Terri, I agree with the consensus that none of that's surprising, imx the odds were much worse 15, 20 years ago. My take away has for a while been that narrowing it down to the 12% "potentials"  amounts to sorting away a lot of people I'd be less  interested in anyway :-).

Quote from: Alaskan Danielle on June 20, 2018, 11:56:58 AM
My results are not at all depressing....  and I write here on the Forums as a testimony of what can really happen in real life and not some high priced study composed with big words and overly complicated wording by an "educated" professor that may not have gone through the hoops that we transgenders have...
I think it is inaccurate news that will cause unnecessary concern to the transgender community.

To all that are reading my reply post... don't read the report... live your life and let it happen.

Danielle, without for a moment suggesting that passing privilege is a panacea to either dating specific or general happiness, I have to say your suggestion is far off my circumstances (as would be true for my own take on dating and life strategies for other trans women). What you relate here and elsewhere makes good sense for someone who's relatively passable and I think it might not hurt that people in your little community got to know you as female before you were out / outed. First impressions are quite durable.

Also, the subject article isn't news or opinion per se and so interpreting it as inaccurate doesn't make much sense to me .. it's science, reported in a peer reviewed journal.

I don't have time / bandwidth just now to go into more detail, but I'll add some more thoughts late tonight or perhaps tomorrow.

Interesting. The pessimism herein does in many ways, not seem to jive with the 2015 survey on transgender individuals that recorded us within about 4-5% of the relationship frequency of the general population.

http://www.ustranssurvey.org/

That surveys actual data, not perceptions, but I will look closer at this data. Another question to ask is what is a statistic struggle vs what the general population faces. Is a dating pool of 12% for instance low? Or is that what the general population faces because of socio-economic, age, orientation and other factors? What percentage of the respondents even know a trans person on any sort of level? In my experience, I have dated people that would have never considered they would have dated a trans person until they met and became friends with one.

Anecdotally (and I know it doesn't mean a lot), but since coming out about 3 years ago, I have dated perhaps six individuals two cismen, three ciswomen, and a trans woman. I'm middle-aged and I'm not sure that whole lot of a catch but who knows. I have two long-term poly partners. It does take a lot of effort without a doubt and that effort means some rejection.

An interesting survey and not all that surprising.  I disclose on my dating app profiles that I am trans.  I have gotten a number of responses from men but rally haven't dated all that much.  Generally, the comments I get and responses are very similar to cis women my age.  The market for 57 year old 6'2" divorced transwomen is not particularly large (nor is it for 57 year old cis women who are divorced).  Oddly, I've found that younger guys (25-40) are actually interested in dating me.  I haven't really taken any of them up on their offers because there is something weird about going on a date with someone who may be the same age as my kids.  I guess I may have to change my mind because some of these guys are ultra hot and if someone like Madonna can have a boy toy why shouldn't I?

The survey results closely follow the results of a Pew survey from a few years ago that also showed dating interest for various age tranches.

Unsurprisingly, older lesbian groups were less likely to be open to dating lesbian identifying trans women than younger groups. The 60 and older tranche had essentially no interest.

This also matched my personal experience in which I am solidly in the Friend Zone with lesbian groups. In meetups it was made clear that I should only date the trans women in a meetup group.

Online dating was... interesting.  I did get some creative hate mail for my money and trouble. Not worth it for older women of the transgender sort.




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I wouldn't date most cis people, anyway, and the people I fall for are one-in-a-thousand, so it'd be accurate to say I wouldn't consider dating 99.9% of the population.

Even so, I've consistently found partners in unlikely places when I wasn't even looking for them. I met one guy at a coffee shop, another at a birthday party, another during a Cards Against Humanity game (he showed up late), a girl while I was working, and so on. I've come around to the mindset that I don't care if I'm with someone, because most people aren't worth being with--but the ones who are make it special, so if someone I could like just so happens to come along, I'm always interested.

Funny thing about numbers. There are 7 billion people on the planet. Even if you're one in a million there are 7,000 people exactly like you.

