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In the women's locker room

Started by joannatsf, March 18, 2008, 09:19:03 PM

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When a pre-op or non-op uses the women's locker room should she use the showers naked?

It's alright to shower but she should wear a bathing suit bottom
It's alright to shower but she should wear a bathing suit bottom
No.  While she has the right, it would make other women uncomfortable
No.  She should go home to wash up
I would feel too uncomfortable to remove my bottoms

Sheila

This is what I fought in my city. I thought that if the person had the ID of a female before surgery, then they should use the womans facility but in a place where they are in private. I got told why do they need an ID for the restroom? I don't think they need any ID for a restroom just a shower and locker room. I think in CA. they need to put some provisions in their ordinance. People still don't like co-ed showers.
Sheila
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joannatsf

Quote from: Sheila on March 20, 2008, 01:41:24 PM
This is what I fought in my city. I thought that if the person had the ID of a female before surgery, then they should use the womans facility but in a place where they are in private. I got told why do they need an ID for the restroom? I don't think they need any ID for a restroom just a shower and locker room. I think in CA. they need to put some provisions in their ordinance. People still don't like co-ed showers.
Sheila

So what kind prohibitions should we put in our law?  Who would be prohibited from doing what?  What should be the penalty for violating the law?
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Kir

Quote from: Claire de Lune on March 20, 2008, 04:01:37 PM
Quote from: Sheila on March 20, 2008, 01:41:24 PM
This is what I fought in my city. I thought that if the person had the ID of a female before surgery, then they should use the womans facility but in a place where they are in private. I got told why do they need an ID for the restroom? I don't think they need any ID for a restroom just a shower and locker room. I think in CA. they need to put some provisions in their ordinance. People still don't like co-ed showers.
Sheila

So what kind prohibitions should we put in our law?  Who would be prohibited from doing what?  What should be the penalty for violating the law?

This world needs less legal documents that know one understands but lawyers.

I say the problem is not with the laws at all. If coed shower is not comfy for people, then why not have shower stalls? Then it wouldn't matter one bit. Legally I say you should be able to have coed showers, and if people don't want coed, then they can have private stalls! Simple!
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Constance

Quote from: Sheila on March 20, 2008, 01:41:24 PM
People still don't like co-ed showers.
I prefer stalled showers, period.

I feel uncomfortable in a locker room even with other biological males.

Shana A

Quote from: Shades O'Grey on March 20, 2008, 04:56:39 PM
Quote from: Sheila on March 20, 2008, 01:41:24 PM
People still don't like co-ed showers.
I prefer stalled showers, period.

I feel uncomfortable in a locker room even with other biological males.

Also private showers for me! I flunked gym in HS because I didn't want to go into the locker room to change. I really couldn't see the point in even putting on the uniform if I was going to sit on the bench anyway. So I cut the class...

Z
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


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shanetastic

I beat you Zythyra,

I got a D :)

But I took it on credit/no credit hehe.

To stay on the topic though, I personally wouldn't choose to use the womens shower, especially nude if I were pre op.  Not only would that be awkward and very outing, but it would also freak everyone else out and could only cause more problems, whether it be legal or not.  Nothing wrong with going home to shower :) 
trying to live life one day at a time
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Kate

Quote from: shanetastic on March 20, 2008, 06:11:55 PM
I personally wouldn't choose to use the womens shower, especially nude if I were pre op...

Me neither. Along with making everyone uncomfy, it would be so incredibly, terribly humiliating :(

Somehow this reminds me of your self-acceptance thread... in the same way you COULD go out crossdressed, but it's not the point... I suppose you COULD go (pre-op) naked in the women's shower, but it's also not the point (for me).

~Kate~
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joannatsf

I finally joined the gym.  Today was the first time I went to use it.  I had the workout clothes on when I arrived so I just needed the locker to put my purse in.  I was really anxious about going in but went ahead and did it anyway.  Everything went fine.  I elected to go home to shower, of course.

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Mister

Quote from: Claire de Lune on July 06, 2008, 06:44:13 PM
I finally joined the gym.  Today was the first time I went to use it.  I had the workout clothes on when I arrived so I just needed the locker to put my purse in.  I was really anxious about going in but went ahead and did it anyway.  Everything went fine.  I elected to go home to shower, of course.



Hey Claire.

I also live in SF- which gym are you speaking of with trans friendly policies?  I'm not the public shower type (even if it were stalled, walled, lockable, whatever...) so wouldn't be running into issues using the men's locker room for that reason, but it'd still be nice to be somewhere friendly.
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Drik

I use the mens locker room :)
wouldnt shower tho >.>
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Hazumu

By 'naked' I assume it's meant that the situation is one of 'gang showers' where there is absolutely no privacy.  At the military base where I work, both the male and female locker rooms provide shower cubbies with a curtained space to change just outside the shower stall itself.

Both genders having this arrangement is unusual, architects and clients usually opting for the cheaper gang showers for the males and curtained stalls for the females, while a few cheap bastids will go with gang showers for both.

I used to have a janitorial business.  We had contracts to four healthclubs. All had curtained stalls for the women, two had them also for the men.

So I'd say that the idea behind the poll question is situational.

Is public nudity unavoidable (gang showers and rows of lockers and benches)?  Pre-op/non-op should be excluded.

Is there sufficient privacy (curtained shower stalls with changing areas)?  Barring other mitigating circumstances (but not prejudice or squeamishness), pre-ops and non-ops should be accomodated with the understanding they will make full use of available privacy screening when changing and showering.

And the regulatory pressure should be in the direction of accommodating -- not excluding -- transgenders from the start of RLT.  Make it easier to comply with that principle than to seek and employ loopholes to perpetuate discrimination.

As I was typing the last, I envisioned Christian Right groups building new health club facilities with gang showers and high school -style lockers with benches for the women's facility precisely to exclude transgenders from their midst.  I don't put it past them to lower the actual privacy an individual woman has just to maintain a discriminatory policy.

Okay, this has gotten goofy...

Karen
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joannatsf

Karen, though pre-op, I've had a legal change of gender.  I can do whatever I wish but choose to avoid embarrasment for myself or other women.
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Hazumu

Quote from: Claire de Lune on July 06, 2008, 08:41:59 PM
Karen, though pre-op, I've had a legal change of gender.  I can do whatever I wish but choose to avoid embarrasment for myself or other women.
Understood!  ;)  That's why I said if there's privacy, you should be able to use the facility appropriate to your gender.

If it weren't for the squeamish in our society, I'd say that pre-ops and non-ops can use the gang showers alongside other women.  But, I think we agree that if you stood there with your factory-stock configuration, somebody (prolly several somebodies) would pitch the mother of all hissy-fits.  So my suggestions are suggestions only, taking into account the lack of understanding present in today's society, and in no way an intentional move to discriminate against pre-ops and non-ops.

=K
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