Quote from: Beyond on March 08, 2008, 07:48:33 AM
Quote from: Annwyn on March 08, 2008, 06:54:32 AM
I don't think that the definition of being a transsexual need include a desire for a genital alteration to become the other sex.
I think that such a view is biased and supports that gender is defined by the genitals.
I know, and plenty of you know, beautiful women who haven't had that operation, but are still women. And the same is true for FtMs, just much more often because we can't get any competant doctors on their side to come up with a good way to mess around with things down there.
So, I don't think you should have to have SRS to change your gender.
Just my two cents:-)
On the flip side, I think it's pretty messed up for women to be going to lady's restrooms and have extra assets that they shouldn't have and likewise with the men. I sure as hell wouldn't want a kid of mine, if I had one, sharing a private space with someone more capable of molesting her than anyone else in that room was. I think that's why the government has to have their rules or whatever, because of what COULD happen. People always run off fear these days.
Lol. I should make up my mind.
That is one strange post. I'm going to address the second part first. People in transition have to use the restroom, what's your problem. When you express what you did you sound like our detractors. The vast majoritty of folks who abuse children are non-transsexual heterosexual males. Such crimes by transgendered/treanssexual person are virtually unheard of. Having "extra assets" is part of transition for MtF's. Tell me do you feel FtM's are a danger because T makes them dangerous? Seriously, for MtF's HRT basically kills the male sex drive.
Now the rest, my 2 cents, that most people aren't going to like, is the following:
If you don't want surgery(MtF) then you're not a transsexual, you're transgendered. Yes there are a precious few who have valid medical reasons, but in my experience way too many people hide behind that as a reason. Personally I would still have surgery because that how strongly I feel about it and that's a defining characteristic of being transsexual. There are also people who choose to be "non-op". Again, I think if you choose that that means you are transgendered, not transsexual. The problem here is over the last decade people are trying to change the meaning of the word "transsexual". Why can't they just accept that they're transgendered?
In that vein I've seen various on-line transsexual support forums starting to be taken over by transgendered folks. I hate to say it, but Susan's transsexual board is like that. Too many transgendered folks invading the transsexual board.
Labels DO matter. A transsexual person (MtF) wants surgery. A transsexual person (MtF) wants the life they were denied, a woman's life. To live that life to it's fullest you have to have surgery. Until then there are many things you just can't experience. If you even have to ask what those experiences are, you're transgendered and that's okay.
Next, many will claim poverty. With Thailand offering MtF surgery for $5-10,000, no therapy, no problem, anybody should be able to afford that. You don't want the surgery, that's okay, you're transgendered and that's okay.
Next, many will claim that surgery isn't advanced enough. That is just an out and out lie. Surgery today is very good. You are simply transgendered and not transsexual, and that's okay.
I don't understand this fascination with claiming to be transsexual, when you are in fact transgendered. I don't accept this attempted to change the meaning of the word "transsexual". One thing I find particularly gauling is the origin of the word "transgendered". The term was coined by someone who was a full-time crossdresser. They didn't even claim to have ANY feelings of dysphoria, it was about the clothes. Further this person claimed transsexuals didn't exist! That person, who went by a female name, obviously doesn't speak for me.
Hi, Everyone,
Let's go back a few posts on this thread and remember that it dealt with changing the gender marker on one's driver's license and other identity papers to match their gender as they believe it to be, not necessasrily as it is on a birth certificate.
Please see
http://www.ts-symposium.org/Sounds like we may have met, Beyond.
FYI, the term "transgendered" was coined by one Virginia Prince who was a full-time cross-dresser, as you accurately noted.
There are those who are non-op because their bodies cannot tolerate the GRS. Some have had a castration and penectomy with the urethra moved to the normal position on the female body. To them a skirt and top does not a transsexual make. They have gone as far as they can and are not transgendered. Ask anyone who is in that situation and they will be most enlightening.
There are those who cannot pay for the full GRS and for that reason go as far as they can. They have every and all intent of being as close to their desired, non-birth gender as possible and they do what they can to be that way.
Transsexuals will move heaven and earth to be the gender they need to be, to make their bodies congruent with their hearts, souls, minds, personalities, views, etc.
Transgendered persons, in my sole opinion, have no desire to change their bodies because their bodies and minds are already in harmony. They need no changes except maybe whatever they wear in passing through their gender roles.
Sex may be defined by the genitals but gender goes much further and one's delight or dysphoria isn't solely determined by the appearance of the genitals. What of our brothers and sisters who are born xxy or xxxy? They might well be dysphoric by default and surgery could be their only recourse.
F to M persons may never get their surgery but I believe that it is in their hearts to make their bodies ***as congruent as possible.*** They have their reasons which likely don't include being able to call themselves transgendered.
Who am I to say such a thing? I sincerely, deeply, and greatly apologize to my F to M brothers but I wrote as I did to make my illustration of the TS continuum, and its difference from being transgendered as clear as I possibly could.
When ya get to the bottom line, it's the "bottom line" that makes the difference.
Humbly,
Wing Walker
Flying to GRS in July (I hope)
