Quote from: Elwood on August 24, 2008, 08:28:37 PM

Quote from: lisagurl on August 24, 2008, 08:25:51 PM

QuoteObama is the only one that is willing to support us. For that reason, and also education

An example of the average voter. Not concerned over the major issues only those that effect them.

Meh. I personally don't like McCain's policy on war and health care. Those issues affect everyone. Not to mention I don't want a mad man in office. McCain has a psychiatric medical history that is worth knowing about.

I hear he's just another warhawk. Being a warNUT would be better?

Me not into politics enough to make any kind of comment for or against what folks have discussed here but I would like to give Jenn a pat on the back. 

QuoteI thought he was too busy between the legs of other women!   

But in all seriousness, since I've been alive there's either been a Bush or a Clinton in Office.  Can we find someone better?  It's like two Monarchical families that just switch every 4-8 years.

Jenn

Cindy

Quote from: Emma on August 24, 2008, 10:04:39 PM

Quote from: lisagurl on August 24, 2008, 08:25:51 PM

QuoteObama is the only one that is willing to support us. For that reason, and also education

An example of the average voter. Not concerned over the major issues only those that effect them.

And what would you consider the major issues? The war? Well yes, I have an opinion over that too. >_>

There are major issues that can not be separated. The war is tied to the economy, homeland security, freedom and rights, religion, the basic way the government makes decisions, and other important concerns.

Immigration is tied to the economy, inflation, trade, taxes, enforcement of the law, morals, food supply, rights, homeland security, education, health care, and many other parts of American life.


You can not solve minor details of life with Federal rules. You can shape the major direction of the democracy but it requires unselfish educated voters that are well informed and willing to spend time understanding all the connections.

Our media's goal is to make a profit,  sorry to say they are not concerned with our founding father's dream of having the best society that humans could make.

Quote from: cindybc on August 25, 2008, 03:36:23 AM
Me not into politics enough to make any kind of comment for or against what folks have discussed here but I would like to give Jenn a pat on the back. 

Thanks Cindy.  I just wanted to add that if McSane wins, then we're going to have another 4 years of the Bush family, because he is like the step-child of that dynasty. 

On the other hand, Obama isn't experienced enough.  Choosing Biden as his VP shows that.

Choosing the so-called "lesser of two evils" is a mute point.  I have the right to vote, but I also have a choice.  Since neither one represents me, and both will screw us in the end anyway, I'm not going to vote.  I'm an activist at heart and a woman with strong beliefs, but it's hard to speak up when nobody's listening; it's like screaming at a wall.

Jenn

Quote from: lisagurl on August 24, 2008, 10:42:20 AM
Most are women

or womyn born womyn, possibly.

QuoteI'm an activist at heart and a woman with strong beliefs, but it's hard to speak up when nobody's listening; it's like screaming at a wall.

To speak you need to do a write in vote.

In my opinion, I just don't want to see another republican president.  If that happens our economy will crash harder than it did in the 20's, and I'm not sure we will be able to recover from it.  There just seems to be a trend, Republicans kill the economy, Democrats fix their screw ups......I mean there were exceptions, but for the most part this is the case.  I want to see our economy fixed so that I can afford to transition....I know that sounds selfish, but I need to be honest.

QuoteI'm an activist at heart and a woman with strong beliefs, but it's hard to speak up when nobody's listening; it's like screaming at a wall.

In response to this though, my friend has a shirt that has an american flag with a swastica for the stars.  It states "This is what happens when we don't vote."  If we don't vote, if we don't scream at a wall, then nothing will happen.  The people that have the most money who shouldn't be in politics representing us will just fulfill their own agenda.  In the end we get nothing because we didn't want to "Scream at a wall"

QuoteThere just seems to be a trend, Republicans kill the economy, Democrats fix their screw ups......

How do explain that Clinton pushed NAFTA? The economy is a product of consumption without ethics.

Quote from: lisagurl on August 25, 2008, 02:20:38 PM

QuoteThere just seems to be a trend, Republicans kill the economy, Democrats fix their screw ups......

How do explain that Clinton pushed NAFTA? The economy is a product of consumption without ethics.

Very true, but also during Clinton's presidency we had one of our largest economic growths ever.  Some bad things may have happened with a few laws here and there, but noone is perfect, and in my opinion the monica lewinsky was a non issue, people just needed gossip because most people are just that, gossips.  We had one of the lowest poverty and unemployment rates ever during his presidency, unlike during both of the Bush presidencies.  Forgot who said it before, but if its going to be a republican president, we need someone outside the Bush Cartel.

Quote from: fae_reborn on August 25, 2008, 11:16:38 AM
Choosing the so-called "lesser of two evils" is a mute point.  I have the right to vote, but I also have a choice.  Since neither one represents me, and both will screw us in the end anyway, I'm not going to vote.  I'm an activist at heart and a woman with strong beliefs, but it's hard to speak up when nobody's listening; it's like screaming at a wall.

Yeah, voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil.  Since the system can only last so long as people are convinced of its legitimacy, I think the best course of action is to just ignore the government wherever possible.

What if they held an election and nobody came?

Quote from: Nephie on August 25, 2008, 03:32:20 PM
What if they held an election and nobody came?

Then we'd likely get a continuation of the corporate regime that we've had.

