What is transitioning? What does it mean to me? What does it mean for society? Who is impacted?

These are questions I have been thinking about a lot lately.  There are so many angles to look at here that it's almost Impossible for me to go through them all.

As someone who has transitioned 5 years ago, this I can tell you. The biggest group objecting to anyone transitioning is the religious right. I have been told I go against Gods will. Does anyone know Gods will? I was born this way. According to the religious right God doesn't make mistakes. I completely agree with that, I am not a mistake. God did make me this way.

Then why transition? For me that's simple. So my body matches what I see myself to be. Just like a body builder sees themselves with massive muscles. Did God intend for Arnold Schwarzenegger to be this muscular marvel of a man? It was what Arnold envisioned for himself. What about that woman who has had breast implants? A face lift, lips done and her hair dyed platinum blond? Did God intend for her to look that way?

Then there is the person who has almost their entire body covered in tattoos. Did God intend for him to look that way? Or the Japanese woman who wants small feet and wears extremely constricting shoes to keep her feet from growing.  Did God intend for her to have feet that look like that?

If the argument is I am going against God,  then you have a lot of other areas to correct for God.

I have been told my body is a temple and should keep it the way I was born. But wait, why are there so many different temples then? Because each one is personalized! Exactly my point!! Aren't we all personizing our temples? From the man that shaves his head. To the woman who shaves her legs. The woman who colors her hair to the man that colors his body. The woman who pierced her ears to the man with the gold tooth.

I see none of those things as being any different than transitioning. Did God intend for Arnold Schwarzenegger to be a 6'2" tall 150 lbs weakling? Who can say? But this I do know.... All of us have done things to make ourselves comfortable in our own skin. I transitioned to save my life. I personally dont think that's a bad thing at all.

I agree with you 100%.  I am not a mistake either. And, let's talk about straight conservative Christian folk for a moment.....

How many have hair plugs?

How many color their hair?

How many have had breast augmentation or reduction?

How many have piercings or ink?

How many have had Botox?

How many have had plastic surgery ?

How many had liposuction or tummy tuck?

How many simply hide how they look with makeup, wigs, padded garments ect...?

Colored contact lenses?

How many use creams to hide blemishes or reduce wrinkles?

ALL these things are a manifestation of vanity, a sin.  ALL of these things defile their body, that holy temple or vessel that God created.....all these things imply that they disagree to some extent with God about how they should look...

So, who are they to cast stones at us?

You will find out that all your justifications and examples will not change the mind of those religious people.  They have their opinion, and that is it!
I found it to be best to not even try to discuss with them, but just walk away.  If they want to be with you, they come around, if not, you did not loose very much anyway!

This makes me think of a story from my cousin.  Apparently my father was ranting about how unholy and against god's will it was for his son to transition.  "The body is a temple and it's not our place to decide that it's wrong" was his main complaint.

She being ever so quick on her feet asked "so why did you get lasik, two cataract surgeries, a vasectomy, and a potentially cancerous mole removed if it was god's will for that to happen?"

The truth, which maybe they will never accept is that their dissatisfaction with their bodies is similar to ours.  Maybe that scares them.  Maybe they cannot empathize because they do not see the commonality of our existence and theirs.  There is no doubt that they exclude and ostracize us because this commonality is not understood by them.  They have been taught that our needs are different, that dysphoria is either a mental disorder or it is the manifestation of some sexual deviancy or perversion that must be some sort of sin.

The fact that needs to be driven home is that our needs are similar to theirs and any incidences of actual sexual deviancy in our community are statistically equal to or lower than the rates of actual sexual deviancy in their group.  That our existence and our needs are not intrinsically deviant in any real moral, ethical or criminal context.

They can argue in the affirmative for surgeries that extend their life or correct birth defects.  They can argue that it must be Gods will as he has given us the knowledge and ability to do such miraculous things.  Very few Christians shun modern medicine when they need it.  We are not mistakes.  We have been given unique challenges that must serve some purpose that God intends just as they can say autistic or downs children exist because God has a plan.  I won't argue for the existence of God here nor will I claim to understand Gods plans but merely wish to point out inherent contradictions in conservative Christian beliefs with regards to our society.

Best regards,

Bea

Colleen, that is definitely my point.  It's contradictory. 

