First off, I'm sorry in advance for the tone of this post - I know it's a downer. It's just that I'm in a tricky spot right now and am questioning lots of stuff. Probably every single one of the things that I'm questioning has been questioned before by everyone else here. Maybe someone can tell me what they've learned from their experiences.

Before I start, I'll give you a quick mini tour of my situation: I'm 38 and married with 2 young children. I won't go into all the details, but in one way or another I've been fighting a nagging/clawing feeling since I was at least 4 or 5 that I should have been born a girl. There's a lot behind that statement, but again, I'll leave it at that for now. Amazingly, I allowed (or forced) myself to deny it until one day about a year ago when the realty that I've been struggling with this my whole life came crashing down on me. The last year has been very rough. Initially, I thought it would all go away. And, I guess I'm still hoping it will. The truth is, it seems to be getting worse.

My wife still doesn't know about any of this. Prior to last year, she really couldn't have because I wasn't even letting myself think about it. Since then, it's been a combination of things: I keep hoping it will go away, I keep waiting to feel ok with it myself and/or to have a plan about what to do before I talk to her.

I went to see a gender therapist about 4 or 5 months ago and went through my whole history and story with her. I was hoping she would tell me that this is all in my head, is stress related, a mid-life crisis, a crazy fetish, is "normal", it will go away etc. etc..  I saw her twice and realized at the end of the second session that she wasn't going to say any of this about me. I got scared and stopped going.

Now I feel paralyzed and that's left me in this strange sort of limbo.

Deep inside my thoughts and feelings I probably already know what I want. But, I'm so used to running from, hiding from and protecting myself from these thoughts and feelings that even now I'm still denying myself the freedom to accept them and act on them. But, I also know that I have other equally important people and things to consider like my wife, kids, family and life. Really and honestly I want to get back to dealing with this in a productive way by telling my wife and getting back to my therapist. BUT, I equally want to leave it alone and have it leave me alone until it either goes away completely or I'm convinced I have to do something about it.

It seems like a general theme that I've seen over and over again on websites and forums is that GID doesn't go away on its own, it usually gets stronger and eventually if you are truly suffering from it you will have to do something about it. My therapist said as much to me as well. I keep hoping to find something or someone who says otherwise, but I haven't yet. Add to this the fact that it feels like an unseen force is pulling at me and it all seems so inevitable. For someone like me who is stubborn, thinks too much and is used to denying all of this about myself this sense of inevitably is hard to take. I think the potential loss of control is freaking me out.

My question is: if I tell my wife and get started again with the therapist am I going to be on the inevitable path toward transition? I know that is being dramatic, but honestly, that's how it feels. And, on the other hand, if I don't work this out now am I inevitably doomed to do so years from now only then as an older and more miserable person? Do I have any control over this?

Quote from: Ella~ on March 08, 2008, 03:02:09 PM
It seems like a general theme that I've seen over and over again on websites and forums is that GID doesn't go away on its own, it usually gets stronger and eventually if you are truly suffering from it you will have to do something about it. My therapist said as much to me as well. I keep hoping to find something or someone who says otherwise, but I haven't yet.

I'm really good at "getting to the bottom" of things (aka: obsessive and stubborn), so I finally got fed up with this... whatever it is... and decided to just SOLVE it, to once and for all expose it for the mental quirk I was sure it was. After all, everything else I've attacked yielded it's secrets sooner or later, so I knew if I just kept after it, I could finally "explain" this GID thing and be done with it.

In the end, I just exposed the truth of it all. Or well, at least I saw MY truth. Clearly. Painfully. And then... well, there was nothing else to do but transition. It's like exposing Santa Claus: once you do, you can't go back to believing in that fantasy anymore. It's over. There's nothing to do but move on.

QuoteAdd to this the fact that it feels like an unseen force is pulling at me and it all seems so inevitable. For someone like me who is stubborn, thinks too much and is used to denying all of this about myself this sense of inevitably is hard to take. I think the potential loss of control is freaking me out.

TELL me about it. I've sorta wrapped the whole thing into a personal mythology about Fate and Destiny guiding (shoving forcefully) me along. And the weird thing I've found is, when you finally surrender to your fate, when you finally give up that "control," you realize that your "fate" is what you wanted all along anyway. Everything suddenly "clicks," and it's like you can do no wrong as long as you stay on your particular path.

I don't know if transition is inevitable for everyone. I do know that for some, once that truth is out, once they SEE who they are... there just doesn't seem to be anything else to do. Transition isn't so much a decision as it is a *consequence* of seeing and accepting What Is.

~Kate~

Going along this path doesn't necessarily lead to transition - it leads to knowledge of self though. Perhaps you will be happy expressing your feminimity as a crossdresser, perhaps you will end up needing to go all the way and transition. You don't really know that until you explore your feelings and memories.

