1) How come genetic girls have that distinctive walk? Is it become of some psyhcial thing, like the bones are positioned differently? Is it just noticeable because there is more fat around the hips? It is all mental?

2) How does voice femiznation work? Even if you do the training, isn't it going to return to normal unless you make an effort every time you speak?

3) Does you body hair "know" how long it is? I mean if not, how come leg hair doesn't grow as long as the hair on your head?

The only one I can knowledgeably answer is question 1 (I'm curious about 2 and 3 myself now) XD

Mostly it's to do with the bone structure and how the legs are angled. One of my tutor's at school whom is a very good life drawing teacher has had to explain it quite a bit to various students. The female hips are indeed a bit wider than males, the marjority of the width is primarily due to fat. However, the way the leg bones angle from the pelvis means they can get slightly 'knock-kneed' (that doesn't even look like a word to me) lol which I can tell you is quite annoying! (having female hips and all) So yes, because of this, if one doesn't walk a certain way, your knee's sometimes get in the way of eachother so you have to walk with a bit of a swing, the legs going out slightly then back in as your leg goes forward and you look like you're walking on a line.

One can of course exaggerate the amount one moves, which gives us the lovely view of swaying hips > *starts to watch women walk past*

When I started consciously walking more masculine (feet should width apart) I felt a little weird, like my legs had this massive gap between them, heh... but it's second nature now

(well I think I answered it correctly)

I think the walk is mostly the fat aka the center of gravity. I've known men with ample hips that walked like women.

Quote from: kestin on May 17, 2008, 07:53:29 PM
The only one I can knowledgeably answer is question 1 (I'm curious about 2 and 3 myself now) XD

2) The larynx is divided into two chambers, upper and lower.  Normally male voices use the large lower chamber to get a deep resonance.  When the lower chamber is closed off and only the upper is used, you get falsetto.  Instead of doing that, most voice training is to raise your pitch only three to four steps and modify your speaking style so it sounds more feminine.  Yes, you have to practice this until you do it without thinking about it.

3) Body and head hair grow differently than each other.  Body hair follows a cycle of growth, maturity, sloughing, and dormancy.  A hair will grow out for a certain period of time, stop growing, and some time later will fall out.  The follicle then rests before producing a new hair.  Thus the maximum length of a hair is determined by how fast it grows and how long until it stops growing.  Follicles tend to fall into three groups with each group cycling three weeks later than the previous one.  Head hair does not cycle like this and an individual hair may be attached to your head for years before getting pulled out or broken off.

Hmmm...as a female bodied person, yeah, the hips are different.  But some women exaggerate what is natural.  I don't swish.  I have a very controlled walk, but I can swish if I feel like it (rare) or if I'm wearing shoes that make me (like heels...that doesn't happen very often either).

All I can say is thank goodness body hair doesn't grow like hair on your head...that would be weird...

Quote from: Jaimey on May 21, 2008, 07:31:31 PM
All I can say is thank goodness body hair doesn't grow like hair on your head...that would be weird...

agreed
we would realy look like apes then

1) How come genetic girls have that distinctive walk? Is it become of some physical thing, like the bones are positioned differently? Is it just noticeable because there is more fat around the hips? It is all mental?

Just for a bit of clarity... I'm just pretty much expanding on what's been said.

The way girls walk is a product of the angle the femur enters the pelvic bone and balance. The hip bone of natal women, if you're looking at a pelvic cutaway from above looking down, angles (forgive me, I'm going off of memory here) pointing towards the anterior (front of the body) and inward (knees more acutely angled towards the centerline of the body). Or at least something to that affect. As a result, the legs swing "fore and aft" as they rotate around the knees, whereas men's legs swing parallel.

Women -- ( )

Men -- l l

Also, The wider a woman's hips the more her hips sway as a result of keeping equilibrium. Imagine a slender woman, both legs angled slightly inward and equal weight on both legs. Imagine removing one leg. The pelvis shifts toward the missing leg to keep weight centered on the body to balance on one leg. Now, imagine the same women with both legs, but offset her hips further from center line appearing as if she has much wider hips. Remove the same leg and the pelvis will shift further towards the centerline to maintain balance (wider sway).

2) How does voice feminization work? Even if you do the training, isn't it going to return to normal unless you make an effort every time you speak?

In a sense, yes. It becomes second nature to speak once properly trained but you are pushing your voice to it's uppermost physical limit. I always joke, when people ask me to sing now (I used to pre-transition), my voice only goes in one direction, and that's down.

3) Does you body hair "know" how long it is? I mean if not, how come leg hair doesn't grow as long as the hair on your head?

It doesn't "know" how long it is but the body is a tremendously complicated instrument. First, the body has different hair follicles than on the head. The body also gets subtly more cold when it has less hair (also factor in genetics). This can be illustrated when you shave your legs then immediately get goosebumps and you get the little pokeys. When you shave your legs, you're more susceptible to goosebumps. The pricklies is the result of the goodbumps urging those follicles to grow some hair. After a certain length, genetics and these senses factor in to tell your body that your body hair can growth can slow down a tad but it never stops completely, even when it's been dormant for a period of time. Does anyone have an old uncle or grandpa who's eyebrows are sasquatshingly long?! LoL   

Is it hard for a m2f to feminize the walk?

how can it be done?

It's like anything else... practice practice practice. Note posture, how the hips shift. Walk from the hips, not from the chest like guys do. Girls almost lead with their pelvis, whereas guys lead with their upper body.

I think arms are important as well as legs and hips.  I've changed my walk a lot in the more masculine direction by squaring my shoulders and making a conscious effort not to tuck my elbows in. 

I just wanted to add that you can use neck muscles to make your voice box smaller.  That gives you the same size and sound as a natural female.  Then raise the voice a couple of octaves.  I don't practice much but it comes natural when I need it.

Quote from: Lokaeign on May 23, 2008, 07:14:21 AM
I think arms are important as well as legs and hips.  I've changed my walk a lot in the more masculine direction by squaring my shoulders and making a conscious effort not to tuck my elbows in. 

Yes, I agree....arms and hands have a very important role in image. Best place to study walks and gestures is in the shopping mall, grab a place to sit and observe. For voice, a recorder and practice, practice and more practice. 

gina