Lynn,

I understand what you are saying, but do you have any good tips for doing that?

I used a telephone answering machine and listened to myself over and over and over.  I too discovered that it isn't just pitch that counts.  You can have a fairly low voice but sound completely feminine.

Listen to Martha Stewart.  Her range is that of many men.  But listen to her lilt and the vocabulary she uses... it's totally feminine.

Cindi

Quote from: Kristi on June 04, 2008, 08:21:03 PM
Lynn,

I understand what you are saying, but do you have any good tips for doing that?

The basics are actually posted earlier in this thread....  if you need additional assistance, just PM me 

Remember: There is definately more than one way to skin a cat--this is only how I did it.

I started with a deep voice. I sang professionally for a number of years so I knew how to control my voice. I used "Finding your female voice" for a month then saw a professional coach for maybe 6 or 7 hours (in about 6 or 7 sessions) but my voice was horribly male. I could "get lucky" every now and again but I couldn't sustain it. The first day I went out presenting as female, I met my BF, which thrust me into "fulltime." He didn't know at first so I was FORCED to use the voice I knew was correct (from practicing over and over), nonstop for weeks. Before I knew it, my voice couldn't "come down" anymore. When I tried, I sounded like a girl trying to sound like a boy.

So as weird as it sounds, the greatest tool to help me find my voice—my BF. I already knew "how to do it" with a few lucky sentences but I couldn't sustain it. Meeting my BF made me not relax into boy mode, AT ALL for weeks.

I'd also suggest a way of hearing yourself. Some have suggested an answering machine... anything! A recorder is invaluable. It's really the only way to know how you really sound. To this day, I think I sound weird in my head but my recorded voice sounds female. If I would've gauged my success by what I heard in my head, I NEVER would've gotten it right.

As far as voice transition goes, it was HARD! It was tiring. I remember crying at times because it was such constant effort. But in hindsight, I couldn't have asked for it to be any better. I personally don't think there's a way to get your voice perfect while having to "switch" from girl voice (when you're practicing), to boy voice (by day as to not arouse suspicion). I think doing that hinders your potential success, exponentially. Friends I've had who are going back and forth (while they gear up for full-time) are having huge difficulties. I couldn't sound perfectly male if I tried right now. I understand some need to go back and forth for personal reasons, but again, understand it just makes something inherently difficult at least a little more.

And again: record, record, record! I think I sound weird in my head and I'm not totally happy with my voice to this day (those are probably just my issues), but I do have to say I like how my voice has never been sir'd even once since going full-time and how friends and family say I have a nice voice. Everyone thinks I had some sort of voice surgery because it's such a night and day difference from how I used to talk. That's really cool. Oh, and my voice has gotten me "clocked" as GG by unfriendly transwomen--That's not so cool, but I guess it's kind of a compliment.


Posted on: June 05, 2008, 01:05:25 AM

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Quote from: LynnER on June 03, 2008, 04:20:32 PM
Learn to control your resonant harmonics and you will sound female, regardless of what pitch your voice hits....

Absolutely spot on. Once mastered, you can speak in your normal male pitch but once you switch to your female resonance, you'll  sound totally female.

Pitch is just not nearly as important as resonance.

Hi lacitychick, Well I never relay had a deep man's voice to start with, it was more like halfway between voice and I practiced some before I went full time it was not easy to keep it at constantly at a higher pitch but I passed anyway. I did ok until my voice began to get kind of raspy sounding like what you would get from someone who was a heavy smoker. Now I do have my voice where I kind f like, but as far as I know and with Wing Walkers assurance that I sound OK. Well I realy can't make up my mind on that one, especially as to what it sounds like to someone out there. As you say that we are our own worst critic.

I believe it would help for you training by yourself to find someone you trust to confide in and use them for a sounding board. The only problem with asking a mate for an opinion is that they have also come to get used to your voice and maybe not render a really accurate opinion.

Have a look at this video: 

I found it to be useful in voice training.  If there is one thing that can make your living in the world a bit rougher it is a masculine voice coming from a feminine person. 

I will end this post by saying that if you are a beginner, just starting full time, check into speech therapy to help develop your feminine voice to its maximum dependability and most pleasing sound.

Cindy

I might as well add my little story since it's a bit different.  I changed my voice through will power alone and did not practice.  Before I knew it I was getting ma'am'd on the phone, and by the time I transitioned I didn't know how to use the 'male' voice.  It changed over the course of one year.  (I am spiritual, but not religious.)

It may sound a little strange in my head when I am noticing it, but thats okay I've found.  I was speaking with a trans-friendly voice therapist the other day and she thought I was a natal female.  This was a bit of a pleasant surprise.

Whatever way you intend to change yours, just know that it is completely possible to have whatever you want - including a beautiful voice.