The fear of telling your family is understandable, and not unjustified. Sadly, many people simply cannot accept such a shift of paradigm, and reject you. Others accept but drift away, yet others just need some time, but come back in the end.

Ultimately though, you have to make one simple decision - live for yourself, or make others happy. And that's a loaded trick question. I lived to please others for 20 years, but what I realised eventually is that, unless I am true to myself first, I will never make others happy, because I will always be miserable, and I will project the sadness, or I will blame them, or I will this, or that. Only when you love yourself can you really love somebody else. What I found with my own situation was that the love I felt for others before I accepted myself was a neediness, a need to validate myself through others.

Granted though, my situation was simpler. I am only 29 today, and have fewer commitments. But ask yourself this: Do you wish to keep this from the ones you love because you want to protect them, or because you are simply scared of losing them? The younger children are, the easier it is for them to accept these changes. As to your wife, it will be difficult for her, perhaps moreso than she can bear, but somewhere you have to choose the lesser of evils, whichever they may be. You have some degree of GID, and that will colour your relationship - do you hurt her now, a clean wound she can move past easily, or do you keep living the lie, and make the hurt later that much worse.

That was the question I asked when I made the decision to divorce my wife. I knew I was being a coward and hurting her terribly, but I knew it would be worse if I stayed.

For now though, explore yourself. Keep a journal, diary your dreams and your memories, see a therapist, read some philosophy and psychology and stuff. Your path will become clear to you eventually, but you don't need to jump the gun just yet.

And finally, good luck hon.

QuoteI'm really good at "getting to the bottom" of things (aka: obsessive and stubborn), so I finally got fed up with this... whatever it is... and decided to just SOLVE it, to once and for all expose it for the mental quirk I was sure it was. After all, everything else I've attacked yielded it's secrets sooner or later, so I knew if I just kept after it, I could finally "explain" this GID thing and be done with it.

In the end, I just exposed the truth of it all. Or well, at least I saw MY truth. Clearly. Painfully. And then... well, there was nothing else to do but transition. It's like exposing Santa Claus: once you do, you can't go back to believing in that fantasy anymore. It's over. There's nothing to do but move on.

Well...I eventually did get over learning the truth about Santa. It wasn't a happy revelation though 

Maybe it's because I've only been picking at GID's lock for a year, or maybe it's because I'm so stubborn. I just can't yet accept it as fact that GID can be the absolute and immoveable force that it appears to be or that people make it out to be. I have a feeling, though, this might be one of the first things I have to yield to.

QuoteTELL me about it. I've sorta wrapped the whole thing into a personal mythology about Fate and Destiny guiding (shoving forcefully) me along. And the weird thing I've found is, when you finally surrender to your fate, when you finally give up that "control," you realize that your "fate" is what you wanted all along anyway. Everything suddenly "clicks," and it's like you can do no wrong as long as you stay on your particular path.

I don't know if transition is inevitable for everyone. I do know that for some, once that truth is out, once they SEE who they are... there just doesn't seem to be anything else to do. Transition isn't so much a decision as it is a *consequence* of seeing and accepting What Is.

When I was younger I read a lot of philosophy and mythology. One of my favorites was Joseph Campbell and what you wrote reminded me of him. Here's a quote from him in response to being helped by unseen hands: "...I even have a superstition that has grown on me as a result of invisible hands coming all the time - namely, that if you do follow your bliss you put yourself on a kind of track that has been there all the while, waiting for you, and the life that you ought to be living is the one you are living. When you can see that, you begin to meet people who are in your field of bliss, and they open doors to you. I say, follow your bliss and don't be afraid, and doors will open where you didn't know they were going to be."

Now, I'm not sure if I see this as my "bliss" at this point in time. And, while I've always been guided by the kind of thinking that Campbell taught, I'm having a hard time applying it to my situation now at this moment. Really, this has been the hardest time of my life and I think that fear has been more in control than anything else. In the end, this kind of thing will help get me out of my mess and on the right path - wherever it goes. Right now though the internal battle rages on for me.

Thanks for the reply Kate.

QuoteUltimately though, you have to make one simple decision - live for yourself, or make others happy. And that's a loaded trick question. I lived to please others for 20 years, but what I realised eventually is that, unless I am true to myself first, I will never make others happy, because I will always be miserable, and I will project the sadness, or I will blame them, or I will this, or that. Only when you love yourself can you really love somebody else. What I found with my own situation was that the love I felt for others before I accepted myself was a neediness, a need to validate myself through others.

