I was in denile confusion and  etc.  I was just trying to put the blame on someone or something rather than except the responsibility of myself   then I saw birth and even the burden of birth defects then I came to the realization that I also have and was born with a birth defect
I do believe in the Father The Son and the Holy Ghost   The triune God   I usto wonder why did he did this to me than I relised that he didnt do it he let it happen and for a reason (I'm still looking for the reason) I usto hear all the time that he never gives us more than we can handel (I usto think that was a lot of crap) and at times even now my plate feels like it is overflowing  but I continue to put my faith in him  and let things fall were they may  I also after seeing the movie that mell gibson did relised that I could never suffer (nor was any thing that I was going through compair) the way he did and any suffering that I was expericing could never compair to his
I as so many others like me still deal with the critism of others   but I think ( and correct me if I get this wrong) the thing that I hold onto is one  we need to pull the Bolder out of our own eyes before we try to pull the pebbel out of our neighbors eye  also judge not least ye be judged   so as I saw it the critism I get is the ignorance of others and yes even the people that think that they are hollyer than thou  I will never judge another person   I may not like their thoughts but I will conscern myself more with my self than others   I also look at the Fathers Sons jorney  and how he even excepted a hore a thief and etc and told others that it was not their posision to say who was or who had the rights to come to him or who should be forgiven   so in sum I do believe that our Father in Heaven excepts me and others like me and etc that I come to him and except his Son as our Savior
I could go on   and yes I did grow up in a (sp?) prochial school my whole life and it did make me run from the church   but when I saw the birth of my son and his birth defect I questioned and then relised that I was no different than him in ways  and just as he had to except in time I also had to except who and what I was experiercing  I also learned that my demons werent realy werent to be dwelled on tha there were others out there that had it worse than I did  so I guess I learned to quit feeling sorry for myself and start living life to its fullest  and start loving My Savior and My God   as well as start loving Myself and excepting  who and what I realy am     
Frank you started a good one  this one is a subject that can go on forever
you all have a good day   and as my pastor says May God Bless you and keep you safe
TTFN
Kristin

Deniz,

Many have probably wondered the same thing as you. Many have probably felt similar. Especially when we don't understand what is happening in our lives and others misuse scripture to make us feel worse.

It is very admirable that you can feel love and regret or remorse. Many of those who have had their hearts hardened don't feel such things. Many have become cold hearted.
The Lord said: Because iniquity shall abound the love of many shall wax cold. He also said "Many are called but few are chosen." Ecclesiastes says that two must be together to have heat and one can't have heat alone.
The scriptures also say that the love of God is in Christ Jesus. He is that love of God.
It's that iniquity when people mishandle the word of God to condemn others that causes their love to grow cold. Sadly, they kick those who are down and judge rather than love and show mercy. With a cold heart of hatred towards what they do not understand they cause those who may be living a nightmare to lash out at God.
Many have it easy. Maybe too easy. Anyone can love God when all goes well. That's only half of the vows. Better, health and richer. They may be the ones that don't have what it takes because their faith has never been tried.
Those like Job that have the sickness, poorer and worse times are stronger spiritually.

I hope you hang in there. The Lord may be the Rose of Sharon but that rose is surrounded by thorns. It's not easy as many believe.

Kristin, thank you.

Frank

thank you Frank   this is a subject that I ve had such feelings for   expecialy sence I have had pastors condem me for what I am doing  not to mention all the school teachers church counslers decons and various church members that I have had to be judged by as a child as I said I believe that God is my judge and man even pastors even though they may be ordained by the Lord it is still not their place to judge me   they are human just like I am and I do reconise that they may have had more teachings than I may  but again our Lord Heavenly father is the only true judge of us  and as long as I live I will believe that he sent his Son for all our sins expecialy mine
again thanks Frank
Kristin

Quote from: kristinrichann on February 22, 2008, 01:57:54 PM
but again our Lord Heavenly father is the only true judge of us  and as long as I live I will believe that he sent his Son for all our sins expecialy mine
again thanks Frank
Kristin

Kristin

Part of Christian theology is the fallen state of humanity. With this in mind and the fact that Gender Dysphoria is a recognized biological fact then this is part of that fallen humanity and therefore part of Christ's redeeming act from the cross. It saddens me when I read that pastors, school teachers, elders, etc condemn   trans people when they should show compassion as Christ has shown compassion.

