For some reason, there's a strong sense of deja vu here...hmm...

To me, androgyne just sounds prettier.    Honestly, it's all about your personal tastes.  I've gotten more comfortable with genderqueer just because no one understands "androgyne" when I say it.  I always tell them it's like "genderqueer" and they seem to get it (those "in the know" anyway). 

Quote from: Andra on December 29, 2008, 12:45:02 PM
The vast majority of people in western culture are binary identified.  Being non-binary therefore fits the definition of odd.

But I've never heard it used in a good way.  My grandmother would say something's queer meaning it was strange, but it didn't have a good connotation.    Again, I think it's all a matter of semantics and personal tastes anyway.

In New Zealand where I live I have heard among queer youth workers that there is a movement to reclaim the word queer as something positive. I think this is a good thing. I would say I am genderqueer in that I am an androgyne. Gender queer for me just means different from the binary genders and does not actually describe what I am.

I'm all about reclaiming.

I feel the use of "queer" does more than describe me personally, it says to the world that being different is ok. Let's face it, our genders are different. Avoiding the word "queer" is like saying we don't think being different is ok, or it's only ok in private.

I like the word queer, I think you can wear it with pride. Makes me feel like part of something bigger.

Quote from: Nicky on January 04, 2009, 08:25:22 PM
I like the word queer, I think you can wear it with pride. Makes me feel like part of something bigger.

True. There are millions of queer people but it's hard to find an androgynous/genderqueer person.

Quote from: Ephilei on January 04, 2009, 08:28:45 PM

Quote from: Nicky on January 04, 2009, 08:25:22 PM
I like the word queer, I think you can wear it with pride. Makes me feel like part of something bigger.

True. There are millions of queer people but it's hard to find an androgynous/genderqueer person.

I agree with the part of something bigger but the gay comunity seem to have claimed this for themselves in the same way that GLBT groups are mostly GL only I have yet to find a genderqueer person in RL except me

Quote from: Kinkly on January 06, 2009, 08:52:12 PM


I agree with the part of something bigger but the gay comunity seem to have claimed this for themselves in the same way that GLBT groups are mostly GL only I have yet to find a genderqueer person in RL except me

I'm pretty sure "queer" is an open word. I find it hard to imagine a gay or lesbian will ever feel bothered when I call myself queer.  The more people identify with a symbol, the more the symbol looses stigma. It's the total opposite of elite. Christians have used the same stradegy with "Jesus freak." It used to be an insult, but now (or least in the 90s) being a Jesus freak was a label of pride.

Do you know any androgynes in real life? I don't, but I know a half dozen genderqueer people.

in my search I've found groups of binary transexuals and crossdressers and one self proclaimed "pangendered woman" but she was a freak and got kicked out of the group for asking new members for sexual favers.

kinkly, i know a person IRL who identifies as androgynous genderqueer.  he goes by both he and she with other people and refers to himself with gender neutral pronouns.  he also has a beard.  and wears womens clothing.   hes really pretty too!

just the other day his facebook status was "im the cute girl in the corner with the beard"

I know a cute girl with a beard but she wouldn't be caught dead in a corner.

Quote from: Ephilei on December 27, 2008, 01:54:36 PM
I'm surprised to see the category androgyne used so prominently on these threads. I've never met someone who said they are androgynous tho I've met lots of genderqueers.

What's the difference? Is there a difference? I have my idea, but it sounds like people here use it more loosely.

I always thought "androgyne" indicated a sort of gender-neutral status, neither one nor the other, but either, or perceptible as either. Please feel free to correct me on this.

Anyway, I like "genderqueer" because it doesn't declare anything at all — only that my gender is queer, different, in some way, without specifying how.

Quote from: Pneumonica on December 29, 2008, 03:49:23 AM
I've never heard the word "queer" used for positive connotation.  Even when used by self-described "queers"

For me it's a positive term — and it doesn't just mean gay/lesbian anymore; it includes (potentially) anyone for whom vanilla heterosexuality doesn't apply, but again without saying how. I'm queer not gay.

But I might take offence if it's used in the wrong way, such as when preceded by "you f***ing..." 

Quote from: jenalex on January 11, 2009, 11:06:22 AM

Quote from: Ephilei on December 27, 2008, 01:54:36 PM
I'm surprised to see the category androgyne used so prominently on these threads. I've never met someone who said they are androgynous tho I've met lots of genderqueers.

What's the difference? Is there a difference? I have my idea, but it sounds like people here use it more loosely.

I always thought "androgyne" indicated a sort of gender-neutral status, neither one nor the other, but either, or perceptible as either. Please feel free to correct me on this.

Anyway, I like "genderqueer" because it doesn't declare anything at all — only that my gender is queer, different, in some way, without specifying how.

Me too. But many times I don't look androgynous which is one reason androgyne doesn't fit me.

I have a beard and mostly wear women's clothing. I don't think anyone would call me cute or a girl, tho.

Quote from: Ephilei on January 11, 2009, 11:43:25 AM
Me too. But many times I don't look androgynous which is one reason androgyne doesn't fit me.

One can be an androgyne (internal sense of gender) without necessarily having an androgynous presentation (external expression of gender).

Z

You all run in different circles than I. I have met glt people, but no one has identified to me as either androgyne or genderqueer--nor has it come up in conversation.

Nor do I know what I am. People who know me, call me weird, but weird is not a category here.

People tell me: "Be good" or "Stay out of trouble", to which I reply I don't try to make trouble; it just comes naturally--like when I open my mouth. So carry on. You were probably doing better while my attention was consumed elsewhere.

S

it's you. your here 

Quote from: Pica Pica on January 11, 2009, 03:59:32 PM
it's you. your here 

Here is a relative term. I didn't see you this morning when I was clearing snow off my car this morning. A quick check indicates the temperature in London now, and for the coming week, is well above freezing. Not so for those of us in NEW England.

Nonetheless, I made it online today, and am flattered you noticed.

S

Quote from: Simone Louise on January 11, 2009, 04:18:29 PM

Quote from: Pica Pica on January 11, 2009, 03:59:32 PM
it's you. your here 

Here is a relative term. I didn't see you this morning when I was clearing snow off my car this morning. A quick check indicates the temperature in London now, and for the coming week, is well above freezing. Not so for those of us in NEW England.

Nonetheless, I made it online today, and am flattered you noticed.

S

I noticed too. 

Quote from: Nero on January 11, 2009, 04:22:49 PM

Quote from: Simone Louise on January 11, 2009, 04:18:29 PM

Quote from: Pica Pica on January 11, 2009, 03:59:32 PM
it's you. your here 

Here is a relative term. I didn't see you this morning when I was clearing snow off my car this morning. A quick check indicates the temperature in London now, and for the coming week, is well above freezing. Not so for those of us in NEW England.

Nonetheless, I made it online today, and am flattered you noticed.

S

I noticed too. 

I'm going offline now to take a shower.

S

Quote from: Simone Louise on January 11, 2009, 03:55:53 PM
You all run in different circles than I. I have met glt people, but no one has identified to me as either androgyne or genderqueer--nor has it come up in conversation.

Nor do I know what I am. People who know me, call me weird, but weird is not a category here.

People tell me: "Be good" or "Stay out of trouble", to which I reply I don't try to make trouble; it just comes naturally--like when I open my mouth. So carry on. You were probably doing better while my attention was consumed elsewhere.

S

That's the best kind of trouble, when you create it without even trying 

Z