Hi everyone. So yesterday I got an email from one of my mom's friends, Patty. I know her but I found it weird that she would email me and I wasn't aware she even had my email but anyway, she said she and her husband had gone to Florida on vacation and that while she was there she had visited with my mom. She said " not that I would care" , I loved that part, but my mother was doing well. Then she said she had had a long talk with my mom and that she had told her a lot of stuff she hadn't known and that all of us, myself and my dad especially,  should be ashamed of everything we had done to my mom and considering what she had been through she was more than entitled to start over and try to find some happiness. Ok, I know I should have just deleted her email and said whatever, but I couldn't help myself. I wanted to know exactly what my mom had told her that made my dad and I such awful people.

I got her reply this morning.  I can't believe the total lies she told! OMG! She said my dad had been totally disinterested in his children like all guys are and that she had had to do everything for us herself with no help from my dad. She said she had never had any opportunity to enjoy being young. She also said I had never loved her. She said even as a small child I totally loved my dad and wanted nothing to do with her even though my dad had no interest in me! OMG! What a total LIE!!!!! She also even told her my dad was mean to Tyler and I and that she always had to make sure he didn't hit or hurt us! Another total LIE!

She was the one who wanted nothing to do with ME! It took years of asking questions and trying to pull the truth out of my grandma but I finally got the truth out of her last year. It freaked my mom out having an albino baby. She considered it a defect and was embarrassed by me. After I was born my mom wanted to put me up for adoption. My dad told her that was never going to happen so she told him fine then, he could take care of me then. She totally meant it and that's exactly what happened. My dad took care of me exclusively. It was him who had no help from HER. Tyler was 2 when I was born and I guess she was over him too because from the time he was 2 years old my dad took care of him exclusively as well. My mom did absolutely nothing. She didn't even cook for us. She either ate out with her friends or ate a frozen lean cuisine. My dad cooked for us as best he could. Even though he had a wife my dad was a single dad. I never rejected my mother when I was little. If I tried to get in her lap or get close to her she would push me away and tell me to stop or she would pick me up and put me in my dad's lap. She once told me I was extremely annoying as a small child because I was so clingy and needy and always wanted to be held or cuddled. My dad has NEVER spanked or hit either Tyler or I. My dad did pull my hair once when I guess I pushed him to his limit when I was like 5. But it was only that one time.  It was my mom who would smack us, though she made sure my dad wasn't around when she did. My dad has also never been mean with us.

As for her missing out on having fun when she was young that was my dad, not her. My mom did whatever she wanted. She went out with her friends and did anything else she felt like. My dad was the one stuck home with 2 small kids. My grandma took care of us while my dad was at work but otherwise he took care of us. If my dad went anywhere he had me on his chest in a baby bjorn and Tyler on a child leash. Not much opportunity for fun there. And yes, people would sometimes say things to him about the child leash on Tyler but he pretty much had to use it. Tyler wouldn't just wonder away, he would actually take off running.

When my dad was a year younger than I am he had a 2 year old and an infant. I can't even imagine that! And he took care of us both by himself. So if anyone has lost youth it's him! I actually have to wonder if my mom actually believes the lies she tells. She was obviously very convincing. At the end of her email Patty said " all I can think is poor Serena". Oh yeah, poor Serena. My heart is breaking. Ugh. I know what this woman thinks and weather she believes my mom's lies or not shouldn't matter but it really bothers me that my mom has her believing my dad is a selfcentered ->-bleeped-<- who ignored and hit his kids when he is the total opposite!

Sorry for the rant. My mom can't go but 1-2 months without stirring the ->-bleeped-<- in some way or other.

Quote from: Julia1996 on August 22, 2018, 11:12:42 AMI actually have to wonder if my mom actually believes the lies she tells. She was obviously very convincing.

Julia, I am so sorry you have to deal with this.

People who tell such lies do it because they need to believe them.  They don't really believe it themselves, but it is what they want to believe, so they keep repeating them in the hopes of convincing themselves.  If they can repeat the lies to someone else, so much the better, because then they can get reinforcement from outside.  But the person they are trying to convince is themselves.  Their self-esteem depends on believing the lies, yet deep down, they know they are false.

Best not to dwell on it.  You know the truth.

Julia, I agree with Kathy.  Though your mother more than likely knows that she is lying and probably has rehearsed this to spread her false narrative to acquaintances.  So as an answer to your question, yes I do think that someone can start to believe their lies, but your mother, unless she is mentally unfit (to some degree, she is) doesn't truly believe it.  Her version is so radical from reality, that I think she is just being mean.

Hi, Julia
I have a bit of a different take than Kathy or Jessica; she might well believe what she says - but it's not quite that simple.

I have a friend who has been diagnosed by physicians as both psychotic and neurotic and is a consummate tale-weaver; were Wes to tell me the sky is blue, I would take it with more than a few grains of salt. Does he truly believe his distortions are real? Absolutely. While I feel almost any therapist could probably come up with a tangled jumble of excuses, his mother described it to me as a ball of yarn.

If you start with a bruised feeling, you wrap a bit of yard around it to cushion the hurt but, as the larger wrap becomes more irritating, you keep on adding yarn. Layer by layer, the ball grows and the initial bruise all but is forgotten and all those added layers of self-justification and excuses and lies have become an entirely new reality - much as a mistreated pimple can become an abscess. And until the abscess is treated...

I am sorry for your hurt; you blessed to have those who truly know you and love you nearby - and those are the people that truly matter in your life.

