From the Government guide Page 18.

What can I use my federal student loan money for?
You may use the money you receive only to pay for education expenses at the school that awarded your loan. Education expenses include such school charges as tuition, room and board, fees, books, supplies, equipment, dependent child care expenses, transportation, and rental or purchase of a personal computer. Talk to someone at the  financial aid ofice at your school if you need more details.

Quote from: Dena on January 13, 2018, 08:03:15 PM
From the Government guide Page 18.

What can I use my federal student loan money for?
You may use the money you receive only to pay for education expenses at the school that awarded your loan. Education expenses include such school charges as tuition, room and board, fees, books, supplies, equipment, dependent child care expenses, transportation, and rental or purchase of a personal computer. Talk to someone at the  financial aid ofice at your school if you need more details.

She did say she wasn't intending to use the actual loan money for FFS, just that the money her parents were giving her for tuition would go to FFS and she would take out a loan for the tuition. I think the bigger issue may be if she would qualify for the loan in the first place if accurately reporting the parental aid, rather than actually breaking any laws per the usage of the loan (since it would only be going to tuition).

One additional thing. You must demonstrate a financial need. This probably includes informing them of all money that will be paid by the parents. I suspect the loan won't be granted if the parents are willing to pick up all the educational cost. Failure to do so would be fraud and would result in cancelation of the loan.

I know when I applied for financial aid, a section of the form was bills paid on your behalf. My brother has money that is earmarked to help me out as needed and has paid bills on my behalf out of that. As such, I reported several thousand there, yet still qualified for full aid (which is well beyond simply qualifying for student loans). I am not sure what the cut off is on student loans, but I know it at least in the U.S. (I think she is Canada she said) the poverty line is the cut off for full aid from grants, which is something like 12k I think? And even then, after that it is just a proportional decrease not just a straight up all or none. As such, I can't imagine that the cut off for qualifying for loans is all that low (since they are considered a step "below" grants in aid), and she very well may qualify for enough of one regardless of accurately reporting parental aid on her behalf.

Quote from: Janes Groove on January 13, 2018, 03:47:45 PM
I'm not insinuating anything. I'm saying outright that what you are proposing to do is wrong.  Justify it any way you want.  But it is abuse of a Government program meant to help working class kids get an education so they don't have to live crappy lives.  As a taxpayer I resent paying money for your plastic surgery when you represent that you need it to get an education and then go turn around and spend it on optional plastic surgery.  It is intended for students to go to college and improve the lives of themselves, their families and their communities.  Plastic surgery is not a necessary expense to getting your education.  What you're suggesting is probably illegal as well.

It doesn't sound optional to me. It sounds like ffs is a necessary pre-requisite to the OP doing well at University. Doing a degree with bad mental health is basically impossible and will likely result in academic failure, and what then? It's only illegal if there are legally binding conditions as to how the money is spent. If you're angry that students have the right to spend loans how they want without having to answer to someone, aka, without institutional oversight and accountability, then that anger should be directed at said institutions and not individual students. 

Hey everyone,

Sorry the lack of presence, I've been super busy with school and what not!

For starters, Jane, when you say "you resent paying taxes for student loans": these loans have nothing to do with your taxes, they are completely private and from a bank. Also, I am Canadian, so unless you are a resident of Ontario, your tax dollars do nothing for me. Saying that FFS is "optional" and unnecessary is baffling coming from an older, fellow transwoman - I expected better from you to be honest. Some people who barely pass never want FFS, some of the most passable people around could want loads of FFS and resent waking up in the morning without it - whether it is optional or not is not for you to say. I pay loads of taxes for elderly programs, even thought no one in my family is elderly, and I do so without complaint. Also, again, I CLEARLY stated that the loan would go for actual tuition, and my parents would pay the FFS. I'm sure many of you are unfamiliar with professional school loans (I know I sure was) but your parents could be multimillionaires and you still qualify (most of the time). Why? Because my dental school will cost around 400,000 over 4 years. Yep, thats right, 400,000. And I have already been to the bank (last week) and have been fully approved of the loan, but the interest rates were horrifying (If I took out 50k, it was about $300/month in interest alone). So, I decided to use my own money for: rhinoplasty, jaw/chin shaving and adams apple shaving. I will get my forhead done down the line when I can support myself financially as a dentist.