I am fortunate that my ministers knows I am trans

hugs

Nigella   

Nigella
I was raised MS Luthern  they have a verry strict Guideline much (but not as firm as ) the Cathloic church and unfortunatly to day even though it is not as bad as in my youth they still look at this as
destroying Gods Temple  not how I view it but it is their belief   that is why the Lords house is in my heart and in my home  as I have told my pastor he is welcome into my home any time he feels like coming over and I welcome him or any others  but please do not condem me because I am trying to correct a birth defect  you have got to rember just how Ignorant humanity was in the 50's and early 60's even profesional Dr.'s used extensive drugs to make you conform to societys standards unless you were made of monie just like today   unfortuntly today even Dr.'s make a monolipy out of our misory   look at the expences that most of us have to go through to become right  and it is not something that happend with one fee you sometimes have to pay for years to become right not to mention what you have to pay to just get the counseling to meet certin guidelines  dont get me wrong these guidelines are needed other wise look at how many people might make the wrong desision  people that are just confused   in my case I usto feel that there should be someone accountable for what I was put through all the drugs and such  and how much more that even the (suposible) profesional counslers screwed up my mine it is no wonder that it has taken me somany years to learn the truth about my self to learn to love who and what I realy am and I do even with the twenty five years of being seperated from my famely (outcasted)
I learned that in the end it is ones self that has to live with ones self  and that only you can be accountable for what you need to do and pay to get done  do in reality do or does anyone thaink that any of these people will except respoinsibility  nice thought but you have got to see the reality of live    life is what one makes of it  and I personaly am tired of the past and I want a real life   Im not good looking by no means  and I except this  but I am pleased with who I am  and how I am now  I am the one that matters in my life  not the critism of others  I do not flont myself in front of them I keep to myself I am in a way lucky that I live in the country (BFE) (LOL)  but it is my space and there as well as were ever I go I have My Lord and Savior with me  that is my counsel   I usto be angry with the world for what I went through but when I saw the birth of my son and had to fight for his life  I relised that my life wasnt so bad that there were others out there that had it even worse   kinda makes one grow up and suck up their bra straps and get on with life   to this day my son is just about 5 yrs old and has over 300 fractures most which have been caused by Dr.'s that say that they know what they are doing  I pray for him dayly and even he excepts me for whom I am  My SO excepts me as her sister this kid is lucky he has two mothers (in a way  LOL)  but I do deeply feel that my Lord  is with us in our home and were ever we go  and I have quit worrying about what others feel  I am happy with whom I am and I am shure that My Lord is also because he knows that he is always in our hearts

sorry for the blurp but Frank I told you  that you hit a touchy subject with me   I pray for thouse that feel that the world owes them something   or even feels that they are alone  look at this sight it is full of good people that have been put through hell in some form or another
well I'll leave it at that for now  it is good to see that there are as many christins that there are here
Ya ALLL Take care for now
Love yall
TTFN
Kristin

Posted on: February 22, 2008, 07:19:34 PM

---

now you all know why I choise Freddy Murcury (sorry sp?) as my av.

Quote from: LynnER on February 22, 2008, 02:28:51 AM
KK, quick on topic question for the christians... I get diffrent answers, and from what Ive read of the bible.....

KK, is Jesus Christ the lord...
or...
is GOD, the Almighty the lord...

there can only be one lord, so who is it? I cant see placeing christ first, but I can see placeing the almighty first... but then again due to the dogmas of the many cristian chruches Ive been banned or worse due to questions just like this so......... I guess I cant be Christian...

You can think if what we call the Trinity as different attributes of the one Almighty.  Its a difficult concept - one that theologians can easily spend a lifetime studying.

Chaunte

Quote from: Chaunte on February 22, 2008, 09:22:55 PM

Quote from: LynnER on February 22, 2008, 02:28:51 AM
KK, quick on topic question for the christians... I get diffrent answers, and from what Ive read of the bible.....

KK, is Jesus Christ the lord...
or...
is GOD, the Almighty the lord...

there can only be one lord, so who is it? I cant see placeing christ first, but I can see placeing the almighty first... but then again due to the dogmas of the many cristian chruches Ive been banned or worse due to questions just like this so......... I guess I cant be Christian...

You can think if what we call the Trinity as different attributes of the one Almighty.  Its a difficult concept - one that theologians can easily spend a lifetime studying.

