Hey Merry Christmas everyone...i'm very depressed right now. Talked to my dad and he told me his real views on transgenders. Basically he thinks ->-bleeped-<- is a mental disorder, he apparently thinks homosexuality is a mental disorder too despite homosexuality being observed in animals which he seems ignorant to that fact. He deliberately believes that just because you have a penis, you're a guy regardless of how you feel or what your brain or inner soul might say otherwise or your hormones or chromosome anomalies or whatever else might declare you more towards being the opposite gender than just having your bodies genitals say you are this gender and leaving it at that. I cant tell him i'm a trans in light of this evidence that he thinks and believes these things that just confirms my doubts and suspicions that he may not accept me if i told him i was a trans woman. He really made my insecurities even worse after talking to him.

Who knows maybe being transgender is a mental condition or a disorder but not in a sense that it is an obsession with the opposite gender or a sexual perversion to be trans. I couldnt tell you honestly if its a mental disorder or not but its more than "just" feeling like a woman in a man's body or vice versa. That is easily the biggest misconception concerning us in particular to how we also act like a certain gender and have a natural inclination towards being that gender. It's not for seeking attention or a trend or fad or for fashion either like my dad seems to believe. Sure ->-bleeped-<- is a new thing at least the word is new but throughout time there have probably been transgender people in history and they couldnt undertake transitioning or surgery so nobody knew they were trans.

What are your thoughts? Sigh he needs to really get caught up and more informed about all the medical and scientific research about transgenders that has been conducted. His old fashioned views are debilitating and not completely accurate. It's also not a new gender to be trans, we realize there are only two genders.

Hugs...
Sheila

My dear, that is a TOUGH ONE. He will either change his views in time or he will not. I have friends that are almost John Birch conservative who accept me and have changed their opinions because they know me. On the other hand I have friends and family that claimed to be the most understanding individuals UNTIL it came home to them. My adopted mom and dad (long story) were of similar mind set to your father... but once I approached them and they have known me 35+ years they relooked at their thoughts.

I can only hope your dad comes around, if not it is his choice. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but family, friends and the general public are not required to accept us. Free will and free thought are a great thing. When I came out I fully expected to be shunned and rejected by most everyone I knew. I found acceptance where I expected rejection and hatred and rejection where I thought love and acceptance would be.

The situation that left me annoyed with self and happy at the same time was a chance bump into of my former MD. I was at a supermarket at the end of November and I heard a familiar voice I turned at it was my old doctor. I move off pretty quickly he was excuse me Miss? I hate to be forward and ask but do you have an older brother named Phillip? That caught me in an oh crap moment. I swallowed hard and siad no, why? He was well you look like you could be his sister and he fell of the planet a year ago. Doc and I had some frank talks prior to me not living a lie, we talked about insurance and covering GCS etc... He thought trans people were mentaly ill and would not treat them except for a referral. I said I get that time to time about being related to others. He said sorry for bothering me and walked away. Stupid me was yous should tell him the truth. I caught up and long story short, told him the truth, how I had felt forever etc... He stood and listened did not say a word and when he spoke he said "Margaret, why didn't you tell me?" I told him you woudl have thought I was crazy... He looked down at the floor and was that has changed in the past year, a family member whom I love has begun transistion and I have had to review my thoughts and feelings...." We sat and had a coffee and talked for about 30 minutes after that. He asked if I wanted to come back to his practice (I changed insurance and he is not covered) at the end he gave his personal cell # and asked if he could give me a hug. I took both willingly - So my dear maybe you will be fortunate and your father will come around. Sorry for menadering post just on pins and neeles prior to GCS and my focus is shot- 9 days to Vj-Day

Sheila, I feel your pain and anger too.  I had a similar experience with my dad.  I asked him what he thought of transgender people in the military and he went off saying they were only in the military so their care would be free.  He said it with such anger too.  Things like that start making the guilt and shame come back or make you think he might not be part of your life much longer.  I still came out to my dad via letter.  My sister had some conversations with him about trans people and it seemed like his views were softening.  After coming out we didn't speak for a week.  He's staying part of my life though.  He will never be supportive, but he's accepting.  I am surprised I got even that out of him.  So long story short, people surprise you.  As soon as it touches their doorstep, they have other feelings.