Z

Quote from: Zythyra on August 25, 2008, 03:46:20 PM

Quote from: Nephie on August 25, 2008, 03:32:20 PM
What if they held an election and nobody came?

Then we'd likely get a continuation of the corporate regime that we've had.

Z

Probably somewhat worse. It would be a dictatorship and the people would be reduced to slaves.


The reason we are in the mess we are in now is because people do not take their voting responsibility seriously.

Quote from: lisagurl on August 25, 2008, 04:06:31 PM

Quote from: Zythyra on August 25, 2008, 03:46:20 PM

Quote from: Nephie on August 25, 2008, 03:32:20 PM
What if they held an election and nobody came?

Then we'd likely get a continuation of the corporate regime that we've had.

Z

Probably somewhat worse. It would be a dictatorship and the people would be reduced to slaves.


The reason we are in the mess we are in now is because people do not take their voting responsibility seriously.

I agree, too many people just vote party and not candidate.  My issue is this republican candidate will do the same things that every other Bush republican did, help the rich and screw the poor.  But people need to worry about the issues and not following the same party their parents did.  Its all brainwashing though, and it will likely never stop, parents forcing their views on their kids.

I was going to stay well away from this thread, but this is interesting:

Quote from: Nephie on August 25, 2008, 03:32:20 PM
What if they held an election and nobody came?

Wouldn't that leave the way clear for Nutjob McScrewball of the newly formed 'Deeply Unbalanced Armageddon-Mongerers And Squirrel Throwing Party' to announce they were running as an independent candidate and pay/bribe/threaten a few of their psychopathic acquaintances to vote them in?

The fewer people that vote, the less representative a government is... right? And even if you vote for the 'other guy', then doesn't that give your concerns more weight than if you don't vote at all?

There was a campaign run in the UK during election time, to increase turnout, and it was giving out the message that if you don't vote then you don't really have the right to complain. I can kind of see the logic in that. Not voting may be making a statement, but it won't stop one or the other getting elected.

Because if all but one person refuses to vote, as I said at the start, then that one person will still elect a government. There are rarely times when someone up for election is a perfect match for our views... but in that instance I personally think that choosing the one that tips the scales in your favour by virtue of having more policies that you agree with than the other... is better than saying nothing at all. Because then you have to hope those that do vote will do the right thing.

QuoteBecause then you have to hope those that do vote will do the right thing.

You must believe in Santa Clause also.

If you do not stand up and get counted you do not count. No one will take up for you as they already have there own agenda.

Having a say in who represents you allows you to voice the things that are important to you and your loved ones. Not voting means that you will not be represented, as those who do vote will force there needs on you and apply your tax dollars to their needs. People have died over the idea of taxes without representation, ever learn about the American Revolution. Not to mention that this country is secular it would not take many non voters to let a religion take the Government control and remove all transgender rights and outlaw transitions as with some other countries that do not have voting.

Hi Leiandra, your a lady after me own heart. "Hee, hee, hee." By the way, do you have red hair?

QuoteWouldn't that leave the way clear for Nutjob McScrewball of the newly formed 'Deeply Unbalanced Armageddon-Mongerers And Squirrel Throwing Party' to announce they were running as an independent candidate and pay/bribe/threaten a few of their psychopathic acquaintances to vote them in?

Cindy

Quote from: cindybc on August 25, 2008, 04:48:54 PM
Hi Leiandra, your a lady after me own heart. "Hee, hee, hee." By the way, do you have red hair?

*smiles* Um... no, I'm a brunette. Admittedly with the occasional desire to go jet black, lol.

Quote from: Nephie on August 25, 2008, 03:32:20 PM
Yeah, voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil.  Since the system can only last so long as people are convinced of its legitimacy, I think the best course of action is to just ignore the government wherever possible.

Well said Nephie!  I am fairly convinced that the system is broken, and that no amount of work will fix it; it's just too far gone.  The government is no longer legitimate, and I don't trust the government at all.

Quote from: lisagurl on August 25, 2008, 04:06:31 PM
The reason we are in the mess we are in now is because people do not take their voting responsibility seriously.

It's hard to take voting seriously when you can't take the candidates or the government seriously.  I mean, come on!  When you have mainstream media asking if Obama is "black enough," you know somethings very wrong.

All societies eventually reach a point where the governing body tries harder and harder to be the "voice" of the people, to gain power and control, and said society just collapses and crumbles in the end.  Troy. Ancient Egypt. The Roman Empire. Nazi Germany. USSR. etc. etc...in the end, YOU have to become your own representative, and you can't rely on some governing body to look out for you and your rights.

Jenn

QuoteWhen you have mainstream media asking if Obama is "black enough," you know somethings very wrong.

Yes something is terribly wrong with main stream media. That does not mean the candidate is wrong.

We have let the media which is controlled by big money make us believe that we have no power.  The truth is we have the power to destroy the cooperate bullies. The unions did it in the past. Accepting defeat is what happened in Germany before WWII and why no one challenged Hitler even though the knew he was wrong.

Posted on: August 25, 2008, 08:20:33 PM

---

Nixon was brought down by a public that knew the war was wrong.

In all honesty, if we give up hope on our system, then it is truly dead.  If you never try because your afraid to fail, then you will always fail because you never tried.