I would not. Not the show and tell or activist type. I hate being the unicorn, but if I am, its cool, probably born into it, not my intention, but prefer not. Now, I can support others, through "live and let live, what has she/he done to you?, TGness naturally exists in nature, silent monetary support".

Just my environment is blue collar, 1st generation immigrants from Latin America and blue collar African Americans, so I prefer the "gray man" concept of survival and well-being, aka Southcentral L.A./Compton, CA.

Quote from: CallMeKatie on February 23, 2018, 01:33:13 AM
Nope but it's not due to fear. I can support anything,  even things I am not.

It's because I don't have pride in being trans.  This is something I've never understood.
I hate it! I need to upheave a huge part of my life just to be me. Where's the pride in that?

The pride is acknowledgment of that struggle, the pain, and hopefully after transition also the joy.

People got beaten on by cops, Stonewall, Compton's and of course just living their lives. Trans people are right at the center of the realization of queer liberation. The world is more accepting of us due to activism.

Not saying you gotta fly it, join etc, just saying why I have pride.

Quote from: HappyMoni on February 22, 2018, 06:36:28 PM
I was thinking about this today and I really have two different, opposing feelings on it.  What do you think? Why?

I'm curious what your conflicting feelings are Moni

My only objection to the trans flag is the color combination that I am not in love with and as I ponder that I'm seeing that my reticence is in part because it's always portrayed in pastel shades.

I've lately been pondering a triangle tattoo and in a really saturated, maybe iridescent copper blue over hot pink or dayglow pink ... Yeah I could rock that.

Maybe my inner ->-bleeped-<- is showing through ;-) flamboyant hasn't been my past forte bit maybe it's time to explore!

Yes I will and have. I wear trans/lgbtq-shirts mostly on special events only though. Two of them I bought at pride to support local groups. My truck has a bunch of trans and lgbtq stickers as well. I do have 3 shirts, but unfortunately they are wearing rather quikly. (just like the bumper stickers)

Slightly of topic,

I even have a T-shirt that I am not wearing but placed in a display case at home. It started with a joke, but my friends had it made and gave it to me. Its pretty pink and reads: "I got my vagina in North Carolina".

I've been thinking about getting a trans flag bumper sticker lately. I figure it'll count as part of my plan to slowly out myself, sort of a soft outing if you will.

Besides, worst case scenario, I can claim a neighborhood youth did it, in my area some kids occasionally go around and put stickers on people's cars. Someone a couple years ago put a Darth Vader sticker in the middle of the back window on my car (before it was mine). Took forever to scrape up off.

Quote from: CallMeKatie on February 23, 2018, 01:33:13 AM
Nope but it's not due to fear. I can support anything,  even things I am not.

It's because I don't have pride in being trans.  This is something I've never understood.
I hate it! I need to upheave a huge part of my life just to be me. Where's the pride in that?

I feel the same way. I can't feel pride in something that has caused me so much pain and ruined my life.

In the words of Randy Jackson: "It's a no from me, Dog"

LGBT flags and bumper stickers are not a good idea. Adam, a guy I work with is one of those super proud gay guys. He's even worn a T-shirt that says Drag-queen on it. Of course he had the gay flag and gay pride bumper stickers and even one on the back window of his car. There were so many incidents that he finally got smart and removed them. More than once a carfull of guys yelled slurs at him at stoplights. Another time someone threw a large soda at his driver side window. Another time he and his boy friend went to a movie and when they came out someone had written " ->-bleeped-<-s must die" and "->-bleeped-<-s burn in hell" on his front and back windows with permanent marker.

Why make yourself a target for hate?

Not proud nor ashamed but I do wear my trans ball cap pretty often. It's got a cute littl trans flag on the front of it. Most people don't even know what it is. But I do agree with Julia. Flying your freak flag can be hazardous to your health.

Quote from: Julia1996 on February 23, 2018, 07:21:01 AM
LGBT flags and bumper stickers are not a good idea.

... Hate and harassment skipped

Why make yourself a target for hate?

Why would you stay in a place where there are so many homophobes, transphobes? We move to places where we're valued, plain and simple.