Bari Jo

Im sorry your dad gives you concern to worry, i hope it is unwarranted in the end and he learns to accept you as you are and changes his views


I never got to have the chat with my father, as he has long since passed away, but he always use to make me feel like being trans was wrong i guess, idk i think i maybe i became internally transphobic because of the little things he did that made me feel like he wouldnt accept me as Trans ie the way he told me i shouldnt use the little girls bathroom when i was a little kid, telling me im a boy and i should stand up to pee when i was a little kid etc etc, he always made me feel like he wouldnt accept me as trans, so i guess i started to not accept myself as trans

And mum is Asexual so i cant really talk to her about it too much, she still doesnt know that i feel like theres a 90% chance im transgender, but i feel like she might accept me, but ive kept it inside me for so long its leaving me hesitant to come out to her

Sheila, I would add that people who don't actually understand can still be accepting when they realize it involves someone important to them. Understanding is nice but not required for acceptance.

Not that I'm counting on this with respect to my own parent who's proved to be accepting of my gay cousin but behind his back is dismissive, homophobic. Hence I'm transitioned but taking advantage of not being passable to stay closeted to her.

I remember when Caitlyn Jenner came out. My dad mentioned it during a phone conversation and I could tell he was disgusted by it. Although I had not realized at the time that I was transgender, his reaction saddened me. My parents are in their mid-80's, so this is something relatively new to them, like a cell phone. I gave them one of those about 10 years ago. It is a flip phone. They only use it for occasional voice calls, text messages still baffle them. Hopefully when I come out to my parents in a few months it will educate them a little. It is easy to scoff at something you don't understand from a distance, but for a parent who raised you and has known you literally all of your life, I hope it will cause them to re-examine their views.

We never really know what type of response we will receive when we come out, which is what makes this such a scary, nerve-wracking experience. We can only hope love and true friendship will help them see through all of the misinformation and prejudice their vision has become clouded with over the years.

This life is the only one you have, you need to live it out in the way you are most comfortable with. Do not let those who don't understand get in your way. Try to gently educate them if possible, but don't allow them to be a roadblock in your journey. I wish you the best of luck.

If there's only two genders, why do some places allow a third gender? You're doing good, Sheila, but you still have much to learn too.

Hugs, Devlyn

I remember having a conversation about Transgender with my sister about 5 years ago. I had not yet opened up to her about being transgender, nor have I come out to her.

Her views were distorted by a lack of information.. As we talked, I let her know what I felt about the topic because of my experience with transgender friends, and I think I helped her view the subject from a different angle, maybe even persuaded her to readjust her preconceived ideas on a subject for which she had no personal experience.

I wish you the best Sheila, and hope that eventually your dad's opinion will change. I know how much family and their acceptance means.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Unfortunately this is a view from a lot of people. It is an old one that hangs on and we see it in our President as well. It is not considered a mental disorder at all. My brother is one of these that has this view. When I came out he told me "Being trans is a serious condition that can only be determined by a doctor and treated by one." It really pissed me off because I was like "I am not crazy or have some psychological thing they can treat with a Xanax." You won't be able to convince him otherwise but I can understand your reluctance to come out to him now.

Sheila,

(Hugs), it's hard when family says things like that (hugs).


Rowan

Quote from: hiddengirlsheila on December 26, 2017, 01:18:44 AM
Sigh he needs to really get caught up and more informed about all the medical and scientific research about transgenders that has been conducted. His old fashioned views are debilitating and not completely accurate. It's also not a new gender to be trans, we realize there are only two genders.