Chaunte

I don't think it's a difficult concept at all, a clover has three leaves and it's still *one* clover. I believe this and other arguments were settled in the middle ages. In the end it just comes down to which version of what the three parts represent your denomination deems correct (which makes the others anathema by definition).

all Right  the last one sums it I guess fairly well 
All Right  were are you Frank? you got this started  I dont see your feed-back any more (LOL)
religon is like politects  there are so many different concepts to it
the one thing I do see is that in one form or another we all worship the same God
not to mention that I think that everyone is in agreement that God is not cursing or abonding us as most of society thinks   that we are doing something that is agnst Gods will
Funny though it looks like most of us have had some sort of teachings or a nother and I see that there are a few that have been through the school part and all
again were are you Frank you started this
take care all
Kristin

Kristin,

I'm just seeing what everyone's views are that answer. I really don't have much input beyond what I have already stated.

I do thank all who answered.

I have a lot to think over about spiritual matters. Many revolve around struggles with being TS and a Christian.
Sometimes events bring back bad memories and some of those memories may happen when we are in a rather conservative hard core church. I know this is a thread drift but the hell with it.

Today would have been my mother's birthday had she lived.

It's been 13 years but I never got over it. I guess the reason is because I was attending a Pentecostal church at the time and I was so f'n busy trying to "be a man" that I never allowed myself to mourn her death. Hell, even Jesus cried over the unbelief of Jerusalem and the sisters of Lazurus. But could I? No f'n way cause I was "a man" and holier than thou! I had to be strong for my sister and for a f'n church that didn't even have the f'n decency to come to the funeral home for visitation! And what did my brethren say when I went back to the church? That I was going straight to hell for letting my daughter wear pants! Some brotherly consoling! F'n hypocrits!!!!
I better end this. It got the best of me today.
May God bless.

Frank

Frank
My sorrow goes out for you on this day   I to lost my mother years ago (to cancer) and wasnt allowed to be there for her   in my situation it was her wishes  as she could not except me  for what I was   just as most of my life  I felt that I did not fit her stasquo in her church and was a empartsement for her in the past    I kicked my but for years that I couldnt be there for her  then I just learned to except that it was out of my control  the one thing that I can say is at least I was there for the funerl  and I did get to say my good by's then
I hope that all goes well for you and you are right that there is a lot of pain from the past for many of us
I am just thankfull that with help that I have learned to except the past for what it was   and the one thing  that I do pray for is  that one day I will be with her again  and we will be mother and daughter finaly
any way Frank you do take care of your self
and again I do feel sorrow for you and your lost on this day I know its hard on you
and please rember that no matter what God never walks away from us even when we push him away
that is what is called unconditional love
rember that there is ignorance in most people and churches that they cant even see past their own noses  and just as I have been condemd by my church as others have (none of us are alone in this) I stand stedfast in my beliefe that God does love me (no matter what) and that Jeasus did suffer and Die for all our sins
TTFN
Kristin

Quote from: Chaunte on February 20, 2008, 06:47:31 PM

I firmly believe that there is a reason why I am transgendered, besides any genetic reasoning.  If I am patient, it will be unveiled to me

Chaunte

In other posts I have mentioned that my parish is soon to close.  So, I have been looking for a new place to call my spiritual home.

Earlier this week, I brought the pastor at St. Mike's up to speed about my transition.  I told him via email prior to meeting face to face.  I felt that this would give him time to think about his response.

It was a good meeting.  Fr. Mark seems very accepting.  He has a lot of questions, but many of them are of the background-type.  He is going to be bringing the rest of the staff up to speed.  He is also going to bring in someone from a nearby Catholic univeristy whose son is now his daughter.

Also, I found out that ministry to the LGBT community is quietly restarting in my diocese, and the priest running this ministry is just down the road a few miles.  Fr. Mark is going to touch bases there to provide a resource for the parish.  When he told me about this ministry, which is not on the diocean website, I almost jumped out of my skin with excitement.  This could be another place to continue my ministry in music and liturgy.

The first thing I did walking out of that meeting was to give a simple prayer of thanks.  Maybe this is the venue for the ministry to which I feel called.