Quote from: Bea1968 on May 09, 2019, 08:56:50 AM
They can argue in the affirmative for surgeries that extend their life or correct birth defects.

Isn't this what we find ourselves having to do?  Correct a birth defect so we can extend our lives?

Kate


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Hello Everyone

I agree that the Christian Fundamentalists who unfortunately are increasing here in the UK are the main source of bigotry and indeed discrimination and hatred towards us. I have lost a friend as he is such and he cannot accept my decision to transition as it is in his opinion offensive to God.

We can try and repeat the arguments here on this thread to such people but my experience is that they will hardly ever change.

I put this attitude down to a combination of brainwashing and ignorance. They also do not wish to be educated (scientifically) anyway but remain in the dark ages. Finally they are very prone to judge us and other groups they don't like. I prefer to believe that only God may judge us and indeed these people are casting "the first and many stones".

Hugs

Pamela

Quote from: pamelatransuk on May 10, 2019, 05:05:12 AM
Hello Everyone

I agree that the Christian Fundamentalists who unfortunately are increasing here in the UK are the main source of bigotry and indeed discrimination and hatred towards us. I have lost a friend as he is such and he cannot accept my decision to transition as it is in his opinion offensive to God.

We can try and repeat the arguments here on this thread to such people but my experience is that they will hardly ever change.

I put this attitude down to a combination of brainwashing and ignorance. They also do not wish to be educated (scientifically) anyway but remain in the dark ages. Finally they are very prone to judge us and other groups they don't like. I prefer to believe that only God may judge us and indeed these people are casting "the first and many stones".

Hugs

Pamela

The only people who do not accept me is a couple who were very close friends to me, but turned evangelical over time.  They clearly told me that I am mentally sick and need to be institutionalized to get cured and become the manly man a gain who used to be their friend.
When I told them that i was born intersex, they answered that this is a charade only, because God would not make mistakes of this kind, and it is all up in my head!
That was the end of our friendship, sad, because we were very close for over 25 years, but I certainly cannot change the way they wanted me to change.

QuoteThe only people who do not accept me is a couple who were very close friends to me, but turned evangelical over time.  They clearly told me that I am mentally sick and need to be institutionalized to get cured and become the manly man a gain who used to be their friend.

Well, I consider anyone who believes in "God" to be delusional.  For some reason, they don't like hearing that.  They don't seem to understand that believing something, despite all evidence to the contrary, is delusion.  Yet we're supposed to accept religion on faith, not only without a shred of evidence to support it, but with plenty that contradicts it.  It doesn't take long to find contradictions within the bible.  If God doesn't make mistakes, why are those in there?  Why the big difference in the philosophies of the old and new testaments?

I find this conversation uncomfortable. I live next door to my church and have never had any problems with Christians. There is nothing in the Bible that addresses transgender issues since it did not exist then (as we have today with hormones, surgery, etc.). Pat Robertson of the 700 Club has stated that he has no issues with people transitioning and acknowledges that some people are born the wrong physical gender. He has stated (Google it) that there is no sin in transitioning and that he understands why people pursue it.

God loved me when I was born and He still loves me now. There is nothing in my church or the Bible against my life choice. Please don't hate me or dismiss me because I believe in God. If you do, than who is the hater?

Quote from: Dietlind on May 10, 2019, 08:29:02 AM
They clearly told me that I am mentally sick and need to be institutionalized to get cured and become the manly man a gain who used to be their friend.
When I told them that i was born intersex, they answered that this is a charade only, because God would not make mistakes of this kind, and it is all up in my head!

I've always found it curious that people have decided it is okay to change your brain to match your body but so egregious to want to change your body to match your brain.

Interesting that you mention Arnold.  I've sculpted my body through diet and exercise. And I'm sure genetic plays a part, My 32A boobs are mostly muscle, but I doubt if anyone can tell the difference.  Similarly, I can do all sorts of activities while squatting due to my well developed lower body.  The end result is that my body is a really great match for XS petite women's clothes. I am really big on range of motion exercises that use all my muscles.  And, if you are short, you are always reaching for stuff.

Well, I'm a right-wing, conservative, Christian, gun-nut, and I think all of you are a-okay.