Granted though, my situation was simpler. I am only 29 today, and have fewer commitments. But ask yourself this: Do you wish to keep this from the ones you love because you want to protect them, or because you are simply scared of losing them? The younger children are, the easier it is for them to accept these changes. As to your wife, it will be difficult for her, perhaps moreso than she can bear, but somewhere you have to choose the lesser of evils, whichever they may be. You have some degree of GID, and that will colour your relationship - do you hurt her now, a clean wound she can move past easily, or do you keep living the lie, and make the hurt later that much worse.

Very good questions lady amarant. I am absolutely trying to protect others at this point, especially my wife. And, it's equally true that I'm afraid of the loss I might experience if I go even one step further on the path.

This really is *hard*. I wish I wasn't such a coward.

Quote from: Ella~ on March 08, 2008, 04:55:35 PM
This really is *hard*. I wish I wasn't such a coward.

You're no coward dear-heart. GID is, in my humble opinion, one of the most destructive, devastating things we can be saddled with. Which means it's also one of the greatest opportunities for growth, but just by confronting these questions, you are already showing much more bravery than most other people on the planet. It takes a while to sort these things out, and that's as it should be. Take your time to get to know yourself and determine the way forward. There will be PLENTY of time to run later on.

I can't really add much as lady amarant has covered the subject so well and objectively..

Quote from: lady amarant on March 08, 2008, 11:44:21 PM

Quote from: Ella~ on March 08, 2008, 04:55:35 PM
This really is *hard*. I wish I wasn't such a coward.

You're no coward dear-heart. GID is, in my humble opinion, one of the most destructive, devastating things we can be saddled with. Which means it's also one of the greatest opportunities for growth, but just by confronting these questions, you are already showing much more bravery than most other people on the planet. It takes a while to sort these things out, and that's as it should be. Take your time to get to know yourself and determine the way forward. There will be PLENTY of time to run later on.

Hello, Ella,

I can add but one thing to what everyone has written:  Campbell was right about bliss and IMHO, bliss is being who you were born to be.  It took me until I was 51 to fix what I suspected at age 5 and knew at age 9.

I'll be here with the rest of the group to help you in any way I can.  I recommend that you continue to visit your gender therapist at least monthly.

Wing Walker
Flying the Path

Ella
Wing Walker said it keep up the theripy this is two much for any one person to handel (expecialy on your own) and no matter how hard we try  (as lady amarant said) it will never go away  it does no good to continue to try to eather ignor or deny what is there.  its like putting a bandage on a cut artery. (lost battle) who knows you might find out something that you didnt relise.  I too waited and keep denying for too many years then I was pushed and I am glad I did   I personaly feel better and more at peace with myself and how I think about things now (i also have loses).  one thing I can say and please dont take me wrong   the rollercoster ride is about to get wild (enjoy it)   as for what you might loose I know I also had to faice the same  you will be blamed for destroying famely's    for once in your life you have to be true to your self  your are talking about your health and welfare (the most important thing in your life) you will be told that you are selfish  (in relity you are not)  you will be given all sort of guilt trips dont let them take ahold of you   look at how long you have sufferd through out your life trying to change except hide the list can go on   yes it is hard it hasnt been easy for many of us  you just need to rember that you do have a famely brothers and sisters we (most all) understand what you are dealing with and it has been said we are here for you
good luck
TTFN
Kristin

Ella,

Yes, you are opening Pandora's box.  Yes, you will make many people unhappy.

But you should discuss it with your wife.  Be honest with her and tell her that you still love her. Tell her that you don't understand this and do not know where it will lead.  She deserves to know right away so that she too can take some control for the rest of her life.  Keeping this from her is unfair to her.  You may find out that just letting this out to her may provide the release valve you need.  Perhaps she will understand, still love you, and that will be it.  It's hard to say.

Being "blessed" with GID does not mean that you'll head down the road to hormones, hair removal, and gender reassignment surgery.  But it might.  You will need to establish just how much control you have over these urges and share it with your family or wife. 

This may destroy your family.  It may not.  Chances are very good these days that you'll be able to work through it all.  But be prepared for the worst.

I went through all of this many years ago.  It was tough.  I wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I have no regrets for the decisions (not choices) I had to make.  I made the best of what I was given to work with.

There are many members of this forum who are going through these things.  You'll always have a place to come to share a story or a virtual shoulder to cry on.

My best to you.

Cindi

Quote from: Ella~ on March 08, 2008, 03:02:09 PM
My question is: if I tell my wife and get started again with the therapist am I going to be on the inevitable path toward transition? I know that is being dramatic, but honestly, that's how it feels. And, on the other hand, if I don't work this out now am I inevitably doomed to do so years from now only then as an older and more miserable person? Do I have any control over this?

If you tell her it will likely be very hard for the next few months for both of you, and it may destroy your marriage. On the other hand, if you do not tell her it might be easier in the short term, but eventually it will burst out and destroy everything. The longer you keep this to yourself, the worse the pressure will get. If you keep it in long enough, eventually you will get to the point where you either break completely or transition. If, on the other hand, you start working things out now you have some control over what happens.

