So I have kind of vaguely danced around this one issue a lot because of how absurd it would sound, but I'm hitting a critical point in transition mentally and can't handle it anymore. There is one major thing tying me to being male that I just cannot get past. And it is tearing me apart.

I have been a huge fan of Legend of Zelda ever since my best friend got me Ocarina of Time for Christmas many years ago. I enjoyed the story, the gameplay, everything. But most of all, what I loved about this series was truly being able to see myself in the main character. Link and I do look very much alike, and the designers created the character as mainly a blank slate to fill in with your own personality. So I did. Link and I became more and more intertwined over time as I began seeing parallels to my life in the stories of the games, applying certain philosophical aspects of them to my own life, etc. I have even cosplaying Link at many conventions.

As I figured out more aspects of myself I simply integrated them into my version of Link. I realized I was probably mildly autistic? Well then Link must be mildly autistic too. After I came out as bisexual, I began viewing Link as bisexual as well.

This brings us to a rather obvious problem. I have now hit on the idea that I am transgender. And that I prefer being female over being male. And this is not something that I can treat like everything else. Applying that to Link is impossible as there is no "gender option" in the game. Link is clearly male. And to maintain the previously established connection, that would have to change. But it can't be changed. So therefore, I have no choice but to retain some identity as male, even if otherwise I'd rather not.

This must seem really silly to anyone reading this. After all, it's just a video game, right? And you can still be female and play a male character, right? Well, I tried that. Attempting to play while identifying and presenting female gave me such a sense of pain that I could feel it physically. It was as if something had been physically severed. Subsequent attempts led to me having to fight so hard to retain a sense of female identity that any enjoyment of the game was lost, and a sense of every bit of joy in it being gone, the experience being dead, and me just going through the motions. It seems it just isn't possible to have that kind of enjoyment as female because the connection is lost.

I have been dealing with the loss now by just not playing any of the games, but I look back and really wish I could play them, and feeling sad that I can't. Especially since life as female feels more vibrant, more exciting, and more joyful than life as male. There just is no way to integrate this one thing I really love into my identity as female, and it's driving me insane. I have been trying to think of any solution to this problem, even just find someone, anyone else who has gone through something similar, but no matter what I look for, it seems to me that nobody has ever had to deal with anything even remotely like this, ever.

So that's it. That's the one thing keeping me from jumping into transition. As stupid and silly as it may sound, it is very real and very frustrating to me. And I'm finally posting it here now because I'm getting to a point where I can't keep avoiding it anymore. Please let me know if there is anything that can be done or any way to deal with this.

A few other points:

Don't mention Linkle. She was a side character from one game that isn't even part of the series canon, and is thus irrelevant.

Don't point out that Link is androgynous. Androgynous and female are different things.

So, as a disclaimer, I'm coming at this from the perspective of a gamer who has considered myself non-binary from a young age. They didn't make video game protagonists with my gender back then. (Link was probably the closest mainstream option for the longest time, tbh, and like you said, he's still canonically male.) To this day non-binary protagonists are still almost non-existant, aside from the noxious dumpster fire that is the Undertale fandom. And so maybe I'm just missing some crucial element of the experience for those who are privileged enough to be able to grow up sharing a gender with their favorite characters.

But...can't you just headcanon Link as a closeted trans woman? Or even a cis woman disguised as a man for Reasons? That's basically what us enbies have been doing with him for decades.

Beyond that, consider that you don't necessarily have to treat Link, or any character, as a projection of yourself. He's actually pretty fleshed out at this point (albeit across multiple timelines and such), and even if he was still just a generic silent protagonist, that wouldn't mean you have to fill the blank spaces with your own personality. A lot of the time it's more fun to roleplay as a new, separate persona you've created, and, in cases where the protagonist is required to do some really evil stuff, probably more healthy as well. Link can be you in an alternate universe where you're a guy. Link can be entirely his own character. Whatever you want him to be.

That's generally how I've always handled these things as someone forced to connect with player characters through aspects other than gender. YMMV.

Well, I have good news.



Seriously though, I wear the gerudo outfit exclusively in Breath of the Wild. For obvious reasons. If you want Link to be on the trans spectrum, he can be. 'Cause honestly, spending 90% of some 150+ hours of gaming sort of makes a character trans in my book, even if a crossdresser and not transsexual like myself, and that is completely an option you have.

I can somewhat relate with your experience of playing Link, using my experience of reading novels (although, granted, my experience hasn't been as intense). In both, they are kind of like parallel lives and in both, if we don't admire the character(s), we won't feel like playing/reading and in both, if we relate with the character(s), we feel a sense of mourning when the game/novel is over.