Hugs...
Sheila

Something tells me he would have no interest in learning about it, sweetie. Sadly, some people staunchly adhere to a rigid belief pattern because they're too afraid to acknowledge anything else. They do not like things which rock the boat, and make them question what they think they know. I have known many such folks in my life. And you could show them all the literature and information in the world but it's like the old saying "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink."

You use a word in your post which is very telling. "Deliberately." I think that's possibly very true. He chooses to believe these things. Maybe he actually knows that his beliefs are wrong, but they are all he has to hold on to. Like a piece of driftwood in roiling ocean of uncertainty. People do that. They hold onto something which gives them security. Something which they feel safe with.

I feel for you, deeply. My brother is the same way. To a much nastier degree.

I would hope that what Sadie said holds true, and that someone doesn't necessarily need to understand in order to accept someone. I hope for that with all my heart. I hope that his love for you would be stronger than everything.

But what I would say to you is: Sweetie... you have a choice. Do you want to live your dad's envisioned life for you, or do you want to live your life? His insecurities are not yours, okay? Your values, feelings and beliefs are not, and do not have to be the same as his. Just because he believes something... that does not make it true. You have to go with what you feel, and what you believe in life, Sheila. That's the only way any of us can really live our lives. Being true to ourselves. The second we try to live someone else's life, that's the second we are lost.

He does not feel what you feel. He doesn't see what you see. He is not you. You are you. How you feel matters. How you see yourself matters. Who you want to be matters. Whatever anyone else believes. Never forget that, okay? He doesn't see inside your heart, and your mind. Only you are able to do that. And what you feel is real. It's who you are. Don't let anyone make you question that because you might think they know better. They don't. You know best. You know who you are, who you want to be, and what you want from life.

For what it's worth, Sheila, I believe in you. *extra big hug*

If my stepdad can come around anyone can. Sometimes it takes time. Be you, and let them worry about what they think about it.

I had a similar thing happen a few years ago. There was a piece on the news and one of the people in the segment was transgendered, although the actual story had nothing to do with gender at all. She laughed and looked at me while pointing to the screen and said "She is a transgender!" Well, at least she got the pronoun correct. It seemed odd to call her "a transgender" to me. I didn't let on but I was hurt by that. It was about ten years ago. She is 86 now and I am 46. I wish I hadn't let her comment be part of why I waited so long to start transitioning.

Dad came home one day when I was visiting and was all upset that there was a show on the radio where the host was interviewing someone about a book...not sure who but the author was queer and the book was about lesbian, gay, and bisexual issues. My father was so irritated that he called NPR and threatened to stop donating if they kept playing "repulsive things like that" Woah....

SO, they are in their 80's and I am dealing with whether or not and how to tell them. Just started HRT on 12/6 so it will be awhile before I have any visually obvious changes. Not sure how I am going to address the issue with them. I hate to make them deal with this at their age, but I refuse to wait anymore.

I don't have any advice but I can tell you I'm in the same boat. I am wondering how to tell them as well as if I can hide it from them so they don't have to deal. I had a dream the other night that I was walking on a pond with very thin ice which started to crack. I have no plan on how to come out, I am just making it up as I go but what has changed from the closet is that I am making a real effort to seek my own approval for a change. There is no way to satisfy everyone in my life so I may as well try to satisfy myself. That's not to say I'm not anxious, I certainly am and my guess is that is what the dream was about...

I just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other I guess.