Chaunte

Kristin,
  I'm sorry to see that your mother couldn't accept you for who you are. Your circumstances are truly worse than mine. I hope that all works out for you.
  There are some out there who are taught that when they disagree with the views of others that they should part ways all together. That is sad.
  That is a lot of the trouble I go through. The self doubts and self condemnation. It makes for a roller-coaster ride of joy and pain and back to joy.
  We may not agree on all things but that doesn't mean that we should carry it over to hatred or shunning. It's not a good witness in Christ to shun a child. In my case it's not helping to hate myself because I was trying to live up to standards that later I would find impossible to hold.
  I wonder how many people I hurt trying to be something I'm not?
  For instance:
  When my mother laid on her death-bed I knew how to rebuke people for not following the parts of the law that I understood like any good pharisee but when she cried out in fear I didn't have one word of consolation to ease her final moments! And that is disgusting on my part!
  I decided after that from then on I would never have a part of the Bible that I would not understand even if I had to study day and night the rest of my life. My goal would be to be able to counter anything that a doctrine of man could throw at me. I'm still working on that.
  That church I attended made a pharisee out of me that even torments me to this day because while I was busy countering the doctrines of man I myself was not living in accordance with the word of God. The great hypocrit that could rebuke couldn't give his mother a word of hope in her last hours. He could quote scripture about Deuteronomy 22:5 but broke it in private. I even took it deeper to satisfy my own conscience. The spiritual things. Justify myself in what I was doing while hurting others.
  I had become so hard hearted I couldn't even mourn the loss of the one who gave birth to me. That wasn't being a man. Men don't cry. Bull!
  The truth is I miss her so much it's not funny and it felt good to cry my eyes out last night. From now on there won't be any more trying to please man over God.
  I guess in a sense that's why I started this thread. It's because deep, deep down I know that many people out there look at people and ridicule, judge or condemn without taking the time to really get to know the people or their thoughts and beliefs.
  On this very site we have transgenders that do believe in God and those who don't. On straight sites there are those who believe in God and those who don't. On straight Christian sites there are those who believe in God and those who don't. Not everyone that says they are a Christian really are one.
  I am probably doing a pathetic job of explaining this but it is something that has bothered me since I had to actually admit what I am, how I live and what I believe. And for me, Jesus is first. He is my life and without him I am nothing. My only desire to live another day is in the hopes that one day I may actually be able to say something that will open the eyes of my unsaved family members. Other than that I am ready to go to be with the Lord. I'm not suicidal. Just ready to go. Nothing in this world thrills me.
  I've rambled enough.
  I'm thankful for all who have answered.
  Also:

Chaunte,

  I hope that your music ministry works out.
 
  Frank

Quote from: Frank on February 19, 2008, 02:42:55 PM
The title about sums up the question for those here that are Christians. Does Christ come before being transsexual or anything else in your faith.
The reason I ask is because of what I have noticed among the straight Christians. It is very hard for me to enjoy their company because of the hypocrisy I see.
I have noticed that most straight Christians seem to keep him first until they have to give up anything such as pride, arogance or money. When anything that takes diligence or obedience is mentioned they soon get mad and show he's not really first and foremost in their life.
Some enjoy Christianity as long as the service is kept within an hour timeframe. Go beyond an hour and they're ready to hit the door. I personally like song services that are about 30-45 minutes long before the 45 minute message. When done right and the Spirit of God is felt a 1 1/2-2  service only seems like a few minutes.
This question is not to belittle or argue with anyone. It is for a personal observation in an area in which I am making a private study and don't expect my findings to agree with the mainstream church.

While the question is mainly for Christians that are saints that worship from the pew, I would be interested to see what some of the pastors, deacons, bishops and other ministers think as well.

Frank

Is Christ first in my faith?  Yes, He is my Lord and Saviour.

How do I keep Him first in my life?  I live by what I believe.  I put all I have been taught and all that I have learned on my own into practice everywhere, every day, all the time.  This is *piety,* the practical application of one's faith.

Do I get it right all the day, every time?  No, but I learn from my errors.  Not hurting other people is what counts.  I am learning to forgive those who have injured me but it ain't easy as I still have rage inside for a few.

