Something I have observed is that after a person works their identity out and becomes congruent within themselves then often you don't really get these swings of feeling.

For example, a man that was born a physical boy probably never says to themselves "I feel particularly manly today" though they might say I am particularly good looking today, or I feel particularly strong today. Similarly for a FtM who has become 'comfortable' in their identity they probably feel the same way. What ever they feel is just them the man.

When I was figuring out my androgyne self I used to have huge swings between feeling feminine and not feminine. It was almost like my internal self was waving flags to get my attention. Now days I seem to be more homogenous. Now that it is all mostly smoothly integrated with my conscious self I don't often feel these swings. I just am. It could be akin to teenagers working out who they are and doing extreme things in their youth "I'm so gothic".

I've become homogenous now too.

I think the word people are reaching for is identity rather than feel.

I have identified as male and as female.

Anyone remember Count Homogenous? It was about a vampire-like person that drunk milk.

Maybe it was a weird New Zealand thing 

The show would be something like 25 years old.

Alright, i'll take a rough, clumsy swing at this.

Feeling "male" or feeling "female" really has to do with A) what i'm admiring at the moment (a chainsaw at home depot, or something female like a dress or jewelry, and B) how i'm feeling at the moment, like one of the boys (rarely), or perhaps as a female that I wish I could be. It also encompasses C) wishing that I was a woman (body dysphoria), or being OK with my existing plumbing. Also, there is D) which has to do with who i'm comfortable around. Generally i'm not comfortable around men, but i'm much more comfortable around women.

For me these feelings ebb and flow, so i'd guess that i'm gender fluid.

That's the best I can explain it.

Quote from: Rebis on January 14, 2009, 07:40:39 PM
I've become homogenous now too.

You identify as milk? 

Z

Quote from: Zythyra on January 14, 2009, 08:19:13 PM

Quote from: Rebis on January 14, 2009, 07:40:39 PM
I've become homogenous now too.

You identify as milk? 

Z

NICE.

There is a Garbage song that goes something like that

"I am milk,
I am red top kitchen
I am cool
as cool as the deep blue ocean"

Quote from: Nero on January 08, 2009, 02:45:17 AM
What Josh said. When I first came out to myself as ftm, I was leery of types who called themselves 'ftm' but not 'man'. But now I realize you can be on the transmasculine spectrum without identifying as a man.

I would say anyone who has surgery or HRT is pretty much ftm for all intents and purposes, but their identity can still be androgyne.
In short, yes it's possible to be both.

I sometimes wonder if my brain is a little androgyne, and that the body type I want is female. The parts of my mind that are, "What I want," Sometimes DO contradict what I perceive myself to be... Maybe thats the source of confusion?

You almost have to wonder what middle stages of evolution feel like about themselves... Like a mutation that caused less body hair in a human. Or the first whitey Crackers. Must be the same contradicting thoughts we're feeling...


I mean. Its awkward I guess...

Quote from: Zythyra on January 14, 2009, 08:19:13 PM

Quote from: Rebis on January 14, 2009, 07:40:39 PM
I've become homogenous now too.

You identify as milk? 

Z

pasteurized?

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 14, 2009, 08:39:55 PM

I sometimes wonder if my brain is a little androgyne, and that the body type I want is female.

I can relate to this. I don't really feel like either gender, however I'd much rather my body were female than male.

Z

Quote from: Zythyra on January 14, 2009, 08:50:27 PM

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 14, 2009, 08:39:55 PM

I sometimes wonder if my brain is a little androgyne, and that the body type I want is female.

I can relate to this. I don't really feel like either gender, however I'd much rather my body were female than male.

Z

Same here. The difference seems to be intensity of dysphoria, or maybe just a slightly different shade of identity?

I think I have used phrases like feeling female or feeling male in the past. I guess in those circumstances, I was typing lazily. What I should have posted was that there are times when I feel more comfortable in masculine roles than feminine ones and vice versa, as these roles are defined by the society in which I live. That's how I experience being androgyne/gender fluid.

Quote from: Nicky on January 14, 2009, 08:58:19 PM

Quote from: Zythyra on January 14, 2009, 08:50:27 PM

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 14, 2009, 08:39:55 PM

I sometimes wonder if my brain is a little androgyne, and that the body type I want is female.

I can relate to this. I don't really feel like either gender, however I'd much rather my body were female than male.