Sorry for the late response, been quite busy. Thank you for offering me all your support and advice everyone. I cant even tell my dad i'm bisexual let alone transgender, he would just say i'm gay but he says he would still love me and even cease from making gay jokes. He is a firm believer that there is only gay and straight people, that there is no such thing as being in between like being bisexual because he says you still prefer one gender over the other so you're still gay. Well i happen to be into both genders equally so am i still just written off as a gay person then? I couldnt be gay anyway since i'm trans and like men too but i guess i would be lesbian if i liked only girls. He says people were gay but decided to tell people they were bisexual so they could fit in and be cool and more accepted. That is not why i'm bisexual...so he really doesnt know what he is talking about. He puts transgenders and sexuality besides being straight in a box. It's rather delusional how he views some things which many people do share his views but they dont look into things more. I dont agree with his logic at all, it is problematic. He trivializes and disrespects transgenders and has a small tiny scope of the whole picture and truth about us. I guess he can be somewhat bigoted towards us. His system and method of thinking and his mindset needs to be changed and reevaluated like many other people who spew mockery towards us and judge us falsely. I mean its a matter of them contradicting all scientific and medical aspects to transgenders in favor of their misguided preconceptions too.

I dont know where my dad's preconceptions and assumptions stem from or the reasons for them, it seems very strange that he has such views and makes me wonder where they came from but they are obviously wrong, misleading, narrow minded, intolerant, stigmatizing, silly, and presumptuous. He also said in our difficult and grueling conversation that homosexuals have been "cured" of homosexuality by therapy. When did that ever happen? Has anyone heard of that before? What empirical scientific and medical data confirms and concludes that? That seems really farfetched and dubious because most homosexuals like being homosexual even though society may treat them poorly. My dad doesnt believe homosexuals choose to be gay though, he believes they are born like that but i still never heard of the notion of them being cured by therapy before and what is there to "cure" exactly anyway? Is being gay really a disease? Is it such a bad thing that someone is not straight? He says it like its a shameful, disgusting, and guilty thing to be gay even though he also says that its not a choice to be homosexual and you wouldnt choose something that would get you a lot of hate, humiliation, and bigotry.

I dont think i'm crazy or mentally deranged or depraved or morally corrupt for being bisexual and trans even though i am distressed, miserable, suffering, lost, scared, and feel ashamed, embarrassed and guilty about it as well as other complications i'm dealing with but i know that i should also rejoice because its who i am and i've got to learn to accept that so that way i can stay positive and be a stronger person mentally. I cant keep being oppressed and burdened. This is like a test and i wont let dad control my life and deprive me of who i am, i will be my own person. I've had natural inclinations to be the woman i am especially after i first realized it when i was young. I have a female brain. I'm more female oriented than male with most things that i do and feel, how i act and behave, my character, my personality, my emotions, the way i portray myself even pre transitioned and even the way i talk although on an internet forum everyone sounds the same for the most part and i've just been pretending to be male because of my dad but i've never been manly. Even my genitals dont feel like they belong there and incompatible with who i am. I believe my soul is female too. I cant be treated with an anti-depressant or something for anxiety and i cant be cured. I knew i was different than boys around my age in school and couldnt associate myself to how they were and described myself as just being different. Gender dysphoria is an inner struggle that something someone should have to eventually consider hormone treatment and transitioning and getting surgery to fix some damage other than just trying on another gender's clothing or wearing makeup, they got to really be that gender too and transitioning helps them pull it off from a physical appearance especially if they are uncomfortable with their body and they are not harmonious with it and it doesnt match who they are or their gender, want people to stop getting their gender wrong, and want to be more of the person they are inside on the outside too so they can live a more meaningful and genuine life but homosexuality and being transgender isnt merely an alternate lifestyle that we choose just because its "cool", its natural to who we are to be trans and we were born this way and werent influenced.