Quote from: DustKitten on June 21, 2018, 05:08:22 PM

Even so, I've consistently found partners in unlikely places when I wasn't even looking for them. I met one guy at a coffee shop, another at a birthday party, another during a Cards Against Humanity game (he showed up late), a girl while I was working, and so on.

I think this a key to dating in general. In my opinion in the age of technologies and an internet that ties us too far more people, but in superficial ways, we depend too much on apps and dating sites. Meetups, friend groups, hobbies, churches and general networking are probably the better choices.

Let's see of six; I have met one online, one was a friend for two years prior, one I met at a pub, two were introduced through friends and one is someone I met through business.

Quote from: RobynD on June 21, 2018, 02:51:10 PM
Is a dating pool of 12% for instance low? Or is that what the general population faces because of socio-economic, age, orientation and other factors?

That's a good point. Based on my experience with online dating as an average-looking man, no mention or appearance of being trans at the time, I'd say far less than 12% of the women I've sent a message to ever responded back. Of those 12%, I've only managed to go on a date with one.

I have less direct experience with chatting women up in person for all sorts of reasons, mostly because I'm too afraid or nervous to do so... which is something I'm trying to get over, but I think it's also partly based around being uncomfortable as a man, and I'm hoping that transitioning will help, though dating is not my primary reason for transitioning. But that's a whole other story!

Quote from: Michelle_P on June 21, 2018, 04:28:01 PM
The survey results closely follow the results of a Pew survey from a few years ago that also showed dating interest for various age tranches.

Unsurprisingly, older lesbian groups were less likely to be open to dating lesbian identifying trans women than younger groups. The 60 and older tranche had essentially no interest.

This also matched my personal experience in which I am solidly in the Friend Zone with lesbian groups. In meetups it was made clear that I should only date the trans women in a meetup group.

Online dating was... interesting.  I did get some creative hate mail for my money and trouble. Not worth it for older women of the transgender sort.




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Creative hate mail...  OK, I have a new, useful, term.  Part of me wants to look at dating sites; all the other parts of me scream at various high decibel levels NO!!!  That conclusion does not even take into account being trans* -- the only attention I get from cis women is when my old self is out and about.  That is pretty useless as that it not the real me.

Ah well, it looks like the takeaway here is let life happen.  If by chance you run across somebody you click with... good.  If not, don't sweat it.  I know, said like a true asexual...

Quote from: Lucca on June 21, 2018, 06:24:24 PM
That's a good point. Based on my experience with online dating as an average-looking man, no mention or appearance of being trans at the time, I'd say far less than 12% of the women I've sent a message to ever responded back. Of those 12%, I've only managed to go on a date with one.

Yeah and women the largest share of attention on online dating more than their proportion, for various reasons such as cultural etc. My smallish city of 50K has what maybe 35K adults, men, and women? Ok knock 10K off of that because of age differences, 12% of 25K thousand dating prospects, gives me a pool of about 3000. I'd better get busy 

Quote from: Lucca on June 21, 2018, 06:24:24 PM
That's a good point. Based on my experience with online dating as an average-looking man, no mention or appearance of being trans at the time, I'd say far less than 12% of the women I've sent a message to ever responded back. Of those 12%, I've only managed to go on a date with one.

That's because you were dating as a guy.  I tried one of those over-50 dating sites (without revealing I was trans) and I got something like 200 messages in the first week. Like @Alaskan Danielle says, women are the hunted prey.  That would never happen if I were still presenting as a male. 

Quote from: Lucca on June 21, 2018, 06:24:24 PM
I have less direct experience with chatting women up in person for all sorts of reasons, mostly because I'm too afraid or nervous to do so... which is something I'm trying to get over, but I think it's also partly based around being uncomfortable as a man, and I'm hoping that transitioning will help, though dating is not my primary reason for transitioning. But that's a whole other story!

It's certainly true in my experience that it is easier to communicate with other women when accepted as female, but as the study points out, people are biased against transgenders. Dating does get more difficult, but not impossible. 

~Terri.