What you describe sounds much like where I was a year ago, only I told my wife before starting therapy. That was the hardest thing I've ever done, and it took several months before we got back into something like a normal relationship and started worrying constantly about the other walking away in search of a new husband. We've got over the worst scares now, but there are still issues to work out.

Part of the process for me was realising that GID does not necessarily have to lead to transition. That my less than stellar success in a male role and my wish for a female body do not necessarily mean that I'd be happier than I am now if I transitioned. In a sense, transition is an easy answer in that it is the path you mostly hear about, but whether it is right for you is not as self-evident.

For me it was useful to split the sex/gender complex into smaller parts. That made it possible to consider which of those parts were important to me -- and also which parts were important to my wife. By now I'm reasonably confident that the list of what I need to do does not include things my wife cannot accept, and that keeping my relationship with her is more important than some of the major things I'd want to do. This is a very good feeling.

There are three things that made it possible for me to come to these conclusions. First, I've talked with my wife openly about these issues. Second, therapy has been a help in digging out what exactly is important to me. And third, this place has been an immense help in both clearing my thoughts and in realising that there are other options besides transition and misery.

In short, there's no use trying to stay where you are. The best you can do is to steer your path into a direction that is acceptable to you -- and the earlier you start doing that the better off you are. Good luck, to all four of you.

  Nfr

Ask and ye shall receive... You have all given me a lot to think about. Thank you for taking the time to write such thoughtful responses.

It has been a rough week for me, no doubt about that. But, I might need days like this to help me break through my impasse. One thing I'm beginning to realize is that I somehow let myself slip into a second wave of denial about this right after coming out of my first big denial last year. The first denial was my refusal/inability to acknowledge that I've struggled with my gender identity all my life. That denial has been gone for about a year. Since then, I've been in denial about the fact that I WILL have to do something about it - it isn't just going to go away on its own easy breezy. This denial has kept me from pain of a certain kind - I don't need to tell my wife, I don't need to see this therapist again etc. But, it's made a new kind of pain. If balloons had feelings, it might be what they feel like when they've been filled with too much air and are about to pop. So, my new denial has sparred me one kind of pain and left me with another.

One more thing: I realize that I already am on the path. There is no stepping on it. Someone dumped me off here at birth. I also realize that I really have no idea where it will go. Lately I've been thinking I do, but really I don't. It will likely lead wherever I really want it to go, even if I only really know where that is deep down inside. The outcome of all of this might be inevitable, but it doesn't have to be ~inevitable~ (if you know what I mean).

I'm trying to give myself a pep talk here. I'm getting tired of living life in this fog. I have some important people to talk to. I just need to get the nerve to do it.

when I started I had no idea and yes I had a lot and I mean a lot of fear  I guess in a way I was lucky that I lost a wife but gained a sister I lost my famely  but gained a new famely but as my SO told me it will be like wiping the slate clean and starting a new life she saw me try to fight it and I would and could not ever win. it keep taking ahold of me.  as Seshatneferw was saying it will be like a preasure cooker it will continue to build your atitude will get worse  this is why theripy is so important
you first need to make shure that you eather have or dont have GID or were you are.  you will need to be evaluated this will tell you were to start and leed you to what you need to do  writting a jornel helps you and your theripest to come to understand your self and what you have been through in your life not to mention what yu will learn about your self
I did loose a wife and I will testify that it was not easy expecialy when she started dating  to see her with another man (a man that I wasnt) a man that could satify her in ways that I no longer could. but ( and this is were I was lucky)as  we went on I relised that she had needs that I couldnt satify and she was not Lez. so I had to except but we had a life bond that keep us connected. not as spouces but as sisters.  we learned in a way that we went through simular abuce through out our lives as we couminicated (that is the key word) she did a lot of recearch and found out that this is not a sickness but a birth defect. she went through the guilt that she did something wrong  the hurt that she was decieved lied to  the feeling that I was a sick F$%^  then when she learned more she started to understand. we both started to understand.  then we both understood what needed to be done  and we took the proper steps
this will not be the outcome for everyone it will take two people that can be honest and the want and ability to learn about not just ourselfs but each other.  you both have to be willing to learn just as she will and dont ask to share her clothes get your own  she will feel invaded like she has no privicy like she is just there for the clothes for you almost like she was raped  the theripy is a very important step two many people complain about the expence or just make up excuses dont do this
except reality you already relise that there is a prolbem well adress the prolbem with the proper steps  be truthfull with your self  get out of denile it will consume and destroy you and thouse that you love and care about   understant that not every one will beable to understand opr except this
it has to start with you
good luck I realy wish you the best and I hope that you find the answers that you need
TTFN
kristin