I dont like my dad's views one bit, they really upset me and hurt me and he also said you could look like a woman, talk like a woman, feel like a woman but if you're transgender you're still a guy. That really struck a nerve and hurt me but i just ignored what he said because he has no idea what he is saying, hes just recklessly speaking these things out of sheer ignorance and bias. I feel that if i told him i was trans and even after i go through transitioning with those kinds of views it seems he'd still regard me as a guy and still call me by male related terms and my male birth name which would be horrible. There is more than meets the eye like the transformers, transgenders are more than likely intersex in some ways as well as there is some evidence indicating we are intersex. My dad just makes his opinions as if they are fact which he can be arrogant sometimes. If i do tell him i'm a trans girl, i hope there wont be some big dramatic emotional fight. He calls me big "guy" a lot and i hate when he does it. Its hard to accept and cope with being considered a male by people when i'm not. I'm not even that big either, it might be because i'm not a little kid anymore that he calls me big. I just dont like being called a "guy". Of course i dont tell him that but i just ignore all the male references. It'll definitely be hard for him to realize he always had a daughter and instead of a son but its not like he never knew who i was, Sheila was always there with him even though i've been hiding who my real self is as if i have been wearing a mask out of caution of fearing the consequences of dad finding out i'm trans. I always revealed it to some degree in a vague way to where he doesnt know i am trans but hes said i've acted womanly and done things a woman would do before. He is going to have to accept the new me which was always the old me, just pre transitioned.

With my dad's frame of mind and perspective, he did make a voluntary choice to have whereas i didnt choose to be a transgender woman or bisexual. It was probably the way he was raised and conditioned by his peers and how society used to be back when he was young. I'm grateful society is no longer like that because he told me back then gays used to get beat up, antagonized, harassed, and physically assaulted and people didnt see a problem with that because of how people viewed gays back then and gay rights was low back then which some people still hold those views and denigrate gays. It seems like my dad even holds some of those views from the environment that he grew up in but he wouldnt hurt a gay person. I'll never adopt his views about gays and transgenders though.

I would like for him to change his views and reexamine them so he no longer is confused and tries to confuse or deceive me with his distorted views but that might not ever happen, he might not be interested for further analysis and research about transgenders if he doesnt know i am trans even if i do explain things to him about transgenders. He will just stubbornly preserve his views because he wouldnt want to admit they were wrong or that he doesnt want to step out of his little safety bubble or comfort zone so he might not be capable of letting go of some of his views that he has kept for such a long time. His reality differs from mine and i do not wish for his standard to become my standard even though he desires only the best for me besides how he might view me as a transgender. He doesnt have to understand me or what being transgender is about but i think accepting me in terms of still loving me would be good enough. It is almost impossible for most cis people to understand a trans person and what we experience and what it specifies to be trans and what it means. If he completely casts me away and out of his life then that would be sad. I dont want that to happen and be separated from him forever and never see him again because i am close to him even though it seems he might despise what i am or just believe i'm some maniac freak. I dont want to be anyone but myself and being trans and a genuine person as a woman, that's who i am and life is just better and more meaningful if i accept myself above everyone else. It it crucial that i do because I'll live much longer than my dad anyway, he wont be around to see me grow old. I have to handle things on my own and live freely because i have to live with myself longer than my dad will be alive and here on earth is the only chance i have to live how i want to. I dont need my dad's permission for everything like transitioning, all i need is money and to see if my insurance will cover anything. The money will come in due time, i'm not greedy and i'm patient at least sort of have patience but its tough sometimes when i know that i could have maybe already been transitioned by now if i had more courage. I just have to work hard for the money and save up and be frugal though.

I actually need to grow and try to be more independent and start being more responsible with my life because my dad is much too involved in it. My life doesnt revolve around my dad and what he hopes and expects me to do, i'm an adult who can make my own decisions. However, I rely on my dad for too many things even though i live alone and usually people are able to do what they want to do without it having much effect on if their parents accept or support them or not depending on if they can take care of themselves so one day i will be ready to transition, just not anytime soon unfortunately. My dad is hindering me from doing it right now but i will succeed with my goals and dreams in this journey i am on and be happier and more contented so right now i'm in a troubling situation but not forever. I am happy to know i am really a girl though and want to be more true to myself and follow my own path in life so i can also live a normal life as who i am. I will improve and get a better job too which is why i'm going to school to be a graphics designer. I am not sure if i will tell my dad i'm trans yet but he's going to know i am someday. Sorry i didnt intend to make such a long post, i just needed to get this off my chest.

Thank you for your inspiring words Sephirah. I will live life to the fullest being the woman i am. I'm still young, so i have lots of time.

