Quote from: noleen111 on July 08, 2024, 07:52:46 AMThis situation kinda happened to me. ok not exactly the same situation, but similar

Before I had bottom surgery, I was dating a guy. He was my first boyfriend, before that I assumed I was lesbian.

I was full time presenting as female, i had being on hormones for about 2 years, so I was quite a way down the road of transition, so I was passing well. Since I am a girly girl, this helped my passing

He was a deeply closeted gay man, so I was the perfect girlfriend for him, to his family and public I was girl so nothing to see here, but the fact I had a penis appealed to the gay side of him. Things started to get complicated when things started to get physical as i did want him to touch me down there as I did not want to get reminded I was born male. The final nail in the relationship, was when I secured my appointment for bottom surgery. I was so excited and he was angry, he accused me of selling out and bowing to societies definition of a woman and I was perfect the way I was.

He knew my plan all along was to get bottom surgery,when I started hormones that was always the plan, I knew I needed a vagina between my legs to feel 100% female.

Well we broke up. That relationship was about 9 months long (we took it slowly, due him being a closeted gay man, and me getting use to the idea of having a boyfriend). Yes that relationship was doomed from the start.

Back to the question, in this Hypothetical but not very realistic, situation.. the relationship will be doomed. Its only so long you can pretend everything is fine. you need to be you in the relationship.

When I met my husband, I was honest from the beginning, that I was born male as I was post op at this time. I did not want to build a relationship on a lie.

Noleen,

Thank you for your thoughts on this situation.

Chrissy

Quote from: Gina P on July 08, 2024, 08:34:46 AMI'll just echo what the others have said. The relationship is doomed, DOOMED from the start. After the euphoria of great sex and a new love wear off, GD will rear its ugly head and all the anxieties and problems will come back.
   When I came out to my wife I told her if she wanted to split, I understand. I loved her but I HAD to do this for me! Long story short she has learned to except me as I am.  

Gina,

Thank you for your thoughts on this.  It is also nice your wife has accepted you for who you are.  As you are aware in this hypothetical situation the woman, if she is to be married, would want to accept the other woman (MTF) but with limits, if they could appear as a "standard heterosexual couple to the world."  But that may be very difficult to do for the woman who is transitioning, even if she may present as female in many situations.

Something "may break" in the future of this relationship....

Chrissy

Quote from: Sephirah on July 10, 2024, 09:08:50 PMThis is a no brainer for me, Chrissy.

If someone I'm with doesn't understand why I am who am, and cannot get me for who I am.. I don't care if she were the best sex since pre-Trump Stormy Daniels... that isn't the point of a relationship.

For me it is a meeting of souls, pure and simple. It's someone you find solace in. Someone who finds solace in you. Lust is a very long way down the list to love. And I will also say, people here understand that more than most. Take it from personal experience.

If you base the premise of your relationship on a lie, or a concession... it will never, EVER end well. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Beauty is in the eye of the person who will never ask you to be someone else because it suits their world more. And vice versa. It's a rare thing, admittedly, but when you have, or find it... you hold on to it. Because these are the people, and you are the person, which matters.

That's my belief.

Sephora,

Quote from: Sephirah on July 10, 2024, 09:08:50 PMThis is a no brainer for me, Chrissy.

If someone I'm with doesn't understand why I am who am, and cannot get me for who I am.. I don't care if she were the best sex since pre-Trump Stormy Daniels... that isn't the point of a relationship.

For me it is a meeting of souls, pure and simple. It's someone you find solace in. Someone who finds solace in you. Lust is a very long way down the list to love. And I will also say, people here understand that more than most. Take it from personal experience.

If you base the premise of your relationship on a lie, or a concession... it will never, EVER end well. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Beauty is in the eye of the person who will never ask you to be someone else because it suits their world more. And vice versa. It's a rare thing, admittedly, but when you have, or find it... you hold on to it. Because these are the people, and you are the person, which matters.

That's my belief.

Sephirah,

Thank you for your thoughts on this.

Chrissy

Quote from: KathyLauren on July 11, 2024, 12:33:08 PMIt is pretty hypothetical for me, as I was already married when I transitioned, and my wife is okay with who I am.  But I agree with the consensus above: the relationship as described would not work.  The earlier the person breaks it off, the better.

I do know someone in almost this position.  After a lifetime of crossdressing and being gender-fluid, she has finally realized that she is trans-feminine .  But her wife is not on board with it, so she has to present masculine at home.  Given that she has started HRT and is loving it, I foresee "interesting" times in her home life.  So far, she is making it work, and is able to present as feminine everywhere except at home, including at work.  I wish her the best, but her path is not for me.  And in the long run, perhaps not for her either.

Kathy Lauren,

Thank you for your thought on this.