Quote from: SadieBlake on February 23, 2018, 07:41:01 AM
Why would you stay in a place where there are so many homophobes, transphobes? We move to places where we're valued, plain and simple.

Because my family lives here and I just turned 20. I don't have the means to move somewhere else and I wouldn't want to leave my family anyway. LGBT phobic people aren't an issue for me because no one can tell I'm trans. That would change if I started flying flags and had bumper stickers. Why on earth would I ever do that??

Quote from: SadieBlake on February 23, 2018, 07:41:01 AM
Why would you stay in a place where there are so many homophobes, transphobes? We move to places where we're valued, plain and simple.

Valued? The truth is trans people have no value whatsoever to anyone except maybe to our loved ones. And I am not saying we don't have value but society doesn't think we do.

Quote from: Julia1996 on February 23, 2018, 07:55:05 AM
Valued? The truth is trans people have no value whatsoever to anyone except maybe to our loved ones. And I am not saying we don't have value but society doesn't think we do.

My being trans has no value to others, beyond giving them brownie points for inclusivity if they put up with me.

But my being authentic and happy as who I am (which happens to be trans) has a lot of value to a lot of people.  And, being an active volunteer in the community, most of my neighbours find a lot of value in this trans person, especially if their house is on fire or they have a heart attack.

We don't necessarily have value to others because of being trans, but we do have value as people, even when our trans-ness is known.

Home is a powerful tie for sure.  I really miss the closest thing I ever had to one growing up.

But anyway what's wrong with not being loud, proud, and vigorously waving the flag?  I say nothing.  No offense, but nobody is going to see the trans flag on your car/house/bicycle/pet animal/mailbox/whatever and suddenly gain an appreciation for our struggle just from gazing upon the glory that is a few pastel stripes.  (I'm totally with Sadie on the "why does it have to be pastel?" thing.)

If you like using the "hey what's that?" opportunities to educate people in a tactful manner, please continue doing so.  That's probably the best reason I can imagine for flying these symbols.


Now why don't I fly it?  Because it doesn't wholly define me as a person.  Was coming to terms with what I am an awful struggle for me?  Sure, but so was a bunch of other stuff I did. (and I don't fly flags to celebrate those either)  I am not defined by who I prefer to sleep with, nor what my original birth certificate said.  I don't bring it up, and honestly most people are completely clueless about it.  I don't seek attention for what I am. 

Quote from: Julia1996 on February 23, 2018, 07:21:01 AM
LGBT flags and bumper stickers are not a good idea. Adam, a guy I work with is one of those super proud gay guys. He's even worn a T-shirt that says Drag-queen on it. Of course he had the gay flag and gay pride bumper stickers and even one on the back window of his car. There were so many incidents that he finally got smart and removed them. More than once a carfull of guys yelled slurs at him at stoplights. Another time someone threw a large soda at his driver side window. Another time he and his boy friend went to a movie and when they came out someone had written " ->-bleeped-<-s must die" and "->-bleeped-<-s burn in hell" on his front and back windows with permanent marker.

Why make yourself a target for hate?

Don't bite the hand that feeds you. Without the flag wavers and bumper stickers you wouldn't be able to seek treatment and put your trans beast to rest at age 20. Without the activists there is no progress. You would do well to look past your sense of entitlement and see that.

Hugs, Devlyn

Quote from: Julia1996 on February 23, 2018, 07:55:05 AM
Valued? The truth is trans people have no value whatsoever to anyone except maybe to our loved ones. And I am not saying we don't have value but society doesn't think we do.

Sure and I'm not trying to negate your choices, I feel I know you a little bit and I admire you, you seem to know yourself and have a good heart.

However "society" is an abstraction built of individuals. I feel the admiration I've received from people in my life is mostly genuine and I'm trying to get better at accepting it as positive, not with second guess.

Two concrete examples: Yesterday immediately on boarding a crowded bus I shad.to stand (prefer to sit, it makes me less conspicuous). I was wearing my.nicer knit,. relatively conservative straight line black knot skirt and I stood opposite.a woman tastefully attired in mid priced designer outfit that she'd clearly put together for a good look.

There we were,.two women.of similar age. Before I had a chance to wonder if.she was judging me she smiled and did an assessment, looking me up.and down, taking in my worn and partly secondhand outfit. And then she gave a deeper smile and nodded quite subtly. Her affect said I'd been judged and passed. My attire was femme within my means.