I think it will be really difficult to change your dad's mind by discussion, but maybe after your transition he will gradually accept you and change his thoughts about that. at least you are in a place where you can discuss all of these issues with your family and people around you and there will be at least a possibility to agree with that or refuse.

Sheila, it sounds to me like you know yourself. You know what you want. And you know where you need to go in life.

I can't tell you how awesome that is, sweetie. And how proud I am of you. It takes a lot to examine things like you have. To really try and understand why you are the way you are, and why other people are the way they are.

I think you're going to be okay, hon. I think you're extremely emotionally aware and you have a great deal of strength inside you.

*extra big hug*

People can be unspeakably cruel when they think they can get away with it. Yes your father is a bigot and ignorant of what makes up natural variation in both gender and sexual preference.

You could read a lot of queer theory and argue every point with him, cite the scientific evidence etc and then again I don't think you'd change him (any more than I think he's likely to change you).

However based on what you've said about your appearance and affect, I wonder if he doesn't espouse all this crap because he's accurately reading you?

Anyhow, I think you need to consider the following. Decide whether it's safe to out yourself -- it sounds like he wouldn't be violent or anything but to what extent are you dependent on him for day to day survival?

And decide whether you need to move out / away before outing yourself. We all know it's corrosive to be surrounded by people who deny our existence, getting away or getting him to accept your reality seem like the only options?

The thing is that sometimes people find it easier to look down on people that are different than them until they know someone who is like that who they care about.

My great aunt used to bash gays left and right, until my cousin came out, and now she talks about how gays are still struggling with rights.

And one of my good friends from high school used to post a lot of anti-trans posts until I came as trans. Never seen one since, and he still talks to me like normal, and wants to meet up if I'm ever in the states.

I'm not saying your dad will be like this. I'm just saying that everyone reacts in a different way, and we live a society that easily pokes fun at anyone that is different than normal, whatever that is. You're not truly gonna know how he feels about it til you say something. All you can do is hope that he can look passed this and see the real you!

Quote from: hiddengirlsheila on December 26, 2017, 01:18:44 AM
Hey Merry Christmas everyone...i'm very depressed right now. Talked to my dad and he told me his real views on transgenders. Basically he thinks ->-bleeped-<- is a mental disorder, he apparently thinks homosexuality is a mental disorder too despite homosexuality being observed in animals which he seems ignorant to that fact. He deliberately believes that just because you have a penis, you're a guy regardless of how you feel or what your brain or inner soul might say otherwise or your hormones or chromosome anomalies or whatever else might declare you more towards being the opposite gender than just having your bodies genitals say you are this gender and leaving it at that. I cant tell him i'm a trans in light of this evidence that he thinks and believes these things that just confirms my doubts and suspicions that he may not accept me if i told him i was a trans woman. He really made my insecurities even worse after talking to him.

Who knows maybe being transgender is a mental condition or a disorder but not in a sense that it is an obsession with the opposite gender or a sexual perversion to be trans. I couldnt tell you honestly if its a mental disorder or not but its more than "just" feeling like a woman in a man's body or vice versa. That is easily the biggest misconception concerning us in particular to how we also act like a certain gender and have a natural inclination towards being that gender. It's not for seeking attention or a trend or fad or for fashion either like my dad seems to believe. Sure ->-bleeped-<- is a new thing at least the word is new but throughout time there have probably been transgender people in history and they couldnt undertake transitioning or surgery so nobody knew they were trans.

What are your thoughts? Sigh he needs to really get caught up and more informed about all the medical and scientific research about transgenders that has been conducted. His old fashioned views are debilitating and not completely accurate. It's also not a new gender to be trans, we realize there are only two genders.

Hugs...
Sheila

Don't you let that get you down. Maybe your fathers opinion changes with time. Actually on a facebook group i had to say there were like 88 genders or someting, to be accepted into that group.  So dont know about that two genders