I was talking to a garage mechanic and he said ok madam!-I shrieked with joy when I put the phone down and scared my friends witless!-it was a real lift

Every little improvement, whether it be voice, appearance, mannerisms, and general passability, is probably the most gratifying experience you have ever had. Have you ever taken the time to think just how big a hurdle we have jumped? It's one that most regular folks out there would and do think it impossible.

Are you really a girl? You talk to someone on the phone and they call you ma'am, You go out and they call you ma'am. You have passed the test, your own test you have set for yourself. Think about it, it's a colossal accomplishment and the gratification that we have achieving it isn't exactly small, either. It's a whole entirely new life to explore.

Cindy

For me voice seems to have worked without effort or learning.

Guess it was just applying what I instinctively knew, and listening to how other women chose their words.

Guy's and dates have never been a problem .... I just talk & talk & talk and never seem to give myself away.

I was never comfortable trying to sound "male" as my voice was always rather high and unstable in pitch and my phrasing and word choice was always feminine, and I feel so much more relaxed addressing an audience as a woman (it used to border on a phobia).

Also I soon realised that I "passed" on the phone (without "introduction" or saying my name) when I was agitated, emotional, angry, exasperated, ringing to complain .... in other words when I was not self-conciously trying to sound feminine and more engrossed in saying what had to be said.  So many "calm down madam's", "sorry miss", "please dear ...."

Once I stopped feeling self concious about my telephone voice any problems dissapeared.

Think a lot of getting voice right is about confidence, and shedding inhibitions about using your voice in ways that you were conditioned was "wrong".

Laura x

Quote from: charlotteNH on May 27, 2008, 05:40:56 PM
My voice is all over my Vlog in my signature.

...and you sound great Charlotte!

Louise

Quote from: kirakero on June 05, 2008, 08:04:21 AM
I might as well add my little story since it's a bit different.  I changed my voice through will power alone and did not practice.  Before I knew it I was getting ma'am'd on the phone, and by the time I transitioned I didn't know how to use the 'male' voice.  It changed over the course of one year.  (I am spiritual, but not religious.)

It may sound a little strange in my head when I am noticing it, but thats okay I've found.  I was speaking with a trans-friendly voice therapist the other day and she thought I was a natal female.  This was a bit of a pleasant surprise.

Whatever way you intend to change yours, just know that it is completely possible to have whatever you want - including a beautiful voice.

As Bizarre as it sounds, i was the same....

I just never tried to change it, and it seemed to change as i transitioned and became more comfortable with myself.... weird as hell, but its great XD
R >

I don't know why so many people suggest "breathyness". That's
the best way to wreck your voice. A breathy voice is actually much
harder on the vocal cords than speaking in a full voice. Try whispering for
an hour and you'll see what I mean.

Also, just rellying on raising voice box for resonnance changes will not
give you an exact female resonnance and will also reduce your range
(since a rangy voice is a great part of what makes a difference between
males and females, that will be somewhat counterproductive).

A great deal of change to resonnance can be done in the mouth by tongue placement
and mouth opening. A flat forward tongue close to the teeth with a smile (smiling
reduces the length of the hair column above the larynx). The forward tongue placement
cuts the standing wave in the mouth increasing the harmonics of the resonnant frequency.

Keira,
I tried your suggestion about tongue placement and smiling. It really worked for me! I sounded the best I have ever sounded and much more natural. The smiling is important too. I see myself speaking in the mirror and even the way my mouth moves is much more feminine.
Thank you very much!

Maggie

I recommend a slight bit of breathyness... not total breathyness... I recommend it because it works, and because it works... you cant do just 1 thing to get the voice right...  I'm not saying you have to sound just like Marilyn Monroe, but to add just a touch of it... the majority of female voices <at least in English speaking countries> have a slight bit to them...

And to those whose voices came "naturally" I'm so glad you started HRT before your t production did perm damage to your vocal cords  > if only the rest of us were lucky enough to start HRT before the evil first puberty was over and done with.....

um?

i just tried speaking with 'breathyness' and i sound retarded... not more female....
R >

Just trying and learning how to do it right are two different things

But then again, different people get different ideas from the same words. *Shrugs*

its like people who think you have to lisp to sound like a girl! XD (sure if your 12 and have braces)
R >

Maralyn Monroe had full on breathyness.... thats overboard... but a slight amount does help if done right... It gives that last little bit of dimension... there are other things that can be done in its place, but most MtF's are not capable of them... and just describing the methods is difficult enough if you speak sound, it becomes nearly impossable if you dodnt....

A slight bit of breathyness shouldnt make you sound like your out of breath... at the most ittle cut the amount you can say on one breath by 1 word tops...

The very first thing that I did when I decided to move forward  was to start working on my voice and
it has been the slowest of anything to see progress so I may not be the best example. But
I think a little breathyness does help mine sound more feminine. I also think a high tongue and
adams apple helps. But everyones voice is different and I think you have to try different things and
decide what works for you.

Amanda