It meant a lot to me. Every time that happens it makes up for the few hostile stares and frequent inquisitive looks 100-fold.

A similar and far more explicit assessment came from my therapist a few weeks ago she compared.my process to childbirth with intonation acknowledging that she felt my journey was harder. Coming from a woman who's had a child that felt like high praise. I compare my several months recovery to recovering with responsibility for a newborn and would have said her road sounded harder but that's not the point.

Have no doubt, some people absolutely appreciate us.

As to where you live, sure if you have passing privilege there's no reason you need to leave and to be clear my comment wasn't suggesting that you need to rather that's why some choose to.

Quote from: Devlyn Marie on February 23, 2018, 08:35:52 AM
Don't bite the hand that feeds you. Without the flag wavers and bumper stickers you wouldn't be able to seek treatment and put your trans beast to rest at age 20. Without the activists there is no progress. You would do well to look past your sense of entitlement and see that.

Hugs, Devlyn

I don't have a sense of entitlement. Why would you think that?

I would have moved if I had to, I did in a way. Not far but far enough that no one knows and I am accepted at face value. Here is where my life is, my friends and family and I don't want to live anywhere else if I don't have to.

Sacrifice.

I have anonymity, it's wonderful. I had it before I transitioned I guess but it meant nothing to me then, it certainly does now. Who would have thought that something that most people take for granted could be so valuable. I am probably delusional and don't pass at all but it seems that I do and I don't want lose that.

Sacrifice.

I lived in fear for a while, the fear hasn't gone away completely but it is no longer incapacitating. With the kind of fear I had, I lost myself to it, every aspect of my life was ruled by it. How can I live like that? I don't want to go back to living that way.

Sacrifice.

Isn't that it? Sacrifice? That is what displaying or advertising my transsexualness would be, sacrifice. The fact that so many are willing to make those sacrifices is commendable, I have a ton of admiration for that, I chose not to. Even if it makes me less of a person.

Yet another good thread that went astray. If people are happy and not hurting anyone else, why try to hold them to our standards? Enjoy the diversity instead of validating our choices by asking everyone else to take the same path. The question was a choice, not a choice between good and evil, but a life choice about where we are comfortable.

🙂 It definitely made me think it through, thank you Moni.

Quote from: FinallyMichelle on February 23, 2018, 09:09:54 AM
Even if it makes me less of a person.

Yet another good thread that went astray.

I would certainly never think less of you and in fact knowing I have so many sisters living happily accepted as female. You lend me your strength and believe me when I say I need it. When I catch an unfriendly or too-inquisitive glance you can bet that part of my internal response is the sure knowledge that a bigot has no idea some other strong woman they know is trans. That woman is probably just like me in many respects except for passability.

This thread is fine, gave me the opportunity to express that ^^

I don't know why there is such a divide and hostility from some whenever the question of being openly trans or not is discussed. If some people want to be openly and proudly trans that's totally fine. And if some like me want to be stealth that's fine also. People have different ideas and opinions regarding stealth and they are totally entitled to them. I don't think it's wrong for someone to be proud of being trans at all. All that matters is they are happy. I'm not ashamed of being trans but I'm also not proud of it and I don't want to be known as a transwoman. I believe that being a transwoman equals being not a real woman or an imitation in the minds of most CIS people. But that's just my opinion.

I also don't have a sense of entitlement as was implied. I realize that I've been extremely lucky that I have a lot of support from my family. And I know I'm lucky that I am able to pass easily. But I don't feel in any way entitled to those things. I'm extremely lucky to have them and I'm very thankful. I also would never think I'm better or more trans than any trans person. Ever. We all face the same hardships and problems and no one is better than anyone else. I just feel that some people here think because I started young and have had it a lot easier than some people here that my problems aren't really imporant or even valid. I haven't had the same problems many of you have but I've had my share of painful experiences. My life hasn't been a picnic. Yes I started young but I paid a heavy price for that every single day I went to school. I also know a couple of the members here view me as snotty, spoiled and with a sense of entitlement.  I am absolutely not any of those things and it really upsets me that anyone would think I am.