How could it not 'take'?  Since its a ritual, its done the same way almost every time.  Cannon law has long debated if a sacrament is still sacred if the priest is in a state of mortal sin and came to the conclusion that its about the faith of the receiver not the administrator.

Quote from: tekla on June 01, 2008, 12:59:02 PM
According to the Nicene Creed, adopted around 325 C.E., the basic tenants of the Christian Faith are as follows.  It is very specific about one, and only one, baptism.  A 'second baptism' would be considered new-fangled, and not part of the traditional Christian faith.

I agree that a 2nd baptism is non-liturgical.  However, renewing your baptismal vows is an accepted practice.  Starting your life as who you truly are may be acceptable grounds for such a renewal.

Quote from: pennyjane on May 26, 2008, 11:04:22 AM
being what He made me is not my sin, it is my redemption.  nature made my body, God made my spirit.  where there is conflict i assume it was God who got it right.  by subugating my will to the will of God's spirit i will grow closer to Him and to His will for me. 

That is a really interesting way to look at it, Pennyjane.  Worth some serious pondering indeed.  I love your story about not being ashamed!  And you are quite correct.  Presbyterians welcome all baptized Christians, so long as their baptism was done in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Chanunte, I agree.  What could be a more appropriate time for renewal of our vows?

When the Nicene Creed was accepted, the crucial issue was not just should baptism be performed one time.  Rather, it was even deeper.  The question had more to do with whether a Christian who has been baptized under one teacher, or bishop, or congregation, be required to be baptized to be part of another body.  It was a mobile society, not unlike present days.  Baptism was, and is, seen as one of the marks of entry into the visible church.  So the answer was, of course, no.  It is not the person administering the baptism that is important.  Rather, it is the work of the Holy Spirit in the baptized person's life.  Since that work is not based upon any one human, baptism is not only efficacious.  It is one of the things which unites all Christians from all times and places.

Kristi

What a beautiful story, Pennyjane!  Yes, you write and inspire hope in all of us.  Through your tragedy, the light of God shines through.  Thank you so much for sharing.

Kristi

Quote from: NickSister on March 10, 2008, 03:17:29 PM
Can you be baptised a second time to absolve you of your past sins? The first time you were baptised could you consider this a baptism under false pretences seeing as you were represented as the wrong gender? After transitioning could you be baptised again helping to remove any stigma of that transition in your churches eyes?

The basic premise that transsexuality is a sin seems wrong, regardless of the church.  You are not baptized to absolve you of the "sin" of diabetes, because diabetes is not considered a sin.

You are born as you are so there is no false pretense.   As a result no need for a second baptism.

I pondered that briefly when I started attending my church.  My own beliefs led me to the understanding that God recognizes me for who I am as spirit, not body.  And it was my spirit that was baptized not by body.

Kristi and Cindi, you have such a deep understanding of religion and spirituality and life.  If time and tide allow, I would like to attend service with both of you.

Thank you for your insight!

-Sandy

Quote from: Kassandra on June 02, 2008, 10:07:24 AM
Kristi and Cindi, you have such a deep understanding of religion and spirituality and life.  If time and tide allow, I would like to attend service with both of you.
-Sandy

Sandy,  you would find yourself very welcome and I would be honored.

Kristi

This thread brings to mind a verse from Galatians. (No, I didn't memorize it; I looked it up.)

Quote from: Galatians 3:27-28
For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Quote from: Alyssa M. on June 02, 2008, 09:43:12 PM
This thread brings to mind a verse from Galatians. (No, I didn't memorize it; I looked it up.)

Quote from: Galatians 3:27-28
For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Well said!

Chaunte

I might as well toss in my two cents about the Nicene Creed--
I was always under the impression that the part about "one baptism" had less to do with the number of times it was done and more to do with the fact that there was one church, one faith, and one way to be baptized, that is, in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. 
pennyjane, I'm very glad that you've found a good church that welcomes you.  I've just been outed to our priest at church-- my wife wants to see him for some marital counseling.  We'll see what happens.  I may be looking for a new church soon
Too bad that Indiana is such a long commute.  I'd consider going on Sunday. 

Quote from: pennyjane on June 04, 2008, 05:22:19 PM
i really hope that your priest is enlightened.

thanks, pennyjane.  I'm hoping so too.  His wife is a therapist/counselor of some kind, so I feel somewhat encouraged.  His initial response was that I should be seeing a therapist who specializes in gender identity issues, so I consider that an enormously positive sign.  My wife and I haven known this priest for a while now, so it would have been out of character for him to say anything else.  I have a way of working things up in my mind, at least initially so I was expecting, or at least preparing, for something along the lines of not being welcome at the church anymore.  I really didn't think that would be the response, but people are unpredictable if nothing else. 

Last year, as many of you know, I changed my legal name.  Because noone had ever made any kind of formal recognition of my transition, the leaders of Lutherans Concerned decided to do that at our fall leadership retreat.  So I went through the rite of transition at the chapel of the Cabrini Center in Chicago among my dearest friends.  There were more than 100 people present, an evening I will always remember.