Right, I don't know how explain this, so I'll just dive right on in there.

I have these "fantasies" in my head, right. But they're more than that. I know the backstories of all the characters involved, I imagine stuff they did, take on their roles in imaginary conversations/situations with their friends, relatives, etc. (None of whom exist.)

Okay, so I sound crazy.
But I do know it's not real and all. I don't see or hear them or any really weird stuff, just to be clear.

Now, one of these characters is me, sorta. A male version of me. Well, he started transitioning at 18, so he's becoming more detached from me, in a way... When I was younger, going through gender identity issues in a big way, I always assumed that I would be transitioning at 18, and would become this person. But that's not what happened.
So, this other me, my alter-ego, as he is now, co-exists with me, in a way.
In situations I think, man, if Steve (rockin' name, yeah) were here right now, he would say...

See, as a girl, I'm so annoyingly shy, and devoid of real personality, when socialising irl.
People have to know me for a couple of years for me to be myself in front of them. But this "myself" is still not up to the standards of Steve, nowhere near as funny or generally as good company...

So maybe, I'm not gender dysphoric, I just have an imagined, idealised version of myself in my head, who just so happens to be male.

SO, would it be wise to actually attempt to "become" this person?
Because I reckon that, were I to transition, I would actually be much the same as I am now, just more ostracised and made fun of. I may end up more shy and boring than now.


I know I'll be advised to see a therapist here, but I'd rather not.
I've had counselling before, and I hated it, it wasn't at all helpful.
Well, it may just have been the particular counsellor I had.
I may has well have prodded a dead cat with a stick.
Useless woman.

Anyway... yeah.
This is just a rambling musing, I don't know what the hell I'm talking about really.

Maybe this imaginary self is a coping mechanism for GID. We all find some kind of coping mechanism to deal.

If you should try to 'become' Steve? I don't know. How do you feel about transition in general? What made you decide at first it wasn't for you?
Steve could just be the 'bigender' way of coping with androgyne dysphoria.
Or you could be one who needs to transition.

It's not strange or crazy to have a bit of an alter ego. It sounds like you're very creative and have a lot of stories in your head. It's actually very similar to what I have going on in my head. If you want to do more than just thinking about this character then maybe you can find outlets for it. Writing, drawing, or if you want to sort of "become" your character there's always drag. You don't have to transition to explore this side of you. There are many other options.

I agree.  Not crazy at all.  I do that all the time, to be honest.  For me, it's helpful.  Seeing these characters and feeling what they feel helps me become more confident in who I am.  I think all of the characters we create (my are male also ) are fragments of ourselves.  I write.  That's my outlet.  I also think it is a form of dissociation.  If you can project pain or other things onto a character, you can separate it from yourself.  And if you can feel their joy, it makes you joyful as well.

You're totally normal. 

Hi Blueflare Imagination? No nothing wrong with imagination, actually it can be a good escape at times when thing get to chaotic in RL. I used much imagination in the years before I began to transition, it became a good tool  in allowing me to truly see the truth about who resided within.

I have some writings you may find interesting to read in my Blog if you wish to read them.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,46231.0.html

Cindy

I'm always Cindy in my dreams.
I once was told and I'm sure I will be backed up somewhere, is that you do not understand a language until you dream in it. I think it's the same with gender. There was also another comment from a therapist, and again its a common one. What sex are you when you have self sex, are you a guy, are you a girl, are you both. Many GGs go both ways, so I'm told. I never do, I'm always the female. Very rarely do I have fantasies about being with other women.  I'm usually being romanced and loved. In fact it's all about romance and very rarely anything physical. I think guys tend to go the other way, physcical rather than romance.

Cindy James

Just another possiblity to consider. You could be bigendered, or house a multiplicity in that head of yours. Steve could be a distinct persona, with their own needs and wants and personality. It might be worth looking online and chatting with other bigenders or people with 'multiple personalities'. It could be that Steve is the one suffering from GID rather than 'yourself'.

I've talked to other bigenders before (two distinct personas in one body), and they often switch who takes control depending on the situation. For example Steve sounds like he is a great dude to have at parties and could take the lead role in those situations. Some multiplicities even have different circles of friends for each persona. Working with your other 'selves' creates a constructive multiplicity which can work really well and does not need to be debilitating. It might be you won't need to transition if you are dominant, but there may need to be some compromise for Steves sake.

Just and idea, could it be a possibility? Try sitting down and having a chat with steve, see what he thinks. You may not need to become Steve, you could be both Steve and yourself at once.

Check out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigender

There is a section on the bottom regarding healthy multiplicities.

Your custom title even fits my theory,  one of you is the GG androgyne, and the other is the non transitioning FtM.

Hey thanks everyone.

Interesting idea that I could be both...
I read that wiki link, and then got on to the page on multiple personalities stuff...
One of the other characters, Izzy, has always featured prominently in stuff, though I never thought of her as being me in any way, just a feminine character to take an edge off all the maleness lol...

But yeah this is all interesting, I will give it some thought...

Years ago I had an alter ego called Ben. When I was chatting online as him I knew it wasn't real but I was so invested in the lie that it felt real if that makes sense xD I had two msn clients running at once and was both the "real" me and my persona at once, with different friends on each list. I had a blog and everything, of his daily life, that never actually happened. Seems insane when I look back, now I can't even lie about taking the last cookie or something.

I was also Ben as much as possible when I socialised, if I met somebody new I'd introduce myself as Ben (I looked like a boy before puberty properly took it's toll at around age 13) - most of the neighbourhood kids I hung out with just thought I was a this boy. Then the kids at school knew me as a shy awkward girl who had no friends.