Chrissy

Quote from: Nadine Spirit on July 11, 2024, 09:27:55 PMYeah that's a no go. I would not do this. Even if I wanted to it wouldn't work. I tried this route for most of my life and it led to misery. Thus I transitioned. Not going back to try it again, thanks.

Kelly,

Thank you for your thought of this situation.

Chrissy

Quote from: ChrissyRyan on July 07, 2024, 01:22:53 PMHypothetically speaking, what would you most likely do as a MTF transitioning for quite a while and you now find yourself in a strong and wonderful relationship with another woman, it is getting very serious, and she appears to be very supportive of you, BUT she says she would prefer yourself remaining a biological male, legally and otherwise, to have a "normal appearing couple relationship" if you two get married because it would make things go smoother with her family?  Yes, you can express your femininity but it would no longer be good for you to be working as a female, as you would be a man to the world?

This seems like a terrible situation to complete your MTF transition as you have been moving towards this real life gender transition.  But the woman you fell in love with you want to do almost anything for her.  She is honest, loving, you have great sex, and a lot of fun together as yourself, as a woman.  She is honest, smart, beautiful, and you feel very fortunate to have her return love to you. 

So what you say on this hypothetical situation, this quandary?


Chrissy

This would be a really tough quandary to be in.  The CIS woman is supportive to an extent, they have taken out of town trips as two women, they go out as two women, they seem to have a lot fun.  Then the twist of her wanting to appear to be in a "traditional male/female relationship" to the world is causing some issues for her friendship.

She may be asking for too much of her friend.  Her friend has come a substantial way in her MTF transition.  But she has been sitting on the fence in terms of completing it.

Thank you all for your thoughts on this, and additional thoughts are welcomed.

Chrissy

In this hypothetical situation, nothing needs to change unless they get engaged.
They continue to talk about this.

Chrissy

This situation is both sweet and hurtful.
Perhaps it is best to not get too serious.
I just do not know.

Chrissy

This hypothetical couple are continuing to talk about what "must be done" if they get super serious / permanent relationship wise.  In the meantime, they are doing well and are having good times together.

Here is an update to the hypothetical situation, somewhat changed from the original scenario, as there has been much discussion between the couple.

Hypothetically speaking, what would you most likely do as a MTF transitioning for quite a while and you now find yourself in a nice relationship with another woman, it is lasting, it is getting serious, and she appears to be very supportive of you, BUT she says she insists on yourself remaining a biological male, legally and otherwise, to have a "normal appearing couple relationship" if you two get married because it would make things go smoother with her family and some of her friends?

Yes, you can express your femininity at home, vacation, you can continue to work as a female, be female in public in most situations, but for members of her family and some others potentially, to have them believe you are male.  A male and female hetero couple.

While different to some extent, with more consideration given to her (the MTF's) female transitioning, this still a challenging situation for some MTFs.  However, things could be worse.  There is good and bad in this situation. 


Chrissy

I still would never agree to be anyone but myself.

If someone has a problem with who I am, that is their problem, not mine. If that is a deal-breaker, then I would have to ask why I am not allowed to be me? Why am I expected to lie and pretend to be something I am not? I spent years trying to overcome the lie I had been telling most of my life. I can't go back.

If it came right down to it, I would never be around those who cannot accept it. And who knows which members of the family would be accepting if they knew the truth? Maybe most of the family is okay with it, and it is her discomfort that she is projecting onto the family.

Something to think about.

I can see your point Lori.

In this example situation at least she gets to live a lot of her life as herself.
Although not the ideal, I cannot help but think that there is some real value here in that there is much acceptance here and a relationship of value.  It is a realization that her family would not be accepting although some of them may be accepting.

People are social and need others.  If she (MTF) found someone that is a lot accepting, it seems to me that that beats not having anyone.

It is a situation where naturally one would want 100% be able to be yourself 100% of the time.  Is slightly less better than zero with no mutual relationship?

May be hard to put up that false front to her family, no doubt.  Maybe it could not work out.

I am thinking though that many transgender people would like to have a significant amount of acceptance by their friends, family, and partner and this may be one of those compromise situations that can be acceptable.  At least for a while, or to try. 

I do not know though.  It would be, as you say, hard to not be yourself all the time.  Life is full of give and take though.  Being flexible can be helpful.  Sticking to your 100% being you as you transition if at all possible is also helpful as you want to live your life as a woman.

Any others wish to comment?  Perhaps if she went along with this it will likely end up badly.  Maybe not.  Maybe they should just take this day by day.


Chrissy

Take my comments with a grain of salt. I am an asexual introvert, so social interactions are not something that I need. Because of this, I fail to see any value in engaging with negative people. I would find any excuse necessary to avoid visiting them. Would I need to maintain a separate male wardrobe just for those occasions? What if I ran into one of them at the grocery store as myself?