Also, in both, when transitioning and being faced with letting go of some of attributes we share with the character(s), such as them being male, doing so can be difficult. However, there will always be some distance between us and others (fictional and real), and coming to terms with this and sometimes furthering the space by making positive changes in our lives, is necessary in order to find satisfaction our lives. 

im going to lose some geek cred for this, but i havent really played much of Zelda at all, any of the games, i was always more of a sony girl

Crash Bandicoot.... Final Fantasy, i never become that attatched to add my dysphoria to it, but i have been pretty obsessed with Squall Leonhart for some time i always sort of imagined if i was born a girl i would look somewhat like Rinoa

It sounds like it's causing issues of inhibition unless you can project everything about yourself onto an avatar of some kind. Try to develop your imagination.

If I allowed every aspect of femininity about myself or anything I might present as in life to irritate me, it would drive me up the wall. I have to accept that there are some aspects that intersect and nobody can be completely 100% this or that all of the time. Since doing that, I have become happier. It doesn't mean I have to be feminine, but it does mean I can sleep better at night.

Hey,
As a gamer and massive massive nerd have you considered the possibility of fanfic? Sure its not 'canon' however a lot of stories can be both entertaining and useful. With your relationship with Link it is quite special so maybe you could start your own fanfic where he's actually cloested?
I admit i dont know a lot about the Zelda stuff so this maybe hugely irrelevant for you, but when you think of it everything in entertainment can be turned into something that can suit you! For instance whos not to say that Original Mario wasnt trying to rescue princess peach but he was secretly wanting to wear her one of a kind pink dress?
Hope it helps,
Much love

I'm a huge gamer too and for me it's been a great way to express myself as a woman by playing a s female characters.  I think the fan fiction idea is great.  Write a story about Link as a female or your female self merging with Link somehow.  Or maybe you could think of Link as your male self, the strength to rescue yoir female self as represenTed by Zelda.  Or think of Link, Zelda, and you as the three points of the Triforce.

This is why I never played Legend of "Zelda". It's really the Legend of Link. He's the main player character, he's the one who does all the work, and she doesn't come across as much different to Princess Peach from Mario. 

I don't really get it but to me link has always looked quite girly.

I have never played Breath of the Wild and don't have a console that can play it.

I don't want to play a closeted trans woman or a woman pretending to be a man. I'm not closeted or pretending to be a man.

I have always played Link as me, and trying to see him as someone other than me hurts.

Quote from: VaxSpyder on January 18, 2018, 03:11:34 AM
Or think of Link, Zelda, and you as the three points of the Triforce.

I definitely don't want to be Ganon.

Quote from: CallMeKate on January 18, 2018, 05:45:49 AM
I don't really get it but to me link has always looked quite girly.

As I said,

Quote from: Jamie_06 on January 17, 2018, 09:54:07 PM
Don't point out that Link is androgynous. Androgynous and female are different things.

Also, it concerns me that apparently, absolutely nobody has had to deal with an issue like this before. Why is it only me?

Have you tried looking at Otherkin forums and stuff? I don't remotely believe what they believe, nor do I get the impression that you believe you literally are Link. But "I'm trans, how can I keep being kin?" is the closest thing I've had the um, privilege of witnessing with my own two eyes. If distancing yourself from a fictional character written by other people is a problem, then that community is probably the best place to find advice on how to deal with it other than "stop doing that."

Quote from: Jamie_06 on January 18, 2018, 07:55:34 AM
I have never played Breath of the Wild and don't have a console that can play it.

I don't want to play a closeted trans woman or a woman pretending to be a man. I'm not closeted or pretending to be a man.

I don't mean this to sound harsh, but... Link's story is not your story, and unless you are out there saving princesses and fighting moblins, it never has been. You drew individual parallels and related to the character, yes, and that's perfectly fine. That's the epitome of good art, which the Zelda series certainly is. But you have to recognize the simple truth that your stories were never 100%, probably not even 1%, the same to begin with. But I say this as a good thing! Because as such, you need to take into account the world that Link exists in as well. Looking back to history in our world, concepts like being a closeted trans woman did not exist. Though despite that there were certainly "men" who crossdressed and expressed themselves in a feminine manner(who today, armed with the concept, would declare they were a trans woman in a heart beat). In the world(s) of Hyrule, it is likely those cultural concepts don't exist either. Place yourself, not you as Link but yourself, in that same world. What would you do? How would you react to the feelings you have about being trans, when there is no name or concept to describe those feelings? That is what you should compare with/project onto Link, not the circumstances of this world.

(And I don't mean to assume you identify as a trans woman at all. Simply using that as the easy comparison since it was already brought up.)

Quote
Also, it concerns me that apparently, absolutely nobody has had to deal with an issue like this before. Why is it only me?