Z

Same here. The difference seems to be intensity of dysphoria, or maybe just a slightly different shade of identity?

Yeah. Basically. If the female were silver, and the male were gold, I'd feel mostly silver with a few impurities. I guess the question is whether or not I should just give in to that nature or to aspire to be what I want. I feel MOSTLY female... I'm just such a freak I sometimes wonder if its possible to ever feel normal as anything...

I wonder the same thing sometimes.
Does the pain ever really stop? I hope so.

Kara, I don't think you're a freak. If you look at biological females, and biologically males (by which I mean those with the same identity as the gender of their birth), you'll see that many are not entirely masculine or entirely feminine. Most lean toward female or male (depending on what they were born), but will still have some "in between" moments.



-Merrick

Quote from: Merrick on January 15, 2009, 07:25:29 AM
Kara, I don't think you're a freak. If you look at biological females, and biologically males (by which I mean those with the same identity as the gender of their birth), you'll see that many are not entirely masculine or entirely feminine. Most lean toward female or male (depending on what they were born), but will still have some "in between" moments.



-Merrick

I appreciate that, but I must be... When I try hanging out with more than one genetic girl, I'm instantly socially invisible, and I can never be on the same wavelength, and they don't seem to believe I can be either, and its really frustrating to not only click with them, or click with most groups of males. Its like the second I get into a social situation with more than one, even the geeky ones, I'm instantly almost disregarded... I'm starting to think people only hang out with me because they pity me or some crap. I also have a really morbid, self-destructive brain. There's just... Something genetic girls have that I don't. A lot of its their upbringing, and I know that... But there is so much else I sense Is off, especially when I hang out with one. Female to males (if they aren't like... Trying to be Brad Pitt the Trucker) are often easy to hang out and communicate with, but tomboyish people... Even if they are extremely so make me feel really incomplete with social/mannerisms/quirks/mindset. Its a mindset. It really is. I don't know, it kind of depresses me whenever I go out with people.

So you say people lean to different sides, even if they are biological male or female, and I agree. I just don't think that most people can lean completely if they were raised a certain way, and had ovaries and stuff. There are probably just some things in their essence that I might never have, and they might never be able to turn off... Its like my self image after years of having this stupid skin-vehicle. Its like Pimp your ride, only its hormones... Cause the car I started off with is really mediocre by comparison... I'm just giving it like... Pink hubcaps or something in this analogy. Some people will see the pink and go, "Oh! Girl Car!" And others will see the exhaust pipe that shoots out black smoke and the mud stains, and engine, and go, "Boy car? What the hell?!"

...
...
-_-'

Quote from: Zythyra on January 14, 2009, 08:19:13 PM

Quote from: Rebis on January 14, 2009, 07:40:39 PM
I've become homogenous now too.

You identify as milk? 

Z

Not only milk, but sometimes cream and even cheese.
I'm dairy fluid.   

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 14, 2009, 10:20:53 PM
Yeah. Basically. If the female were silver, and the male were gold, I'd feel mostly silver with a few impurities. I guess the question is whether or not I should just give in to that nature or to aspire to be what I want. I feel MOSTLY female... I'm just such a freak I sometimes wonder if its possible to ever feel normal as anything...

You're young. Someday you'll feel normal as yourself.  Some of us take longer to get there (find ourselves). It's human nature.

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 15, 2009, 07:43:05 AM
Its like the second I get into a social situation with more than one, even the geeky ones, I'm instantly almost disregarded... I'm starting to think people only hang out with me because they pity me or some crap. I also have a really morbid, self-destructive brain.

Most likely, they really like you. You are not accepting that they may just like you.  It took me years to realize people like me. It doesn't matter why. Once you learn to accept it at face value, it feels good.

Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 15, 2009, 07:43:05 AM
Its like my self image after years of having this stupid skin-vehicle. Its like Pimp your ride, only its hormones... Cause the car I started off with is really mediocre by comparison... I'm just giving it like... Pink hubcaps or something in this analogy. Some people will see the pink and go, "Oh! Girl Car!" And others will see the exhaust pipe that shoots out black smoke and the mud stains, and engine, and go, "Boy car? What the hell?!"

...
...
-_-'

You might want to find another way to phrase that.  If we ever meet, I will be afraid to stand behind you.   

Quote from: Rebis on January 15, 2009, 08:13:13 AM
Not only milk, but sometimes cream and even cheese.
I'm dairy fluid.   

Something in the whey sie moves.....