I always felt SO much more confident and made a hell of a lot more friends in the male persona, the female me was really quiet and withdrawn and barely spoke.

When I figured out all the trans stuff the outgoing guy broke out pretty much immediately, only now it's actually me and not some elaborate story I made up.

Quote from: Jeatyn on March 26, 2009, 09:50:56 AM
Years ago I had an alter ego called Ben. When I was chatting online as him I knew it wasn't real but I was so invested in the lie that it felt real if that makes sense xD I had two msn clients running at once and was both the "real" me and my persona at once, with different friends on each list. I had a blog and everything, of his daily life, that never actually happened. Seems insane when I look back, now I can't even lie about taking the last cookie or something.

I was also Ben as much as possible when I socialised, if I met somebody new I'd introduce myself as Ben (I looked like a boy before puberty properly took it's toll at around age 13) - most of the neighbourhood kids I hung out with just thought I was a this boy. Then the kids at school knew me as a shy awkward girl who had no friends.

I always felt SO much more confident and made a hell of a lot more friends in the male persona, the female me was really quiet and withdrawn and barely spoke.

When I figured out all the trans stuff the outgoing guy broke out pretty much immediately, only now it's actually me and not some elaborate story I made up.

This sounds exactly like my situation, except I didn't actually introduce myself as a guy in person while I still thought this guy inside me was just my alter ego.

The "alter ego" started out as a character on a roleplaying website, where the people I roleplayed with were really great online friends of mine. They knew I was biologically female, but I started talking to other people as Michael, without telling them he was "just a character." It was this situation that caused me to really question my gender identity, and come out to myself. I kept the name because I met some really amazing people who had gotten to know me as Michael, and I felt comfortable with the name. For awhile, it made me feel weird to be so directly connected to that "character," but I've realized he was me all along.

The idea that the idealized version of yourself "just so happens to be male" doesn't seem quite as coincidental to me as you're making it sound, but only you can figure out your identity. I won't presume anything.

Quote from: gravitysrainbow on March 26, 2009, 10:13:09 PM
This sounds exactly like my situation, except I didn't actually introduce myself as a guy in person while I still thought this guy inside me was just my alter ego.

The "alter ego" started out as a character on a roleplaying website, where the people I roleplayed with were really great online friends of mine. They knew I was biologically female, but I started talking to other people as Michael, without telling them he was "just a character." It was this situation that caused me to really question my gender identity, and come out to myself. I kept the name because I met some really amazing people who had gotten to know me as Michael, and I felt comfortable with the name. For awhile, it made me feel weird to be so directly connected to that "character," but I've realized he was me all along.

The idea that the idealized version of yourself "just so happens to be male" doesn't seem quite as coincidental to me as you're making it sound, but only you can figure out your identity. I won't presume anything.

I have done stuff like this too, I used to play an online game under an androgynous nickname, and presumably from the way I type and such, everyone just assumed I was male, and I never corrected them. I let it develop, we had a forum where we'd sometimes discuss things other than the game, and I'd make stuff up a fair bit. I've done this on a couple of other forums too. I even pretended that Steve had a girlfriend once (she was entirely fictitious) but I refered to her in posts...

Hmm, may indeed not be co-incidence...

Counselling can be OK. Depends on the counsellor really and I've had some rubbish ones in my time.

Personally I'm not a big fan of Gender Therapists et al, they sometimes can't see the wood for the trees as being a human is more than just about trans issues.

My present counsellor is fantastic and always makes me laugh. She's an intelligent lady and senior lecturer in psychology at a large UK university, her speciality is psycho-sexual which is cool.

This may be out of line, but I wonder how comparable tg fantasies and dysphoria are to .. let's say some deformed girl who fantasizes about being a beautiful princess. Theorizing, I'd say it's possible that it's closely similar, but.. the tg ones probably more potent. .. But I dunno, I could be convinced easily otherwise(that they're completely different) depending on someone who's seen both cases.

i would say for one thing, if you've got characters with backgrounds, you are in enviable place for a writer. i'd suggest that you start putting them into stories.

um, quiet girls are extremely charming; that's not a shortcoming, but a benefit.

lastly, and hardest for me to explain, is that the inner self is far more valuable to one than the external self that the world perceives. i believe that the difficulties you are explaining here are actually just gradual attempts to discover your inner self -- a vast, quiet, powerhouse of a personality with depth, playfulness, and wisdom. all people possess this core personality, i think. but, it seems to me, very few attempt to get to know her/him.

-ell

Quote from: ell on March 27, 2009, 04:05:15 PM
i would say for one thing, if you've got characters with backgrounds, you are in enviable place for a writer. i'd suggest that you start putting them into stories.

um, quiet girls are extremely charming; that's not a shortcoming, but a benefit.

lastly, and hardest for me to explain, is that the inner self is far more valuable to one than the external self that the world perceives. i believe that the difficulties your are explaining here are actually just gradual attempts to discover your inner self -- a vast, quiet, powerhouse of a personality with depth, playfulness, and wisdom. all people possess this core personality, i think. but, it seems to me, very few attempt to get to know her/him.

-ell

That last point hits it right on the head, once people realise this, it changes their lives and the lives of those around them.

The subject of alter-egos and personalities is a very interesting one, and I have a friend who's philosophized alot about it.
I'll agree with Ell, since alot of the time, the way the world perceives us tends to reflect how they want to see us, and not how we truly feel..  How you feel inside yourself is what's valuable; how can anything else define who you are?
..Fantasies aren't necessarily you.. but it usually reflects how you feel.