I've never heard of it in a trans context in this way before, but people definitely over associate with individual fictional characters all the time. (I don't mean to be too blunt with the phrase "over associate", or sound like I am judging at all, it's simply the appropriate terminology.) It's escapism at its finest, and escapism is one of the biggest (easiest and not always healthiest) coping methods out there, and god knows the people on this forum have had a lot to cope with. I've lived in fantasy worlds my entire life. Never one character, but definitely intricate worlds that would keep me up for hours just living the life I wanted to live. (That's stopped since starting transition funny enough.)

I would say the following however... (Use your judgment on this, but be honest with yourself.) If your association with a fictional character is strong enough that you would change your real life for the sake of it, or that it causes truly extreme distress to you, this needs to be brought up with a therapist, probably preferably a psychiatrist. You said you were mildly autistic, and this is quite possibly a facet of that, but it could also be indicative of something more that needs to be dealt with. Where your judgment comes in is just a matter of figuring out how severe this really is.  If you are playing it up in your head a bit and think you will get over it, don't worry about it. If it's bad enough you stay awake at night thinking about it or would even consider not transitioning because of it, that bears investigation from a professional. When you say things like it being severe enough "you can't handle it anymore", that is a red flag to me, and you owe it to yourself to do your due diligence on why this does bother you so much at a fundamental level (ie: Link is just an effect, you need to address the cause).

Think it is important that I share this because it may help everyone in regards to helping Jamie. Yes, Jamie is my spouse however is much for my own health I generally won't comment in these threads there are times when doing so will help others help her. As we know we all have those things that we used to help us through things and for Jamie, who is autistic, those things sometimes allow us to take on strengths or abilities that we wish we had especially when younger than 20. Jamie understands that Link is just a character and that isn't doesn't reflect on her gender, however at the sometime being able to see themselves in link as shown in the  games has gotten Jamie through many more difficult moments when they may have lacked the strength and or courage that Link embodies. So for Jamie it isn't as simple flipping a switch in regards to certain things with Link. We have spent intense hours working through this as is the therapist too now. Anyways I hope that helps. Hugs
Mariah

Yes, this was actually one of the first things I brought up with my therapist.

Oh, I just wanted to add one thing: This is absolutely not absurd, and you shouldn't feel that way. Rare? Perhaps. But then we're all rarities here.

This is not exactly the same, but similar concept of finding one's self attached to a fictional character... When I was about 17, I went through a period I just devoured a ton of comic books, going through decades worth of X-Men storylines methodically. Well, from when I was a little kid I always had a slight obsession with the character Shadowcat/Kitty Pryde. This only intensified while reading the comics. I had some trans stuff mixed up in it with wanting to be her I think in retrospect, but for the most part it was as if I was basically in love with a comic book character. So when I got to an issue of the X spinoff series Excalibur in which she lost her virginity to this one guy I hated... It... didn't sit right with me, at all. I was angry, jealous, and became outright depressed over it, as if I just caught an actual girlfriend cheating on me. I knew it was irrational, and I told myself that repeatedly, but I still couldn't help but feel the way I did. I had to stop reading for a while and cool off, switching gears entirely to doing other things than reading the comics for a coupe months. It really had an effect on me, and I still feel weird about it. I eventually got over it, but in a weird not exactly healthy way, and I viewed as like a bad breakup almost rather than coming to terms with she was just a fictional character. (Completely past that now, though I do still have a tendency to take writers messing with fictional characters in a way I don't like a little personally.)

But yeah. The human brain is strange in the best of circumstances. Toss the myriad of issues inherent to being trans into the mix, and it isn't absurd in the slightest that we seek identities in or form attachments to fictional characters, attempting to live outside the reality we feel or have at least at one point felt trapped in.

I understand that you have an internal conflict about two genders fighting each other. You want to be one, but can't leave the other to a side. So...instead of choosing, why not both? A lot of ancient cultures had two-spirits, people that felt they weren't just their physical gender and had both inside of them. Be a perfect mix of both. Like being a woman but prefere presenting as a male? Well, do it. Wear dresses, makeup and all that but still tell the world you are a man. Take the things that make you happy about being a woman and do them as a man.

Ellie I had the same X-Men fixation but for me it was Rogue!  I really related to her wishing I was beautiful and indestructible but also being afraid of human closeness.

https://zelda.gamepedia.com/Linkle

There's a canon female link, but she was scrapped at some point... She may have a return eventually as they move more into open world/sandbox game design.

Apparently she's considered non-canon because she's only been in a spin-off made by another studio, but she was designed by a writer for Nintendo before he left the company... I consider that Canon enough for me

Quote from: Jamie_06 on January 17, 2018, 09:54:07 PM
A few other points:

Don't mention Linkle. She was a side character from one game that isn't even part of the series canon, and is thus irrelevant.

Don't point out that Link is androgynous. Androgynous and female are different things.

Until she does end up getting her own Zelda title, she's not really that relevant to my situation. Mind you, I would love to play that game and there's no reason why the Spirit of the Hero couldn't be reincarnated as female at some point, but it just hasn't happened yet.