Wing Walker
Simply Said

dear frank.... you are not alone.. i have gone through many similar circumstances. as a christian, while struggling with t/s, i found my self being very critical of myself and others... trying to follow "the law"... there were a lot of struggles between the law and the love... the wonderful thing is that t/s actually brought me out of the law mentality and into the love of christ. i am always amazed at how much love christ shows to sinners in the bible and how mad he got at the pharisees... the more i watched who he was mad at and who he loved the more i realized that it is all about the love... always in his presence i felt love from him and comfort with my t/s issues...  now, on the love side of christianity, it grieves my heart greatly to see all of the hate and injustice wrought on this fallen world instead of love.

at least our eyes have been opened.

my mother died on mother's day 2001 of a brain tumor. she died in my house with my brother and i present.. we were her care givers...  there was lots of crying.... i am still wrecked... 

hang in there.

love beth
   

Frank
I think that the latest posts show that none of us are alone and as I have said before we need to put our full trust in our Father in heaven  I know that it is hard to release the full trust in Him heck even today I still have trouble doing that   and as to not sheading a tear in the begining  I couldnt even do it then as now  I usto blame the world and yes I even blamed God   for the hell that I was tossed into
Rev 2 10/11  did have some answers for me   I think that most of us and what we have experienced and even now the negitivity of society are ready to go to the next world heck I know that I am ready  I do believe that there will not be the torment that we are experiencing here   I usto tear myself up because my famely outcasted me  but I guess I didnt relise what I had even when it was sitting under my nose  even my SO didnt believe my famely untill she saw it for herself when she tried to mend things I guess that is when we became the best of sisters   and in a way even I see the people here as a part of my famely  (hope) and also even as I sit here writting I think about my son and the hell that he has to endure with treatment for his Bone prolbem   it even helped me to quit wolling in my own pitty and relise that birth defects come in different ways and in his way he and I are not that much different  and I will try to teach him that even he is not alone that there are people in this world that even have it worse
than he does  its hard for me because each day he calls me daddy I do not look like a daddy (more a mom)  he doesnt see me as a man but as a woman  there are times that he comes to me when I am down and asks me to make myself perty again and he just picks me up  but I worry how this will affect hjim when he gets older will he condem me hate me or am I teaching him enough that he will understand  heck even will he understand that mommy and daddy dont even sleep togeather in the same room   and Frank I dont see it as my situation is worse than yours  (even though I do appreciate you saying it )   Beth thankyou for what you input you hit it   what Beth said is exactly what I feel   this world is in such missery and it needs to be healed  we have got to rember that the day of judgement is comming   that people will guess but none will know our life the next life just when we do not realy know   all I care is I feel that I am right with my Lord and Father in heaven and that he sent his son to die for all our sins and that the suffering that he incured I could never compair to what he suffered
you said that you have found non believers as well as believers were ever you go that is something that God has given us the independance to think the way we want I believe its called Free will  and one thing is that he doesnt push himself on me it is up to me to come to him   the one thing that I would like to see is people to quit judging others for their beliefe or what ever    I look at it as I have but one judge in my life  and that is my Fathe in Heaven
as for searching for answers I feel and I will not stop searching that the answers will be reviled to me on the day of my birth into his Kingdom and yes I think that then when it is revealed that I will then relise that it was right under my nose my whole time that I was searching I was just two blind to see it

well Frank I do wish you well and I hope that you do find that strength and peace to handel what life throws at you
and believe me when I say this it was good that you started this post it allowed myself to look at the picture of my faith again and see just what I was missing
take care of your self
Kristin

To answer the original question, no. He's last, and that's much more important.

I don't walk about constantly thinking of Christ. That's not the big deal. The main point is that I know that there is someone who loves me, and always will -- whatever I do or am. It's literally impossible to screw up so bad that it wouldn't be forgiven.

Every once in a while this prompts me to try to live up to it. That feels good, too, but I'm not required to do so or expected to succeed.

  Nfr

QuoteThe main point is that I know that there is someone who loves me, and always will -- whatever I do or am.

And hopefully that is yourself.

Quote from: lisagurl on February 26, 2008, 10:01:54 AM

QuoteThe main point is that I know that there is someone who loves me, and always will -- whatever I do or am.

And hopefully that is yourself.

Well, yes, most of the time, although I have slipped on occasion. It's good to keep in mind that 'love thy neighbour as thyself' isn't only about the neighbour.

Anyhow, the way I see it love is the big thing in christianity. God wants us to love and respect each other, but instead of bluntly commanding us to do that he tries to inspire us to it. Of course that is kind of tricky, since for whatever reason he doesn't take an active role in how the universe is run, and thus we can only take his word that he loves us. That's just the way faith is.

Then again, I don't think I would live any differently if I didn't believe in God. I do, though. So what?

  Nfr