Susan

Sorry you have stuff like that going on with your family, glad you feel comfortable enough to talk openly about it - I often struggle with talking about things that are bothering me

Families can be so much fun sometimes with all the conniving bologna slicing (Sarcasm) - Brings back less than fond memories of my own families - But then I practically grew up like an orphan slave child of sorts - One of my moms even called me Cinderfella   

But yeah, all the gossip and tall tales and nonsense can be really unnerving at times - Then they would wonder why I'd become so withdrawn and evasive LOL

Anyway Julia - You are a beautiful young lady with all your life ahead of you - Sure it is good to recognize and discuss these issues but in the end we must leave it behind and move forward with life

Best Wishes to You

Hugs

Jeez, I can't get over the concept that someone would be ready and willing to raise a child, but then want to give them up for adoption for something as trivial as being albino...

There are some extraordinarily brazen liars out there. 

One of my jobs was to assist a project manager who was on a temporary contract.  He could use Microsoft project management software but he had no specific analytical skills such as SQL or programming. 

I can imagine why he never stayed anywhere very long.  On one occasion, he asked me to analyse some data to get information he wanted.  I did so and took him the information that he had asked for.  Before I had even walked back to my seat, he told me that he had just discovered something important.  He then told me what I had just told him.  He told me that he had discovered it just then by "looking at the data".  (In my case, I had used computer analysis to extract the information from hundreds of thousands of records.)

I stood there open mouthed, not knowing what to say.  I had never before encountered anyone so brazen that they would lie to the face of the one person who obviously knew that they were lying.  I can only think that he had some mental facility for convincing himself that he was telling the truth.  I don't even know why he felt that he had to lie.  After all, what I had done was no big deal and he had asked me to do it.  I had heard of compulsive liars but had never worked with one before.

Julia, it is sad that your mother feels the need to say those things to her friends.  After all, although she implied that she protected you from your father, she is the one with the restraining order against her.

However, I question the motives of her "friend" who emailed you.  It seems to me as though she may have been fishing for dirt on your mother so that she could gossip about her with other friends.  Although your relationship with your mother is troubled, you will have to decide whether you want her friends to know the truth or whether you want to leave her with the dignity of having friends who believe her and sympathise with her.
 

Wow, Julia, your Mom sure lives in her own world!

Maybe its best that you don't have much contact with her.  She obviously has problems, and having someone feel sorry for her seems to always be what she wants.  Personally, I feel its better to be hated than pitied, but obviously she needs pity to feel good about what she's done to the three of you.

Some people really aren't cut out to be parents, and some are.  Its obvious to us here on the forum which one your Dad is vs which one your Mom is.

Hug your Dad.  He deserves it for raising two such great kids!

Ryuichi

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Most people are capable of convincing themselves that their own lies are true, even if deep down they still know they're not. Sorry about your mom--if I had an albino baby, I'd be ecstatic. That just means your kid is extra-special, and about 20,000 times as interesting as everyone else's baby.

Julia, your mother's reality may be skewed, but that is the reality she created for herself. Many simply cannot accept any blame for anything they did, and create their own reality, so they don't have to. There are people in prison that consider themselves victims, just because they don't feel responsible for the people they committed crimes against. Look how many illicit drug users steal and rob to get the money for their fix. They don't care about those they hurt. But, they make up excuses to make it all OK, and then blame their victims for putting them in that situation. 
It looks like your mother wants people to think she is a saint. To that end, it looks like she is blaming the entire family for not being with her. You already know her attitude, and vindictiveness. She put herself in her situation. However, she is looking for new friends, and those friends may not want to be around someone like her if they knew the truth.
Sadly, some people are so ignorant that they cannot detect a lie when it is obvious. That makes for perfect company for a chronic liar. A good manipulator can turn the ignorant into tools they can use against those like your family.
It would be best if you block those your mother convinces to email you. Your happiness is more important to you than hers is.

Some mental health conditions can cause a person to believe their own lies. I don't remember the details, but I think it continues to get worse over time.

In the meantime, if you have any screenshots of conversations with your mom, that could be useful evidence. Also, if I remember correctly, she was arrested for assaulting you? You could email a copy of your mom's arrest record.

My step mother is a compulsive liar amongst other seedy things. Actually narcissistic works well. The lies my brother and I were so frequent and out there. Claiming she made twice what she was actually paid, a matter of public record. Falsified police reports. Even a story about hacking a government agency, or being friends with Pam smart. That last one, sadly, might be true.

We couldn't call her out on it without punishment. she made herself out to be the victim 100% not to mention all the shaming for not conforming as a male. It gets worse but ill keep that to myself.

I can remember the day I decided to go back to school and try for a associates. She had the gall to ask me if I even graduated high school in the first place. Yea I did no thanks to anyone in my family. Graduation day came and I had several unused tickets.

I absolutely believe someone can believe all their own lies. There is no way someone can be this horrible and still insist their own truth, with proof enough for a grand jury.

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Oh Patty Patty Patty... No one ever told her not to get inbetween a mother and daughter?! Oh no no no what a mess of a lady she is! [emoji23]

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I don't even want to start up on my stepmother or any of my stupid so called parents - But there is a foot in the something for everyone brave enough to step up

Quote from: Daisy Jane on August 23, 2018, 05:44:18 PM
Some mental health conditions can cause a person to believe their own lies. I don't remember the details, but I think it continues to get worse over time.

In the meantime, if you have any screenshots of conversations with your mom, that could be useful evidence. Also, if I remember correctly, she was arrested for assaulting you? You could email a copy of your mom's arrest record.

At least a copy of the restraining order.

My adoptive mother was so vicious, that I got put into foster care twice, to protect me from her. The courts never charged her with a crime. I had physical evidence on my body of what she did, but her lies were so believable that the prosecuting attorneys  dropped the charges. The courts somehow could not fathom how a lady that seemed so sweet could leave cuts on a child from her favorite butcher knife.

Some people are more than willing to believe someone that can put up a false front and lie so well.