It just seems to be a very cumbersome way to live just to please someone else. After 60 years of doing that, I decided that I would no longer live my life according to the whims of others. For some, it may seem like what she is asking is a small compromise. I don't see it that way.

Again, this is just my narrow opinion. YMMV. 

Quote from: ChrissyRyan on June 02, 2025, 12:54:00 AMI am thinking though that many transgender people would like to have a significant amount of acceptance by their friends, family, and partner and this may be one of those compromise situations that can be acceptable.  At least for a while, or to try. 

I'm sure this is one of those situations where everyone will have a different take because we're none of us the same. Ultimately how people answer is going to be influenced by whether they are binary or not, how strong their dysphoria is, how much they value the other person in the relationship, their sexuality and their overall take on the balance between transitioning and the loss of the relationship.

That's five axes.

I'm in a position not so far from the one you're describing and I'm perfectly good with it, but I value relationship quality over almost everything else.

Quote from: Lori Dee on June 02, 2025, 08:35:10 AMTake my comments with a grain of salt. I am an asexual introvert, so social interactions are not something that I need. Because of this, I fail to see any value in engaging with negative people. I would find any excuse necessary to avoid visiting them. Would I need to maintain a separate male wardrobe just for those occasions? What if I ran into one of them at the grocery store as myself?

It just seems to be a very cumbersome way to live just to please someone else. After 60 years of doing that, I decided that I would no longer live my life according to the whims of others. For some, it may seem like what she is asking is a small compromise. I don't see it that way.

Again, this is just my narrow opinion. YMMV. 

I would have to agree with you Lori on this. After so much progress and coming so far. I would see this compromise as a significant setback. I think it also could lead to some issues in the relationship as someone is not really accepting of the person's transition as they seem to say they are.
They are in MY opinion okay to accept the transition of the partner with exceptions. But the partner has no options but to accept or end it. How is this a healthy relationship. Again just my stance on the subject.

Quote from: ChrissyRyan on June 01, 2025, 06:59:01 PMHypothetically speaking, what would you most likely do as a MTF transitioning for quite a while and you now find yourself in a nice relationship with another woman, it is lasting, it is getting serious, and she appears to be very supportive of you, BUT she says she insists on yourself remaining a biological male, legally and otherwise, to have a "normal appearing couple relationship" if you two get married because it would make things go smoother with her family and some of her friends?

For me, this would be a deal-breaker.  I cannot ever go back to pretending to be male.  She and I can be good acquaintances, but it would be hard to be friends with someone who is, at best, only a partial ally, and it would be impossible for me to be in a relationship with them.

Quote from: TanyaG on June 02, 2025, 09:21:53 AMI'm sure this is one of those situations where everyone will have a different take because we're none of us the same. Ultimately how people answer is going to be influenced by whether they are binary or not, how strong their dysphoria is, how much they value the other person in the relationship, their sexuality and their overall take on the balance between transitioning and the loss of the relationship.

That's five axes.

I'm in a position not so far from the one you're describing and I'm perfectly good with it, but I value relationship quality over almost everything else.

Thank you for your thoughts Tanya.

Chrissy

Quote from: Lori Dee on June 02, 2025, 08:35:10 AMTake my comments with a grain of salt. I am an asexual introvert, so social interactions are not something that I need. Because of this, I fail to see any value in engaging with negative people. I would find any excuse necessary to avoid visiting them. Would I need to maintain a separate male wardrobe just for those occasions? What if I ran into one of them at the grocery store as myself?

It just seems to be a very cumbersome way to live just to please someone else. After 60 years of doing that, I decided that I would no longer live my life according to the whims of others. For some, it may seem like what she is asking is a small compromise. I don't see it that way.

Again, this is just my narrow opinion. YMMV. 

Thank you for your thoughts Lori.

Chrissy

Quote from: Annaliese on June 02, 2025, 09:28:44 AMI would have to agree with you Lori on this. After so much progress and coming so far. I would see this compromise as a significant setback. I think it also could lead to some issues in the relationship as someone is not really accepting of the person's transition as they seem to say they are.
They are in MY opinion okay to accept the transition of the partner with exceptions. But the partner has no options but to accept or end it. How is this a healthy relationship. Again just my stance on the subject.

Annaliese,

Thank you for your thoughts on this.

Chrissy

In this situation, the MTF is thinking that it may be quite difficult to find a lasting relationship where the two of you would want to grow old together.  It is more likely more difficult for us who are transitioning. 

There are the concepts of gratefulness and contentment and compromise.

Who wants to grow old lonely?  Sure you can associate with others.  But that would not be the same. 

Thanks for your comments on this situation.