Thank you

Quote from: JMJW on January 14, 2018, 12:12:27 AM
It doesn't sound optional to me. It sounds like ffs is a necessary pre-requisite to the OP doing well at University. Doing a degree with bad mental health is basically impossible and will likely result in academic failure, and what then? It's only illegal if there are legally binding conditions as to how the money is spent. If you're angry that students have the right to spend loans how they want without having to answer to someone, aka, without institutional oversight and accountability, then that anger should be directed at said institutions and not individual students.

Hi JMJW,

I could not have said it better myself. I almost committed suicide in my second year over my face and have lost numerous friends over my undergraduate studies because of my mental health issues. I'm on medication for it now, but it can only do so much. For me, FFS is a necessity and the fact that it's private and considered cosmetic, is the reason that people like Jane brush it off like it is nothing. If I said "I NEED SRS right now for my mental health, and wanted to use my loan money for it" I bet people like Jane wouldn't bat an eyelash, and say its a necessity. We need to shift this view that FFS is purely cosmetic and not as worthy as SRS to be considered as an essential transitioning component

Quote from: Dena on January 13, 2018, 10:52:39 PM
One additional thing. You must demonstrate a financial need. This probably includes informing them of all money that will be paid by the parents. I suspect the loan won't be granted if the parents are willing to pick up all the educational cost. Failure to do so would be fraud and would result in cancelation of the loan.

I was approved, as most professional school loans rarely get rejected

Quote from: Roll on January 13, 2018, 11:40:18 PM
I know when I applied for financial aid, a section of the form was bills paid on your behalf. My brother has money that is earmarked to help me out as needed and has paid bills on my behalf out of that. As such, I reported several thousand there, yet still qualified for full aid (which is well beyond simply qualifying for student loans). I am not sure what the cut off is on student loans, but I know it at least in the U.S. (I think she is Canada she said) the poverty line is the cut off for full aid from grants, which is something like 12k I think? And even then, after that it is just a proportional decrease not just a straight up all or none. As such, I can't imagine that the cut off for qualifying for loans is all that low (since they are considered a step "below" grants in aid), and she very well may qualify for enough of one regardless of accurately reporting parental aid on her behalf.

Yes, Canada is a lot more forgiving for loans than the states, and I have been approved for it, but decided against (for now) to use it. I have amazing credit, was already accepted and got scholarships, so they had no problem approving me

I'm glad to hear you are going to be able to get some procedures done even without the loan!

I'm going to say one thing extra though... You mentioned that you've had a number of psychological issues in regards to your face driving your need for FFS. Please just keep one thing in mind: It is common for people to get FFS or similar surgeries and then still see all the same problems and issues before the FFS, only this time with the added issue of having gone through the procedure and recovery for a not insignificant amount of money--even when in the eyes of everyone else it was an overwhelming success. Make sure you are approaching the situation as realistically as humanly possible, and don't expect it to be a magic cure for dysphoria in regards to your face (even with the full gamut of procedures). Countless perfectly gorgeous women, cis and trans alike, get lost down that rabbit hole. Make sure that in conjunction with the FFS you are doing everything you can on the therapeutic front to deal with your feelings and prepare yourself for possibly not having your expectations met. (Particularly since it can take a long time for things to finally settle, and as it occurs gradually you may not even realize there is a difference.) Having said that, the old adage applies... Prepare for the worst, but hope for the best. There's certainly no reason it can't be everything you dreamed and more, but it pays the keep the rest in mind.

Quote from: Roll on January 20, 2018, 03:24:54 PM
I'm glad to hear you are going to be able to get some procedures done even without the loan!

I'm going to say one thing extra though... You mentioned that you've had a number of psychological issues in regards to your face driving your need for FFS. Please just keep one thing in mind: It is common for people to get FFS or similar surgeries and then still see all the same problems and issues before the FFS, only this time with the added issue of having gone through the procedure and recovery for a not insignificant amount of money--even when in the eyes of everyone else it was an overwhelming success. Make sure you are approaching the situation as realistically as humanly possible, and don't expect it to be a magic cure for dysphoria in regards to your face (even with the full gamut of procedures). Countless perfectly gorgeous women, cis and trans alike, get lost down that rabbit hole. Make sure that in conjunction with the FFS you are doing everything you can on the therapeutic front to deal with your feelings and prepare yourself for possibly not having your expectations met. (Particularly since it can take a long time for things to finally settle, and as it occurs gradually you may not even realize there is a difference.) Having said that, the old adage applies... Prepare for the worst, but hope for the best. There's certainly no reason it can't be everything you dreamed and more, but it pays the keep the rest in mind.

Thank you so much for the advice!